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Slimebeast on 21 February 2010
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MontanaHatchet said:
Slimebeast said:
MontanaHatchet said:
Slimebeast said:
MontanaHatchet said:
This isn't a Swedish problem so much as a European problem. Europe has gone for so long without any form of immigration or racial and ethnic mixing. Now that you have people coming in from the Middle East, Africa, and South-East Asia (who are primarily Muslim), you have serious problems with integration. And I'm not worried. A similar thing has happened countless times in the United States, with "white flight" (white people leaving a major city or area after it became "too black."). And Slimebeast, what the hell man? You've shown this kind of racism and intolerance before, stop it. You're like the Europeans on Youtube that put up hate speech videos and blame all of Europe's problems on immigration.

Now hopefully I didn't offend anyone either.

It's not wrong to be against immigration.

Can you please be more civilized and not equate my expressed views with "hate speech"?

If you are positive towards mass immigration that's up to you. I hate it. Respect my opinion and use intelligent argumentation instead of shutting me up.

I did use intelligent arguments, you've just failed to provide a rebuttal. And how could you be against immigration? Birth rates are so low in Sweden that if you guys don't allow immigration, your country will collapse. But I'm sure you know that, right?

That's not a serious method to open up for discussion, throwing out ungrounded accusements like that.

But okay.

You think it's okay that the consequences of mass immigration is, for example, that Jews, perfectly fine citizens, have to leave their homes or even their country? Ahh, but it's just like white flight, no biggie.

The birth rate comment doesn't need a rebuttal because it's so ridiculous and false. Basically it's the same as saying that Japan actually will collapse (for anyone who might not know, Japan has a zero immigration policy and very low birth rates).

No, it's because I've seen you make comments like those before, and it's one of the reasons you have somewhat of a moderation history. Now while I don't approve of immigrants bullying perfectly innocent people who live in a nation, that doesn't mean you should deny immigrants completely. I'll give you an example. Let's say you have a city where there are 10,000 Muslims, 5,000 Jews, and 100,000 people of other religions (mostly Christian). Now, let's say that 1,000 of those Muslims go around and bully the Jewish residents. Would you really deny the other 9,000 Muslims the right to live there, and/or tell them to leave? Of course not. And that's what we're dealing with here. I'm just saying that there have been similar things that have happened in the United States, and that people who were afraid or persecuted moved to other areas (usually suburban). There are still plenty of other regions in Sweden that have very few immigrants, if that's what someone is looking for. And by the way, your Japan rebuttal made me laugh. You mean that the nation that's facing cripping economic and demographic problems, that's up to its eyeballs in debt, and is on the verge of collapse is the best example you could come up with? Besides, I'm not saying that the demographics are a problem now. Much of Europe still has a sizable working population that can support stable economies. But let's take Japan as an example again. By 2050, 1/3 people in Japan will be 65 years or older. How do you think they'll sustain their country with such a population? The answer is that they won't. Same with much of Europe, including Sweden. Whether you like it or not, your country and many others need immigration for various regions. How you deal with the consequences of failure in integration is entirely up to your politicians (who are doing SUCH A GOOD JOB).

Of course yes. I like your example because it's a core thing of the immigration issue. Simply since we can't separate the wheat from the chaff (is that the right saying?), we actually, unfortunately, have to deny entry to the 9,000 innocent people if the 1,000 do too much damage.*

Japan has a stagnating economy, but they're doing just fine. I believe they have a bright future with their current policies. The need of immigration is a big myth used for strategic & political reasons, although immigration can be very beneficial under the right circumstances and conditions.


*EDIT: obviously I don't mean to kick the innocent people out if they're already here, but the principle should be used when you decide about the size of immigration.