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By the way, if Shift is messed up, then what was involved with Simbin has now blown it in the console arena? Developers from Simbin went over to EA to work on Shift. I saw that RacePro was bashed as horrible, and now Shift is. Simbin racing games were considered top notch. Is it that they just don't know how to make good racing games, or is it that PC gamers don't know what good racing games are?