Zero Punction on Bioshock

[PlagueOfLocust]

twesterm said:

PlagueOfLocust said:

 

"Need" and "want", "could use" or "would really like" are two distinct things. You could make it through the game with no Adam if you're willing... this undermines the concept for you? The CHOICE to do such a thing highlights the fact that it is, indeed, a choice that affects the game. You sure as hell won't get the same experience with no Adam as someone who has it does.

And the word "gimmick" is just a way of adding negative connotation to what you could just as easily refer to an interesting and unique element of the game. It's not a gimmick when it's the core concept of the design.

 First off, gimmicks are often the cornerstone of design.  I really don't know why you think it's negative or why you would think it doesn't have anything to do with design.  The fact that we're having this conversation means they did a great job of disguising the "choice" of this game.  Like I said, smoke and mirrors.

As for the need or want of Adam, that's like playing FFXII and just doing licenses differently to play characters differently.  Yes, it affects things slightly, but it does nothing to change the game.   I could go through the game getting only bare essential licenses or I could get everything but it does nothing to affect the flow, base gameplay, or story of the game.  The same goes with the adam for the most part.  I can harvest every little sister or just rescue one and leave the rest alone and the only thing that will really change is the ending cut scene.  I may feel like that choice affected everything in the game, but it doesn't and that's the genius behind this game.

Not having any, or having significantly less Adam, affects the combat far more than you're giving it (it doesn't effect the base gameplay? I sure hope not, or else we're talking about playing an entirely different game). And the combat IS the gameplay... everything else contributes to it as far as gameplay goes. They could have been braver and given you even less Adam for rescuing the girls, but apparently even that wouldn't do it for you considering you're put-off by the fact that you can simply choose to leave all the girls alone... and stunt the potential of the combat.

But the problem here is that you seem to think the choice NEEDS to affect every aspect of the game to be in some way ligitimate. It doesn't. Is there room for improvement in the artistic medium of gaming even after Bioshock? That would be true no matter how the game had turned out. The point I'm arguing from is that you can nit-pick the game's issues until you turn blue, but it's a damn shame when its clear that the team behind this game bled right into the code to work hard and make good design choices and this is all we can afford them. A "eh... good... but if I made it I would have done blah blah..." Then make that game, I say.

And the word gimmick clearly has negative connotations. I don't feel like I need to back that statement up any further. And again, using the word "disguising" suggests that what they did was somehow a lesser thing. They were not aiming to revolutionize the gameplay concept of "choices". They sought to deliver a game that combined a lot of different, great design ideas into one game, blending them together well enough that the game did not feel like it was pushing any one "gimmick" but rather carefully balancing many things at once in a way that feels natural. Again, the experience trumps the parts that make it up here.