Nintendo Bias

[Sqrl]

I'm not questioning why Killzone 3 was banned. Benkenobi had every right to ban him, as he was pretty much flaming an entire fanbase. However, I beleive that if some of the things were taking care of before hand, it wouldn't have got so bad.

Well the part I was referring to was your questioning why others weren't banned. If you understand why they weren't when KZ3 was then I'm not sure why this issue was brought up as we would then see eye to eye on it.

Mods posting their opinions is fine. They have every right to do so. You're right about trolling, and how posting a viewpoint contrary is not trolling at all. Those pictures, however, were indeed trolling, as they fit your discription of trolling like a glove. They were insulting, rude, and just plain uncalled for. To expect someone not to get upset over those pics is a bit foolish. Imagine what would happen if I posted a thread about 1up's madden reveiw, then went on posting pics about the game being bad. There would have been a uproar of Nintendo fans flamming me and calling 1up bias. Hell, I'm called a troll just for thinking Heavenly Sword is better then Metriod. See for youself: http://vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=6347 This is trolling, but what memebers were doing in the Lair thread isn't? There's clearly a double standard here. Shams was allowed to post his opinion, which was the exact thing I did. You also have people claiming Heavenly Sword is a 0/10 game, yet this is somehow not trolling with my post being a troll post.

The only reason I disagree with the pictures being "outright" trolling is because of the context of the thread. Context is extremely important. IIRC every post up to that point was pretty much a carbon copy of "Awe shucks I was really hoping the other reviewers were wrong but it seems like this is confirmation". If someone was vigorously defending the game and the pics were posted then yes its trolling but in a thread topic where everybody is pretty much in agreement the game is going to be bad I don't see the issue with it.

As far as 1Up's Madden review again it all has to do with context. In the case of madden I think a lot of Wii owners realize that like the PS3 we got screwed by EA this year. I wouldn't take a slamming of madden Wii as anything but a slam to EA for shoddy work. But in general if your comments aren't directed at a person and aren't mocking someone's viewpoint then there should not be a problem.

Your example is actually a great one because you quoted shams and twisted his words to mean the complete opposite as a direct responce to him. That moves it into the category of trollish, sorry to say. You were mocking shams point to make your own. Personally I would just ignore it unless you had taken it another step, but I can see how people would take exception to it. Posting and saying you feel like it should of been higher because you thought it was better than MP3 would be fine, but once again its all about how you do it.

Edit: To be fair shams post you were responding to was a bit off-topic.  And your post specifically is a particularly tough shade of gray to judge.  Its the first part that changes the entire tone of the post for me.  And thats part of the problem I think is that a lot of this is so subjective that its very hard to find any agreement. 

AllAll expessed his opinions very poorly. However, this doesn't mean that they are not valid. I really think him, myself and other members have a point when it comes to there being a double standard here. AllAll just didn't go about it the right way, which is probably why he's banned right now. Lets be honest, Sqrl, the mods are not without their flaws, and I think that this is one of them.

See I disagree with the bolded part. In my book if you can't come in and make the point civily then you don't really deserve consideration. Just to be clear I am saying a flamer/troll's opinion is not valid. The point they were trying to make may very well of been valid but due to the way they approach it I refuse to give them consideration because to do so is to validate their methods.

On the double standard issue, I have yet to see an example of clear cut double standard. What I have seen is people expressing their opinions get flamed and thats why I was stressing the opinion=/=trolling point. I think Ben and Shams are more inclined to agree with Wii owners but I have not seen an instance where two people were clearly flaming away and only one of them got a ban.

Let me stress this to the absolute maximum just to make sure it is understood. If you are being trolled/flamed/insulted by a Wii fan under no circumstances respond in kind. Allowing him to continue to make an ass of himself only helps solidify your viewpoint and further show that its the Wii fan causing the issue. Then if nothing is done you have a clear cut case and I would gladly back you up on it. Simply do not engage in it. It is really that simple.

Those pictures didn't contribte the theard at all. Instead they did nothing but get memebers worked up. I don't think that the pictures were ban worthy, but they should have been deleted and memebrs should have been told not to post them. Things like that do nothing but cause problems for memebers and people who were exicted for this game. You can't honestly expect people not to get worked up over those pics. If it were the other way around and someone did that in the nintendo forum, there would have been plenty flames.

See this is where you have to realize there is a conflict on the pictures. I do agree they weren't needed, but the mods have a constant battle they fight between being censors and being good mods and when the vast majority of the thread is ok with the pictures it is very hard for them to say they have to go.

But more than that consider the the fact that a mod is not in every thread all the time constantly hitting refresh. So as a mod if you get into that thread late and you see a few people have posted pictures and a page later everything explodes with the picture posters being flamed. Which action are you going to consider more severe? The posting of a picture or active flaming? The point is its very easy to play monday morning QB but the mods aren't always able to read every post in every thread. Often times they are coming into threads late and checking the last 10 or so posts to make sure all is well. So if you have an issue with a post then report it to make sure a mod sees it and reads it.

 

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Honestly this is a pretty cumbersome debate, and if its all the same to you I would much rather cut it down to the meat of the issue. I will let you set the agenda, so whatever points or issues you feel most important to your argument highlight them and lets cut out some of less important stuff.