OK you PC guys, I just don't get why mouse/keyboard FPS is such a big deal.

[vlad321]

Grey Acumen said:

vlad321 said:

1) I mentioned the aiming again solely because you started bring up aiming and other crap which you bitch about all the time. I call it irony.

2) There is a good reason pros turn it off, and believe me, they get more than enough "practice."

3)/facepalm Now you are implying that the reticule will magically be stuck on the guy nomatter in which way you mvoe without your interaction? I  believe what you are refering to is auto-aim here.

4) OK look, guy number 1 is in the middle of your scren and you are shooting at him, in both cases you are shooting at him, let's assume 120 degree vision. Let's put the 2nd guy at the very edge then. When they both shoot at you at the same time there is no middle ground for dodging while still keeping the first in your center. If you are dodging the 2nd guy and the 1st there doesn't exist a 100% strafe efficiency, the best angle you would be able to get on either one at the same time would be 75 degrees, a very very insignificant benefit in terms of degrees in general. With WASD you have 90 degrees on the one you are shooting and 60 degrees on the 2nd guys. A 15 degree difference is nothing, not with the hitboxes that player models have. In both cases a miss equates to one game step.

5) I read what you said abuot the PS2 controller and the problem remains the exact same as before. On the analog the only input control is your thumb and that's it. With the WASD you have 3 fingers. Even if you move one for 10ms you can still maneuver around with the other 2, you are only cutting your movement input by 33%. Now with your analog, not only does it take longer to do your combos, but you are also taking away 100% of the movement input while doing it. And I cann't properly attack your 9 button analog controller unless you link me a picture, as it stands I really don't see how you'd be able to use all 9 buttons and the analog without twisting your arm in funky ways.

1) I'll possibly give you this point, possibly.

2) Fine, I don't particularly care, since it doesn't change how easy it is to adjust for on the Wii controls, which is what this point was about in the first place

3) Uh, no, I thought it was kinda obvious that i would still be aiming with mouse/Wiimote as I did this. Why would you feel this needs autoaim? I just call it "keep pointing wherever the enemy is" because the analog isn't limited to 90 degree increments, I can basically "strafe" in any direction, regardless of which direction I'm facing. No matter where I aim, I can simply roll the analog stick so that I'm still strafing in the exact same direction.

4) That's great an all, but I'd still rather strafe the guy NOT getting shot at, instead of strafing the guy who has to dance around in order to keep from getting shot by me. on top of that, you're still basically admitting that the advantage is there, but you're trying to trivialize it, and I don't see the point. If you can say 10ms is the difference between making the shot and not making it, I could just as easily say that 15 degrees can be the difference between not getting shot and getting shot.

5) and yes, it seriously bugs me that I can't find a pic of this either, for the moment though, imagine an ergonomic mouse that is built for left handed people. It won't do mouse actions though, it's basically to rest your hand on. Where that groove to rest your thumb is, it has an analog stick and the whole controller is raised up at a slight angle so that your thumb won't hit the table, where you'd normally have left right and middle click, you instead have 3-4 rows of buttons for your fingers to rest on. Hitting the furthest out keys is only a matter of extending your fingers, hitting the closest in ones merely needs curling your fingers, and the middle row just has your fingers normal. I don't know if the analog stick could also be pressed as a button, but either way, that negates the hotkey issue and drops it back down to purely "analog vs wasd" which is what the whole thread was about to begin with.

 

1) done

2) The problem here is whole you are adjusting your analog in tandem with the aiming and you make the slightest error with the IR pointer, wavering hand, sibling yells, whatever, and you fall of the edge and have to start it all again. I also still fail to see why you would want to be looking around and walking when there is no pressing need to be doing so. If you want to look, then stop and look, you don't need to be moving to do such stuff.

3) I feel like there's a miscommunication here. If you mean you will be strafing in any direction, not just 90 degrees, then I don't see why you are doing that, you can keep your reticule on the target just fine while strafing with a WASD, effectively running circles around them.

4) Of course I'm trivializing it, even for UT2004 an angle of 15 degrees is inconsequential unless they are right up in your face, and that game is damn fast, possibily fastest FPS out there. If we were talking twice that, say 30 degrees, then that would actually have a very noticable effect. If you want look at it as percentages. the main guy is at 90 degrees (up from 75) the other is now at 60 (down from 75). The loss is a grand total of 20%. Meanwhile 20ms is twice as slow as 10ms.

5) Ok I can pitcture the keys part but I really can't grasp the analog stick. Is it set in the X,Z place or the X,Y plane (the game's plane), because if it's in X,Z then all those maneuvers you've been describing, like little perfect adjustments while aiming and all that become needlessly difficult.