OK you PC guys, I just don't get why mouse/keyboard FPS is such a big deal.

[vlad321]

Grey Acumen said:

vlad321 said:

I made a nice little summation post right under the previous one if you cared to look at the broad picture but alright.

1) I did not mention the Mouse anywhere here. I think you are starting to imagine things. And you wan't a controller that allows you to walk at different speeds also? I really want to know what FPS you are having in mind for this elaborate range of speeds that you keep talking about.

2) It's called mouse acceleration and any game turns has an option for it and it's off by default. It hampers accuracy by being very unpredictable in hectic situations. I grew up on the goold old Nintendo consoles so it's not liek I haven't been playing console games at all, I've been holding a controller longer than I've had a KBD under my fingertips. With such amazing steady, untiring hands you should think of becoming a surgeon. The reason why I'm calling you out is because even our resident pro Halo player on campus can't pull off a straight line while looking around nonstop, if he can't I find it hard to believe you can.

3)Are you saying that with an analog you won't lose your target without aim correction when you strafe?

1/4) You do realize that 2nd guy is moving as well and won't just be hitting you from the smae angle right? Without being able to see both of them at the same time you will have a hard time dodging any attacks from the 2nd guy unless you know the terrain well enough. You would be strafing at 100% efficiency, but that will last for about a total of half a second before the 2nd guy moves and you are  strafing as inefficiently as before.

5)Onyxmeth brought up the issue of hotkeys feeling the same on the KBD thus causing him to mess up the hotkeys. Also the speed at which you change weapons is VERY important, honestly, did you look at the Half-Life video in this thread at ALL? You gotta switch to a splash weapon when you know the person is right around the corner, a little delay and you won't hit him. In those 10 ms he could easily have gotten out of the AOE damage of the grenade/rocket/whatever. Big impact. Also same goes for hitscan weapons. Sometimes you have that very brief window of opportunity and if you delay in switching to you weaponn you lose it.

You are also right, pressing a keyboard button is far far superior than pressing controller buttons. With the WASD I have a total of 7 keys (excluding WASD) which are right under my fingertips and I can press them the very moment my brain gives the command to do so. Even without practice you reach KBD buttons quicker than you would on a controller. Considering you are holding the controller somehow you use most of your fingers for that, and the only buttons you can quickly press are the ones right under your fingers, for the other ones you have to do a very slow shuffling and finger moving to reach (assuming other keys do exist, where are you gonna stick mor keys on a nunchuck). I really hope you don't mean the same thumb with which you are controlling your character because that would mean loss of control for the time it takes you to shift your thumb off the stick, to the button, and back. This is the biggest advantage of the KBD over an analog and it's what sets it above it considering the fact that all else is equal. Better, faster control over your game.

1) I mentioned the mouse cause you keep mentioning it everywhere else. i just didn't feel like giving it it's own number, and your arguments have constantly shifted between "Mouse" and "we don't NEED 360 degrees of motion" and "cause I don't NEED it" isn't an argument about the one you use being better than the other. If anything, it implies that the one in question is better, not the one you have.

2) I've never had issue with it. Apparently that's one of those "practice" issue where you're better with whichever one you practice on.

3) Yes, certainly when compared to attempting the same thign with WASD keys

4) but in the meantime, the 1st guy is still getting shot, not just shooting at you unhindered, and if the second guy starts to get out of sight, you can always break off shooting at the first guy, but that's still more than you've accomplished with just strafing both and not shooting at all or shooting between them.

5) honestly, the quality of the video sucked. Furthermore, I think it's retarded to just instantly switch weapons anyway, I'm not using this as an argument against your hotkeys, I'm just saying that I perfer games where changing weapons actually requires some time involved, since, y'know you'd have to put one weapon away and take teh other weapon out in order to use it, rather than having them instantly dematerialize and rematerialize in your hand. Actually my real argument to yoru hotkeys issue is that there are analog controls that allow your fingers to rest on 9 buttons, which would still allow you plenty of hotkeys while getting rid of teh WASD setup.
Also, your turn for reading comprehension: I said that with the PS2 contorller alone,you can reach the dpad just as fast by rolling the thumb as you can shifting your fingers from WASD, provided you've put in as much practice. I dunno where you got teh idea that I was saying hotkeys are far better on the keyboard than what can be done on a controller designed around analog, unless you were running on the 10ms vs 20 ms comment, and even then, I was saying 20ms for TWO button presses on the Dpad in order to give more hotkey options.

 

 

1) I mentioned the aiming again solely because you started bring up aiming and other crap which you bitch about all the time. I call it irony.

2) There is a good reason pros turn it off, and believe me, they get more than enough "practice."

3)/facepalm Now you are implying that the reticule will magically be stuck on the guy nomatter in which way you mvoe without your interaction? I  believe what you are refering to is auto-aim here.

4) OK look, guy number 1 is in the middle of your scren and you are shooting at him, in both cases you are shooting at him, let's assume 120 degree vision. Let's put the 2nd guy at the very edge then. When they both shoot at you at the same time there is no middle ground for dodging while still keeping the first in your center. If you are dodging the 2nd guy and the 1st there doesn't exist a 100% strafe efficiency, the best angle you would be able to get on either one at the same time would be 75 degrees, a very very insignificant benefit in terms of degrees in general. With WASD you have 90 degrees on the one you are shooting and 60 degrees on the 2nd guys. A 15 degree difference is nothing, not with the hitboxes that player models have. In both cases a miss equates to one game step.

5) I read what you said abuot the PS2 controller and the problem remains the exact same as before. On the analog the only input control is your thumb and that's it. With the WASD you have 3 fingers. Even if you move one for 10ms you can still maneuver around with the other 2, you are only cutting your movement input by 33%. Now with your analog, not only does it take longer to do your combos, but you are also taking away 100% of the movement input while doing it. And I cann't properly attack your 9 button analog controller unless you link me a picture, as it stands I really don't see how you'd be able to use all 9 buttons and the analog without twisting your arm in funky ways.