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Forums - Gaming Discussion - How bout dat Blizzard!? UPDATE: Blizzard responds with "China isn't involved please believe us!"

 

Will you boycott Blizzard?

Yes 46 63.01%
 
No 21 28.77%
 
See Results 6 8.22%
 
Total:73
vivster said:
It was definitely blown way out of proportion but I'm happy that it did. It's both a middle finger to Blizzard and a great highlight to the situation in HK and the overall situation with China in the world.

I followed it from the start since Hearthstone is the only Blizzard game I ever played and I visit the reddit daily. I very much feel with the people in HK so it's extra hard to play Hearthstone right now. It'll probably lead me to stop giving Blizzard money, though. Not that one should need a scandal like this to be motivated do so.

It's the same w/me and Overwatch. I've played it religiously (minus some like 2-3 week breaks here or there) since close to its launch in 2016 and find it very fun and innovative, so it's really tough for me to stop playing - especially since I was looking forward to playing handheld on the Switch & with a couple of friends who I couldn't play w/before on XBL. So I'll probably still play again eventually but I'm definitely taking a long break as I have a significant backlog of stuff sitting on the shelves and other games I still need to get like Astral Chain. And yeah, with the few Blizzard-related stuff I do get, I'm definitely buying "used" from them from now on. XD

Azzanation said:

Mate you simply don't get it. If you choose to blame video games by boycotting them over outside politic issues than that's a personal problem that needs to be voiced outside the gaming industry. Yes, you are blaming the good games by boycotting them and the good staff behind the hard work.

Blizzard are the ones with the "personal problem." This is a problem of basic human decency. 

If someone wants to use a brand to voice his opinion without the brands consent than that's there issue simple as that. Use the internet if they had a brain, its not that hard.

You have gone off your radar again here by thinking Blizzard is all for communism just because they are following the laws in Honk Kong. They are a business that wants to stay relevant. I don't blame them for acting up because Honk Kong most likely has a gun to there head saying punish or be banished from our country. Businesses care about making money and if majority of money comes from a country than id expect any brand to do what Blizzard did. Should I boycott the Mitsubishi brand because they made the Japanese Airplanes that slaughter many US Navy crew at Pearl Harbor? No I don't. Should I Boycott German Car makers because they made German tanks that helped slaughter majority of the world? No I don't.  

Well if that's really all it takes, then Blizzard should take the hit and be banned in the country. That's on China, not Blizzard. They didn't need China to become the empire they've become. Why do they need them now? The point isn't merely that they're doing business in China, it's that they are ACTIVELY supporting (and indeed engaging in) censorship at the whim of an oppressive regime. DIFFERENCE.

End of the day someone brought it to Blizzard, Blizzard isn't exactly going out hunting gamers for there freedom of speech, they punished a guy at there ESport for throwing there name into a warzone they probably don't want to be in. Good to see Blizzard is refunding the guy his rightfully earnt prise money so good on them.

The incest law was an example which again went over your head. If we allow anyone to speak up at any major events without any concsent from major brands than that means anyone can simple do it about anything. I don't want random cultist or Regilous people interrupting my shows and events to say they are right. Sorry I am not in for it and I wont be part of it. Gaming is a relaxing medium for some of us and I much rather it stay that way. 

Yeah no, it didn't go over my head at all. I understand perfectly clear what you're talking about and it's asinine. A young man expressing support for fellow citizens to not be silenced, oppressed, beaten, and even shot is nowhere near equivalent to "cultist" or even "religious" people expressing controversial or divisive rhetoric. The leaps of these "comparisons" you're making is utterly absurd. How you can remotely equate the 2 is beyond me.. HARMLESS free speech (which is what this was) should always be allowed.

Boycott Blizzard games, take it out on quality games, but I will say this, If Valve came out and supported the Nazi's and managed to make Half Life 3, I will be buying Half Life 3 and I could care less what political views they take. That does not make me Nazi. If you don't like my opinion you and any others can simply deal with it. I am all against Hong Kong for there actions taking place but bringing this up at Esports is simply stupid in my opinion.

Again, an astronomical and absurd leap in this "comparison.." Did you pull a muscle in making that stretch?

EDIT: There are some good people working at Blizzard that is against this behaviour so Boycotting the games those devs make, is a logically choice by you? I don't get it. You rather throw out there hard work, nice. That's why boycotting makes no sense to me because multi-billion dollar business blame the sales of there products on there internal staff like those good employees that don't want to get involved in the drama and just want to make a living are now the ones getting punished by that logic.

The first time you've come remotely close to making a semi-fair point: but this is the responsibility of the corporate heads of Blizzard. They're responsible and accountable for their employees and the blowback that comes from foolish decisions.  At the end of the day if their bottom line suffers, it's on them, and I'd wager most of the employees understand this. Employees are free to speak up, or go along with it, or outright leave - same scenario for ANY corporation who's struggling financially.

Last edited by DarthMetalliCube - on 14 October 2019

 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden

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DarthMetalliCube said: 

My replies are in Italic

Blizzard are the ones with the "personal problem." This is a problem of basic human decency. 

Regardless what the topic is about, the point is a person broke the rules at the show. As much as you would hate to admit this but Chung is the offender here, his the one that brought it up, not Blizzard, Blizzard are the ones retilating as its agasint the rules. People are upset because those upset obviouslly have picked sides.

Well if that's really all it takes, then Blizzard should take the hit and be banned in the country. That's on China, not Blizzard. They didn't need China to become the empire they've become. Why do they need them now? The point isn't merely that they're doing business in China, it's that they are ACTIVELY supporting (and indeed engaging in) censorship at the whim of an oppressive regime. DIFFERENCE.

So Blizzard are going out finding these people and censoring them? Wasnt it Blizzards show? Wasnt it Blizzards game being played? Didnt the guy come to Blizzard not the other way around? I heard a US streamer also spoke up not long after and Blizzard didnt do a thing about that protester because he didnt speak up at a Blizzard event and broke the rules. I will try to find the article.

China has over 620m players compared to the US's 166m players. Blizzard has a huge following in China. The fact you choose to ignore this bothers me.. They are a business and will follow the rules of that country to sell in that country. But you didn't answer my question, should I have boycotted German cars or Japanese brands for those involved in WW1 and WW2? Because boycotting Blizzard games sounds exactly the same.

Yeah no, it didn't go over my head at all. I understand perfectly clear what you're talking about and it's asinine. A young man expressing support for fellow citizens to not be silenced, oppressed, beaten, and even shot is nowhere near equivalent to "cultist" or even "religious" people expressing controversial or divisive rhetoric. The leaps of these "comparisons" you're making is utterly absurd. How you can remotely equate the 2 is beyond me.. HARMLESS free speech (which is what this was) should always be allowed.

Did this guy have no other choice? Was he trying to escape a prison? Did he need to bring up a sensitive topic at an event not calling for it? He broke the rules of the show and penalties would be paid. Harmless free speech? You honestly think the Chinese goverment sees this as harmless free speech? Serious question.

Quote "any act that, in Blizzard's sole discretion, brings you into public disrepute, offends a portion or group of the public, or otherwise damages Blizzard."

Chung broke these rules at the show, he put himself in public disrepute, offendered a portion or a group of the public and has damaged Blizzard.

Again, an astronomical and absurd leap in this "comparison.." Did you pull a muscle in making that stretch?

Far from, I am speaking hypothetically. I would assume you would know that. I am talking as a whole, not trying to decide which is a worst case scenario. But I stand by my statement. I would buy the Devils game if he made a good game. Sin me.

The first time you've come remotely close to making a semi-fair point: but this is the responsibility of the corporate heads of Blizzard. They're responsible and accountable for their employees and the blowback that comes from foolish decisions.  At the end of the day if their bottom line suffers, it's on them, and I'd wager most of the employees understand this. Employees are free to speak up, or go along with it, or outright leave - same scenario for ANY corporation who's struggling financially.

Companies are not a one man show, these decisions probably came from half a dozan members at Blizzard however taking it out on the other 100+ employees that have nothing to do with this event baffles me.

Activisions CEO is worth over $7b and the brand Activision Blizzard would be valued close to $20b+. You think boycotting games is going to affect Hong Kongs decision? You think Activison Blizzard are going to be affected? Well unless you boycott in the millions its not going to make a difference. If anything all you are doing is affecting those talented devs making those great Blizzard games. Activison Blizzard will see the sales decline as more as an unappealing product rather than boycotts and will sack the staff behind those games and simply just rehire more staff and try again.

Boycotting to me is like a baby spitting the dummy, its like watching a sore loser football fan rip up his club membership at a game. Its an immature way to gain attention and it barely works. All you are doing is affecting those at a company which have no part in this. If you want to gain Blizzards attention than harass them by protesting at there HQ, send hated emails, but by simply boycotting quality products? Does shit all, and i dispise those who actually think that works.

Blizzard are already changing there ways and its not because all 44 of you deleted your accounts, its becasue people are in there faces, downplaying the brand's decision and there is an actual protest at Blizzards HQ.

Source of my info: https://www.engadget.com/2019/10/09/blizzard-hong-kong-ban-blitzchung-china-mei-protest-2019/

Also i want to make this clear with you, i am all agasint Hong Kong's decisions and i wish the protesters the best of luck in all of this becasue losing lives and ruining people is never a good thing. However acting at a games event is something i am not a fan of and Boycotting games to me is simply childish and achieves nothing. No need for us to affect more peoples lives because of this.

Last edited by Azzanation - on 15 October 2019

Libara said:

Show me where I said anything about unification?

I have a question for you ... 

Do you unconditionally support the dissolution of unions in general such as the EU and do you recognize China's sovereignty over Hong Kong ? 



Just expect the worst coming. A much bigger, large scale Tiananmen Square 2.0 is coming. The ones who can still leave HK leave it now. A lot of businessmen are leaving HK afraid of CCP and setting themselves and their businesses in free Taiwan since the protests began.



fatslob-:O said:
Libara said:

Show me where I said anything about unification?

I have a question for you ... 

Do you unconditionally support the dissolution of unions in general such as the EU and do you recognize China's sovereignty over Hong Kong ? 

Why should I answer your question when you have yet to answer mine?



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Lonely_Dolphin said:
Zoombael said:

I can make "excuses", since its up to Blizzard how to handle a situation. Have never heard the term "house rules". It is their decision how to react. As i said, it seems they exercise liniency, avoid further escalation and... its wrong again. And as i also said, it doesnt matter what they do, it is always wrong in the eyes of some.

You hear or read what you want to hear/read to feed your trendy hyprocrisy. A complex subject such as this isnt really meant to be discussed with irrational, selfrighteous dicks.

"It is their decision how to react" so everything they do is just automatically correct and justified because... they're Blizzard. Yep your defense will forever remain laughably terrible for the reasons I have already gone over.

Oh snap you didn't deny it, just waffled and threw out baseless insults. I take it you really have no morality then. Combined with your continued willful ignorance of key points and information, I'm not gonna respond to ya no more.

There it is again. The arbitrary interpretation of my words. The same level of ignorance the polar bear displayed. From the very beginning you and others spew accusations  against others of basically being against human rights movement, basically supporting the chin. communist Party in what they're doing to the people of China. Ohyea, thats nothing compared to my baseless insults. Where did i say everything would be automatically justified in my eyes? It just so happens that i agree with their actions in this particular case. You dont. I can justify my position. You cant. It would be a different story if the banned player participated in the protest outside any blizzard event and they would ve took action. Then it would be a clear case cut.

Apperantely, many of you wannabe rebels arent aware of what is at stake.

Deployment of either PLA troops from their various barracks in the territory — or their People’s Armed Police counterparts now camped out just across the border in southern Guangdong province — could end Hong Kong as the world has known it since it was seized by British troops in 1841 and declared a crown colony. 

https://www.ft.com/content/5ec723e0-bfd0-11e9-b350-db00d509634e

You people really think it is a good idea to go to the extreme and take the risk, to provoke the chin. Government, to tease the PLA by laserpointing at them, that chaos and violence will be the ultimate solution and the international community will come to the rescue? Surely, better than to exercise caution and hope for gradual, peaceful change, right? Yea. Some chumps in this thread have proven they rather chose conflict over resolving an issue rationally and peacefully.

You wonder why Blizzard isnt keen to be a part of this and doesnt want to suggest to take a stance in this sensitive situation?

Mindless, programmed robots, not able to think for themselves, a healthy dose subtelty absent, merely reacting to stimuli for the sake of feeling righteous, a chance to proudly hold this shinny shield called "Morality" infront. The arrogance in your blatant thoughtlessness makes me want to... re-install battle.net and play some StarCraft. Or Diablo3. Or maybe buy the PS4 version of D3.



Hunting Season is done...

Zoombael said:
Lonely_Dolphin said:

"It is their decision how to react" so everything they do is just automatically correct and justified because... they're Blizzard. Yep your defense will forever remain laughably terrible for the reasons I have already gone over.

Oh snap you didn't deny it, just waffled and threw out baseless insults. I take it you really have no morality then. Combined with your continued willful ignorance of key points and information, I'm not gonna respond to ya no more.

There it is again. The arbitrary interpretation of my words. The same level of ignorance the polar bear displayed. From the very beginning you and others spew accusations  against others of basically being against human rights movement, basically supporting the chin. communist Party in what they're doing to the people of China. Ohyea, thats nothing compared to my baseless insults. Where did i say everything would be automatically justified in my eyes? It just so happens that i agree with their actions in this particular case. You dont. I can justify my position. You cant. It would be a different story if the banned player participated in the protest outside any blizzard event and they would ve took action. Then it would be a clear case cut.

Apperantely, many of you wannabe rebels arent aware of what is at stake.

Deployment of either PLA troops from their various barracks in the territory — or their People’s Armed Police counterparts now camped out just across the border in southern Guangdong province — could end Hong Kong as the world has known it since it was seized by British troops in 1841 and declared a crown colony. 

https://www.ft.com/content/5ec723e0-bfd0-11e9-b350-db00d509634e

You people really think it is a good idea to go to the extreme and take the risk, to provoke the chin. Government, to tease the PLA by laserpointing at them, that chaos and violence will be the ultimate solution and the international community will come to the rescue? Surely, better than to exercise caution and hope for gradual, peaceful change, right? Yea. Some chumps in this thread have proven they rather chose conflict over resolving an issue rationally and peacefully.

You wonder why Blizzard isnt keen to be a part of this and doesnt want to suggest to take a stance in this sensitive situation?

Mindless, programmed robots, not able to think for themselves, a healthy dose subtelty absent, merely reacting to stimuli for the sake of feeling righteous, a chance to proudly hold this shinny shield called "Morality" infront. The arrogance in your blatant thoughtlessness makes me want to... re-install battle.net and play some StarCraft. Or Diablo3. Or maybe buy the PS4 version of D3.

Firt bolded :Most hope the Hong Kong situation gets resolved and that it happens rational and peacefull but when people feel that option is not available you get situations like that protest and nasty shit will happen from all sides.

Sec Bolded :Would be idiotic for them to suggest taking a stance from a bussiness perpective and sadly they stupidly took a stance by form of punishment for that player,a normal neutral warning or smaller punishment without that praise to china message could have resulted in no one talking about it or even knowing about the Hong Kong protests.

Some people really just have a strong sense for morality btw and that should be something to consider good and not be disgusted by it,also the people that really risk their own safety in the protests probably do not think you should be so entitled to tell them what they should risk when it is them risking it all and this is just you being a consumer.

If you want to play a Diablo game then just play the first two,those are decent. :p



Libara said:
fatslob-:O said:

I have a question for you ... 

Do you unconditionally support the dissolution of unions in general such as the EU and do you recognize China's sovereignty over Hong Kong ? 

Why should I answer your question when you have yet to answer mine?

It'll reveal if you're arguing in good faith or not ...



Azzanation said:

I heard a US streamer also spoke up not long after and Blizzard didnt do a thing about that protester because he didnt speak up at a Blizzard event and broke the rules. I will try to find the article.

The most extreme example of Azz being disingenuous. You're not fooling anyone, it's in the OP. There's no way one could know about this without also knowing it was in fact at a Blizzard event as that's why it's even relevant. Only god knows what point he was gonna try to make with this.

"China has over 620m players compared to the US's 166m players. Blizzard has a huge following in China. The fact you choose to ignore this bothers me.."

"You honestly think the Chinese goverment sees this as harmless free speech? Serious question."

These lines should bother everyone, he know Blizzard's actions are all about greed but still defends them. I wonder if Azz even realizes that's the main issue here, Blizzard is letting the CCP, a corrupt authoritarian regime that oppresses it's people, influence them for money, going back on their own principles, and then lying about it. The Chinese Gov. doesn't give a shit about their own people and are so childishly petty they've banned Winnie the Pooh. That's some audacity to say Blizzard should care more about what they think than the rest of the world including their own country. That Blizzard hypocritically doled out the most severe punishment for something harmless is secondary.



Interesting read for those interested in the China situation in relation to gaming (and Western corporation relationships as a whole):

https://seanmalstrom.wordpress.com/2019/10/12/email-china-is-weakening/

Sean Malstrom (basically the only games journalist ever to predict the Wii's success) seems to have a strong belief China is a paper tiger, on the verge of an economic implosion. Companies like Blizzard and the NBA are absolutely betting on the wrong horse. They're operating under the pretext that China is the future, when trends point to that being anything but the case. Even if there is potential growth there short term, you also have the risks associated with operating under a Communist dictatorship, which is shaky grounds for corporations as the government basically sets all the rules and can manipulate/change just about anything at will. They can completely ban a product or even force you to buy certain products.

Of course it's just one man's opinion but I've been following Malstrom for over a decade and he's an extremely savy person, especially when it comes to business analysis and cultural trends. He gets a scary amount of things right, even when they sound absurd to the average person.

I think if Blizzard is that convinced that China is the future like they claim to be even as they throw Hong Kong and Western gamers under the bus, I'd rather they just outright move to China and then they can adhere to all the restrictive Chinese censorship and Totalitarianism they want, since they've likely cut off a large portion of their Western market anyway. Just become a full blown Chinese corporation and be done with it. Would certainly be interesting to see where that takes them in a decade! XD



 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden