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Forums - Sales Discussion - Global Hardware 14 September 2019 (PS4 Tops 100M)

Intrinsic said:

 My agenda is simple, and I have been saying it repeatedly and since 2017. I never believed that the Switch should be counted along with the PS4/XB1.

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS to become the "leader of the generation". 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.



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Intrinsic said:
Dulfite said:

It doesn't have a unique lineup of exclusive games, so how can it be counted differently?

I am really getting tired of saying this, I am not saying and never said the switch lite should be counted as a different console from the switch.

Even in the post you quoted I dedicated the whole second paragraph to clear that up again. I even bolded it for you... 

I have an agenda, but the agenda you all are pushing on me is not it lol. My agenda is simple, and I have been saying it repeatedly and since 2017. I never believed that the Switch should be counted along with the PS4/XB1. Back then I also said they aren't even competing for the same audience which is why the sales of one doesn't affect the other.

This is just proof here that a lot of you guys don't actually read what a person is saying... the second its something that seemingly goes against your console of choice you bring out the pitchforks.

100% agree with you there. I just have never been vocal about it cuz I know is a lost cause here on this site.

It is like Switch being counted as part of gen 8, but I'm sure that as soon as PS5 and Scarlet come out it will be on the front page as part of gen 9. And then everybody will be like "Oh, Nintendo has 80% of the market share!"



curl-6 said:
Intrinsic said:

 My agenda is simple, and I have been saying it repeatedly and since 2017. I never believed that the Switch should be counted along with the PS4/XB1.

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS. 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.

Also comparing things with similar amounts of success is far more interesting than when one blows the other out of the water.

PS4 and Switch have had a very similar sales pace up to this point which makes for a very interesting comparison.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:
curl-6 said:

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS. 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.

Also comparing things with similar amounts of success is far more interesting than when one blows the other out of the water.

PS4 and Switch have had a very similar sales pace up to this point which makes for a very interesting comparison.

I totally understand (and even agree with you) comparing them for fun purposes. What I don't understand is officially counting the Lite as a "home console."



Deeds said:

This is interesting. Whenever sales are brought up to benchmark other industries, everything is counted on what is produced. Who is the biggest manufacturer of PCs in the world? Whatever the answer is everything they make (desktops,laptops,etc) are counted and compared. Who is the biggest automaker in the world? Whoever wins, EVERYTHING they produce from luxury cars to cheap cars are counted and compared to the total of everything the others make. And you know what, no one bats an eye whoever the winner is. Why are you trying to make gaming different from every other industry?

I am not trying to make "gaining different". That would be to suggest that I am suddenly doing something that's different from what has been done before with regards to gaming. The real difference here is that all of a sudden some Nintendo fans are moving the posts. Gaming had always been divided into three categories, and more recently 4 categories. PC gaming, Console gaming (aka home console gaming), Handheld gaming and most recently Mobile gaming. I don't know why that was the case...but that is what has always happened. 

I didn't just make u all those categories, and if you insist that I did... then you are being disingenuous cause that would b a flat ut lie. You don't see us tracking PC/GPU sales here do you? Or smartphone sales... those platforms all play games to don't they? So if you really want to put actions to your words, you should be pushing for us to start racking all thoe kinda sales too. Instead of trying to dismiss everything I am saying instead.

curl-6 said:

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS to become the "leader of the generation". 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.

Can't is a strong word... I prefer shouldn't. And my reasoning is simple. Different use case scenarios. And what that in turn does is create a non-compete environment. Because a few people go ahead and do it doesn't make it right.

Look it this way Intel CPUs compete with AMD CPUs. Nvidia GPUs compete with AMD GPUs. Playstation "home consoles" compete with Xbox "home consoles". Nintendo handhelds compete with Playstation handhelds....etc. If you honestly look at all those things you will see that the effects of competition and shifts in market share is obvious. One ALWAYS does better at the expense of the others. So pls, let's not pretend that this just all started today because I am "separating them into arbitrary vacuums" because I am not.

Those truly unbiased among you here can attest to all I am saying... there s nothing here that I am making up or changing or twisting to suit some sort of agenda. Everything I am saying is factually accurate and has always been how thins had been done. I am not the one changing things... you guys are.

zorg1000 said:
curl-6 said:

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS. 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.

Also comparing things with similar amounts of success is far more interesting than when one blows the other out of the water.

PS4 and Switch have had a very similar sales pace up to this point which makes for a very interesting comparison.

People can compare them all they want for the fun of it. 

But I will say again... The Nintendo Switch Lite is not a home console. The Nintendo Switch was not even a home console in the traditional sense. It was the frst main stream device of its kind. A hybrid. And deserved its own category. I didn't just start saying this now, been saying it since before the switch launched and asked the same question then... what happens when Nintendo releases a version o the switch that can't be connected to a TV.

I am actually in shock at how a lot here seem to suddenly forget that home consoles and handhelds never used to be compared together on this site. Or anywhere else for that matter. Its even more shocking (and downright disturbing) that some have gone as far as try and shame me for saying what I am saying... as if I suddenly just started making all this shit up r what I am saying isn't factually acurate.

Last edited by Intrinsic - on 28 September 2019

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chakkra said:
zorg1000 said:

Also comparing things with similar amounts of success is far more interesting than when one blows the other out of the water.

PS4 and Switch have had a very similar sales pace up to this point which makes for a very interesting comparison.

I totally understand (and even agree with you) comparing them for fun purposes. What I don't understand is officially counting the Lite as a "home console."

I dont think anyone has done that



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:
chakkra said:

I totally understand (and even agree with you) comparing them for fun purposes. What I don't understand is officially counting the Lite as a "home console."

I dont think anyone has done that

Have you been reading this thread?

Hell... just look at the last person you quoted.

Al I have been saying is that Nintendo switch Lite is not a home console. Its a handheld. And we either say its a hybrid and group the whole switch platform together or at the very least acknowledge that one is a hybrid and the other is a handheld. Either way, like I have been saying for years... I don't see why it's being compared t the PS4/XB1.

It is in every iteration of itself, is fundamentally nothing like any of those other two platforms.



chakkra said:
zorg1000 said:

Also comparing things with similar amounts of success is far more interesting than when one blows the other out of the water.

PS4 and Switch have had a very similar sales pace up to this point which makes for a very interesting comparison.

I totally understand (and even agree with you) comparing them for fun purposes. What I don't understand is officially counting the Lite as a "home console."

Isn't everything here really just for "fun" though at the end of the day? I mean these threads, these charts, none of it is official.

Intrinsic said:
curl-6 said:

Why not though? Why can't we compare sales of a home console to a device that is portable? Heck, we already do, we have for ages. People argued whether Wii U could catch the Vita, people celebrated when PS4 overtook 3DS to become the "leader of the generation". 

Switch is Nintendo's primary (soon to be only) system, PS4 is Sony's primary (effectively only) system, of course the two are going to be compared. 

Separating them into arbitrary vacuums seems pointless to me.

Can't is a strong word... I prefer shouldn't. And my reasoning is simple. Different use case scenarios. And what that in turn does is create a non-compete environment. Because a few people go ahead and do it doesn't make it right.

Look it this way Intel CPUs compete with AMD CPUs. Nvidia GPUs compete with AMD GPUs. Playstation "home consoles" compete with Xbox "home consoles". Nintendo handhelds compete with Playstation handhelds....etc. If you honestly look at all those things you will see that the effects of competition and shifts in market share is obvious. One ALWAYS does better at the expense of the others. So pls, let's not pretend that this just all started today because I am "separating them into arbitrary vacuums" because I am not.

Those truly unbiased among you here can attest to all I am saying... there s nothing here that I am making up or changing or twisting to suit some sort of agenda. Everything I am saying is factually accurate and has always been how thins had been done. I am not the one changing things... you guys are.

I really don't see the issue; moving forwards there won't be any more major dedicated handheld systems once 3DS and Vita are completely gone, it'll just be Switch vs Playstation vs Xbox, one primary platform for each of the big three. Separating console vs handhelds seems like an archaic and outdated system in this new environment.



zorg1000 said:
chakkra said:

I totally understand (and even agree with you) comparing them for fun purposes. What I don't understand is officially counting the Lite as a "home console."

I dont think anyone has done that

When the Lite was first announced, someone here asked if it would be officially counted together with the original, and the answer was "yes, because they share the same library." I don't remember if it was CGI or Trunks who answered.

Also, someone at Twitter asked the same to Mat Piscatella and his answer was the exact same one. I'm still trying to understand this thought process.



Intrinsic said:
zorg1000 said:

I dont think anyone has done that

Have you been reading this thread?

Hell... just look at the last person you quoted.

Al I have been saying is that Nintendo switch Lite is not a home console. Its a handheld. And we either say its a hybrid and group the whole switch platform together or at the very least acknowledge that one is a hybrid and the other is a handheld. Either way, like I have been saying for years... I don't see why it's being compared t the PS4/XB1.

It is in every iteration of itself, is fundamentally nothing like any of those other two platforms.

Skimmed through it, alot of new posts while I was at work so I must have missed those claims.

But yes it's clear that Switch is a hybrid and Lite is a handheld of it but still is still part of the same hardware family.

As for comparing it to PS4/XBO, I think you are getting too hung up on home, handheld & hybrid when we should just be looking at them as dedicated gaming devices.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.