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Legend of dragoon is an awful,uninteresting slog of a game and i don't like it

Forums - Sony Discussion - Legend of dragoon is an awful,uninteresting slog of a game and i don't like it

Hiku said:
Finale said:

Sure timing combos is a neat idea, but what is the point if after it you have to keep pushing the same button forever until your attack ends. And yes,of course you have to do it every time, why wouldn't you want to deal more damage and end this boring ass game faster?

I've only played LoD very briefly many years back. I remember trying the combat system, and that's it. Not enough to form an opinion on it, but regarding mechanics that encourage you to repeatedly time button presses for attacks, I have had positive experiences with some of those.

I don't know if you've played Shadow Hearts, but if you have, what's your take on its combat system compared to LoD?



In case you haven't, you try to time your presses to coincide with the colored areas. Red is basically a critical hit. But if you miss and don't land on either orange or red, then your combo will end there, a.k.a. only be as many hits as the amount of successful timing presses you connected.
Because your combo is cut short if you miss (if you miss the first one, you won't even make an attack at all), the risk/reward factor became greater, so you really want to be calculative about when to go for critical hits or not. Especially if they are particularly small.
There are ways to expand the red and yellow zones as you progress through the game, but they'd never be comfortably or consistently large.

This system is also applied to items, so landing on the red strike zone with a potion will let you heal up more than you normally would.
Because of this I ended up having one of the most intense and memorable boss fights I've ever had, when I challenged the end game super boss while not being prepared. I was able to make up for it by doing two critical heals, and then attack once. Rinse and repeat for 45 minutes. One single slip up, and it would have been game over. lol

Not the way you're supposed to fight that boss I'm sure, but it resulted in a fight I won't soon forget.

I don't remember exactly, but in LoD if you miss timed any of the attacks, the worst thing that happened was that you got a weaker attack?

Shadow hearts is the game that took LoD system and made it on something playable. I find it decent enough( i recomended it on the last paragraph of my op post too).



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Finale said:

Shadow hearts is the game that took LoD system and made it on something playable. I find it decent enough( i recomended it on the last paragraph of my op post too).

That you did... I've rarely ever encountered anyone who has played Shadow Hearts so I didn't expect that to be in your post. But I did get the impression that you've played some unconventional games.



Shadow hearts battle mechanic work more or less like hot shots golf, while lod is more like parappa the rapper, I think i’m I right but I played those games when they came out so I might be wrong.



I was thinking this was a joke thread before entering it, then I realized it was serious after reading the first paragraph. I would have liked it better if it were a joke though :( i love Legend of Dragoon, it's one of my top 5 jrpgs only bested by Suikoden 2, Final Fantasy IX, VIII & VII and Star Ocean 3.



gamingsoul said:
Shadow hearts battle mechanic work more or less like hot shots golf, while lod is more like parappa the rapper, I think i’m I right but I played those games when they came out so I might be wrong.

Hotshots Golf = You miss, and it's over?
Parappa The Rapper = You miss, and you still get results, but less effective?

think-man said:
it's one of my top 5 jrpgs only bested by Suikoden 2, Final Fantasy IX, VIII & VII and Star Ocean 3.

@think-man 
That's what I like to hear. There are certainly things that I think could be improved with Suikoden 2, but nothing that impacted my overall enjoyment of the game to a notable degree, and it is still today my favorite jrpg.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V07qVpXUhc0

But Konami will never make another one...

Last edited by Hiku - on 26 May 2019

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Finale said:
BraLoD said:

Oh sorry, I reread your post and apparently the first paragraph about having to remember yourself about some stuff got me thinking it was about the game (thus why I thought you were saying you played it twice) but it wasn't. It was about something else.

But how are you saying such strong stuff about the chars and story if you didn't even finish the game? Honestly you should at least finish it before saying there is nothing you didn't saw otherwise... you didn't even finished it to have a ground to compare. Not liking is something, for sure you can not like any of it, but not stuff you didn't even got to know. Do you know Emperor Diaz? Did you find the Black Monsters? Did you settle things with Lloyd? Do you know the Miranda I talked about? Damn, I don't even know what you know to not like it

Also you keep complaining about guarding while you don't even need to use it at all, as pointed and confirmed by you, healing items work just fine. Are you complaining because you have an extra option?

About the Mario RPG one, it was before LoD, not after. He worked on the SNES games.

If a game after 25 hours doesn't get any good i'm sorry,it's already fundamentally flawled to me. This is why i put the lenght i spended on it in the first paragraph. And i say that about the story because after the scenarios i experienced,i really doubt it's gonna get any better, unless the point of it is to subvert the entire jrpg genre. Btw,i finished disc 1, so i was probably lowbailing how much i played it since i imagine it's longer than that.

and you don't seem to understand, i complain about healing by guarding because it is another factor that increases the lenght of the battles and because it doesn't make for engaging mechanic. Healing using guarding is the best option since healing magic is limited, so this makes any battle just a waiting game in the worst of scenarios. There's no strategy required, you just take you time. 

And i quoted paper mario on my original post, so idk why you cited a mario rpg developer if that's the case, since i recomended the former not the latter.

idk bruh, game is just boring im sorry.

It's perfectly fine for you to drop a game as soon as you feel like, and to dislike it and say that.

The problem is saying the story and characters are something when you just don't fully know what they are.

Present it as "what I know of it is really bad and I don't think it'll get any better" for example, and that's perfectly fine, for example, like you did now, that's perfectly reasonable, your opinion is your opinion and it's all up to you.

Now you said you finished disc 1, so I can tell you that you didn't see the actual story develop at all, you saw the beginning of it, an internal war for the control of a single country that is all but a pivot for the gigantic proportion of it, I'll spoil you here, and everyone else, so please do not read this paragraph further if you don't want to, but here it goes, SPOILER ALERT > it gets to a point that you have to invade the second moon that has fallen on earth to fight a being of 11000 years ago of a superior race that is trying to complete their world's creator will of bringing destruction to life on the planet by last species he made that was sealed on that moon by the the now almost extinct magical race superior to humans in the fight to dominate the other species 11000 years ago. Now you tell me the cliche part about any of that. < SPOILER ALERT END

Again about the healing, guarding can and cannot be the best option, and for sure the is strategy around it.

For example if you are fighting Feyrbrand (the Green Tusked Dragon) that can poison you, guarding is very effective as it halves damage, prevent his poisoning and give you back 10% of your HP.

Now if you are fighting the Fire Bird it doesn't help as much, you should tank a bit more and just use an item to heal. Items are inventory limited but are VERY cheap, no need to not to use them.

Guarding is an excellent option IMO, it's ok not to like or use it if you think it slows the game, just use potions, really, you can beat the game with 0 guardings whatsoever, I've done that.

And I know you talked about Paper Mario, but it's combat comes from Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars, which is was done by Yasuyuke Hasebe, LoD's creator.

You did not reference that specific game but the one you did have it's battle design coming from the one I did, that's why I told you that.

You don't need to be sorry, you can like or dislike any game as much as you feel like, it's your money and time, you decide what to do best with it. You made a topic about it and we are engaging on what you exposed, that's normal, no hard takes on it. You expose your points I expose mine, that's it.



BraLoD said:

It's perfectly fine for you to drop a game as soon as you feel like, and to dislike it and say that.

The problem is saying the story and characters are something when you just don't fully know what they are.

Present it as "what I know of it is really bad and I don't think it'll get any better" for example, and that's perfectly fine, for example, like you did now, that's perfectly reasonable, your opinion is your opinion and it's all up to you.

Now you said you finished disc 1, so I can tell you that you didn't see the actual story develop at all, you saw the beginning of it, an internal war for the control of a single country that is all but a pivot for the gigantic proportion of it, I'll spoil you here, and everyone else, so please do not read this paragraph further if you don't want to, but here it goes, SPOILER ALERT > it gets to a point that you have to invade the second moon that has fallen on earth to fight a being of 11000 years ago of a superior race that is trying to complete their world's creator will of bringing destruction to life on the planet by last species he made that was sealed on that moon by the the now almost extinct magical race superior to humans in the fight to dominate the other species 11000 years ago. Now you tell me the cliche part about any of that. < SPOILER ALERT END

You don't need to be sorry, you can like or dislike any game as much as you feel like, it's your money and time, you decide what to do best with it. You made a topic about it and we are engaging on what you exposed, that's normal, no hard takes on it. You expose your points I expose mine, that's it.

Dude, the bolded part is the definition of a jrpg stable lmao. Someone trying to ressurect and/or complete the will of an ancient species is so played out is absurd to say this isn't a clich. The plot point you described is the almost the same concept you see in FFVII for example. Sephiroth is trying to do the exact same thing hue. The specifics of how he tries to do is different of course, but the concept is already full played. Not even the moon is an original idea, FFIV had that. I'm not saying this doesn't sound like cool concept,i like jrpgs for things like that, but if in 20 hours i didn't liked the cast or the combat, is not enough to change my mind this late in the game. That really doesn't sell me in this game at all.

And yeah, it's all good. I knew this post would probably have disagreements. 



Hiku said:
gamingsoul said:
Shadow hearts battle mechanic work more or less like hot shots golf, while lod is more like parappa the rapper, I think i’m I right but I played those games when they came out so I might be wrong.

Hotshots Golf = You miss, and it's over?
Parappa The Rapper = You miss, and you still get results, but less effective?

think-man said:
it's one of my top 5 jrpgs only bested by Suikoden 2, Final Fantasy IX, VIII & VII and Star Ocean 3.

@think-man 
That's what I like to hear. There are certainly things that I think could be improved with Suikoden 2, but nothing that impacted my overall enjoyment of the game to a notable degree, and it is still today my favorite jrpg.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V07qVpXUhc0

But Konami will never make another one...

LoD has a battle mechanic called Addition.

Addition is a QTE that you have to complete while executing your attack, whenever you are about to make your weapon have contact with your enemy you have to press X (or O in Japan) to make it connect and keep the combo. The enemies can also try to counter you anytime during your combo if that's the case you'll get a visual hint and are requited to push O instead (or X in Japan).

Characters have multiple additions during the game, each with its own style and speed to execute, but as I told above, you always have to press the button when you are about to make contact with your enemy. There is a visual help for that in the form of an stationary square and a bigger rotating one that keeps shrinking, when both are about to be the same you press the button and have an additional attack, either keeping the combo or finishing it, that's why it's called addition, you add attacks to your combo.

All combos are pre-set, a Volcano will always be the same, but you don't need to finish it, if you screw it it simply stops the attack where it is (or throw you back if you screw in a counter attack, which damages the enemy to that point but also you for taking the counter).

The benefits of finishing an Addition is basically dealing more damage in a single turn, later is also gives you SP to activate your Dragoon mechanic, and ultimately if you can master all of a characters additions you unlock its ultimate addition that is the best both on damage and SP.

Now there is also Dragoon Additions, which are only one per character, and that is what would be closer to Shadow Hearts.

You have a Dragoon Eye grid where you have to press X when a running bar is about to complete a round around it, but you are not effectively attacking your foe during that time, your combo will only start when you either fail or finish it, and the amount of hits of the combo unleashed on your enemies depends on the times you were able to press it right in a row.

So there are both. Additions that are happening while you are actively engaging your enemy in battle and Dragoon Addition that will happen based on your success on the grid before.

That's basically it.



Finale said:
BraLoD said:

It's perfectly fine for you to drop a game as soon as you feel like, and to dislike it and say that.

The problem is saying the story and characters are something when you just don't fully know what they are.

Present it as "what I know of it is really bad and I don't think it'll get any better" for example, and that's perfectly fine, for example, like you did now, that's perfectly reasonable, your opinion is your opinion and it's all up to you.

Now you said you finished disc 1, so I can tell you that you didn't see the actual story develop at all, you saw the beginning of it, an internal war for the control of a single country that is all but a pivot for the gigantic proportion of it, I'll spoil you here, and everyone else, so please do not read this paragraph further if you don't want to, but here it goes, SPOILER ALERT > it gets to a point that you have to invade the second moon that has fallen on earth to fight a being of 11000 years ago of a superior race that is trying to complete their world's creator will of bringing destruction to life on the planet by last species he made that was sealed on that moon by the the now almost extinct magical race superior to humans in the fight to dominate the other species 11000 years ago. Now you tell me the cliche part about any of that. < SPOILER ALERT END

You don't need to be sorry, you can like or dislike any game as much as you feel like, it's your money and time, you decide what to do best with it. You made a topic about it and we are engaging on what you exposed, that's normal, no hard takes on it. You expose your points I expose mine, that's it.

Dude, the bolded part is the definition of a jrpg stable lmao. Someone trying to ressurect and/or complete the will of an ancient species is so played out is absurd to say this isn't a clich. The plot point you described is the almost the same concept you see in FFVII for example. Sephiroth is trying to do the exact same thing hue. The specifics of how he tries to do is different of course, but the concept is already full played. Not even the moon is an original idea, FFIV had that. I'm not saying this doesn't sound like cool concept,i like jrpgs for things like that, but if in 20 hours i didn't liked the cast or the combat, is not enough to change my mind this late in the game. That really doesn't sell me in this game at all.

And yeah, it's all good. I knew this post would probably have disagreements. 

I don't think that's a cliche at all.

Sure world domination or destruction is, but what drives that to that point is not, and that's what we enjoy while playing the games.



BraLoD said:

I don't think that's a cliche at all.

Sure world domination or destruction is, but what drives that to that point is not, and that's what we enjoy while playing the games.

No dude, all of it is. We're just gonna have to disagree in this one which is fine. But that doesn't sound different from the standart jrpg at all. At all.