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Forums - Politics Discussion - Israel-Palestine: Which "solution" do you prefer?

h2ohno said:

Hamas' use of human shields, storage of weapons in schools, and firing of rockets from civilian areas is well-documented despite the threats to journalists who refuse to toe the Hamas line in Gaza. The UN has condemned the use of its schools as weapons storage facilities, and after the war Hamas even admitted to using human shields. Hamas has a deliberate strategy of trying to maximize casualties on their own side - and inflating the number of civilian casualties, in order to garner international sympathy. An organization that favors the use of suicide bombers is quite happy to sacrifice its own people just to score a propaganda victory.

https://www.unrwa.org/newsroom/press-releases/unrwa-condemns-placement-rockets-second-time-one-its-schools

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/09/hamas-quietly-admits-it-fired-rockets-from-civilian-areas/380149/

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/trapped-in-gaza-how-hamas-punishes-reporters-for-the-truth/news-story/410ed7246752eb3fbe251557c43647d4

Israel in fact went to extraordinary lengths to prevent civilian casualties in Gaza, lengths that a delegation of military leaders from various western countries said no other army has ever gone to to prevent harm to the civilian population on the other side of a military conflict. A number of experts on international law said that Israel set a "dangerous precedent" which other nations fighting terror groups like Isis and al Qaeda can't be expected to live up to.


Wolff Heintschel von Heinegg, a distinguished expert on military law at European University Viadrina in Frankfurt, said the IDF takes “many more precautions than are required…[it] is setting an unreasonable precedent for other democratic countries of the world who may also be fighting in asymmetric wars against brutal non-state actors who abuse these laws.”

Michael Schmitt, director of the Stockton Center for the Study for International Law at the US Naval War College, said: "The IDF’s warnings certainly go beyond what the law requires, but they also sometimes go beyond what would be operational good sense elsewhere,” he warned. “People are going to start thinking that the United States and other Western democracies should follow the same examples in different types of conflict. That’s a real risk,”



http://blog.unwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/HLIMG-report-cover-letter-to-Judge-Mary-McGowan-Davis-UNHRC-31-May-2015.pdf

https://unitedwithisrael.org/israels-military-accused-of-being-too-careful-to-avoid-civilian-casualties-in-gaza-war/

http://www.weeklystandard.com/attorneys-at-war/article/964911

Your DETAILED knowledge on this issue has time and again proven impressive.

No wonder all those anti-semites avoid as much as they can to counter-argue with you. Their fallacies simply crash on your wall of historical knowledge and reason



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Kirin_gaming said:
 

I think your case fails to draw emotional appeal because we all know that if Palestine had Israel's military, they would've turned Israel into nothing but rubble decades ago.

 

I can eat a bowl of alphabet soup and shit out something that makes more sense than that statement.

 

CrazyGamer2017 said:
deskpro2k3 said:

Lets get some facts right. The only thing stopping Israel from "EASILY get rid of all Palestinians" (genocide) is the international condemnation that they're receiving. From violations including international humanitarian law, the illegal annexation of the West Bank, and bombings of UN schools, UN Hospitals, Shelters, and Factories etc. Pretty sure there are better ways to deal with this instead of blowing shit up.

What a nice color picture. Next time you want to put a fake picture of a PRE 1947 palestinian city, at least try some black and white fakes, you know to try a little harder to convince us. Not that it would change anything about those terrorists, but you know, to give us a little bit of a challenge in the argument.

What's next? A beautiful color picture of Jews invading palestinians with Jesus in the background proving that Jews invaded palestinians 2000 years ago?

 

Oh you want something black and white and PRE 1947, well I can do better. Near the end of Ottoman Empire's control over Palestine.

 1890s

http://lawrenceofcyberia.blogs.com/news/2009/01/a-land-without-a-people.html



According to Ottoman statistics studied by Justin McCarthy, the population of Palestine in the early 19th century was 350,000, in 1860 it was 411,000 and in 1900 about 600,000 of which 94% were Arabs. In 1914 Palestine had a population of 657,000 Muslim Arabs, 81,000 Christian Arabs, and 59,000 Jews."

Demographic history of Palestine – Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Palestine_(region)

Always happy to correct other people's goof ups.

Last edited by deskpro2k3 - on 14 December 2017

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CrazyGamer2017 said:

I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree. If you are going to rewrite history, ignore it or anything like that I'm not sure how we can even argue the issue. Believe whatever you want, that the Jews were invented this morning that they are plotting to destroy the world and so on...

You have your opinion and I have mine and I'm really glad that Israel defends themselves against those terrorists whose ultimate goal is to destroy the country like they tried in 1967 but of course that does not bother your anti-semitic mind. Or perhaps you are going to say that the Arabs never attacked in 1967 to destroy the Jews or maybe since the UN is your reference maybe you will say that the UN was ok with the Arabs attacking Israel and Israel illegally defended themselves, they should have let the Arabs slaughter them to please those who (yeah I'm gonna say it) wish Hitler had done the job and since he did not, they wish the Arabs did it.

In the end all that matters is the facts and the most recent fact is that the US acknowledged Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and I'm very happy about that because I would hate for a foreign country especially an ally country like the US to tell me that the capital of my country is not the capital.

Until 1947 that land that is today Israel and Palestine was nothing but a barren desert where there was nothing and the Jews changed that into a productive land, a prosperous economy and a democracy whereas the palestinians did nothing of that land, so the place is better off in the hands of Israel.

When I see all the anti-semitic comments I'm twice happier to see Israel succeed, at least there is some kind of justice there. I admire their tenacity, resisting the very hostile Arabs that completely surround them. They could EASILY get rid of all palestinians and end the problem once and for all but unlike mulsim countries, democracy means something in Israel, so much so that, believe it or not, some Arabs are in the Israeli government, a big mistake in my opinion but nonetheless a fact which I'm sure you are going to deny so yeah, whatever. Let me know when Jews are allowed in the Iranian or Saudi governments...

Anti-semite ? LOL, that's rich especially when your accusation against me is ironic considering I support a TWO STATE solution ... 

Newsflash, Israel CAN defend itself WITHOUT having to resort to taking another sovereign nation's land. No need for imperialism unless you have a hard-on for your jewish empire fantasy ? You seem to be a massive fan of Republican foreign policy towards Israel since you couldn't fit in with the Democrats ... 

While the US may recognize Jerusalem as Israel's the rest of the international community or it's allies don't and that matters more ... 

Oh, you're not the only one happy about Israel's success. Most of us are happy but most of us are also disappointed in how Israel has also started being the aggressor state ... 



fatslob-:O said:

Anti-semite ? LOL, that's rich especially when your accusation against me is ironic considering I support a TWO STATE solution ... 

Newsflash, Israel CAN defend itself WITHOUT having to resort to taking another sovereign nation's land. No need for imperialism unless you have a hard-on for your jewish empire fantasy ? You seem to be a massive fan of Republican foreign policy towards Israel since you couldn't fit in with the Democrats ... 

While the US may recognize Jerusalem as Israel's the rest of the international community or it's allies don't and that matters more ... 

Oh, you're not the only one happy about Israel's success. Most of us are happy but most of us are also disappointed in how Israel has also started being the aggressor state ... 

Yeah right, except it is your palestinian terrorist friends that are the aggressor, unless you will start arguing that their repeated attacks right after Israel was created is UN approved or something. Maybe the genocide they and all their muslim friends from all the Arab states around Israel which they tried to carry out in 1967 and which they failed so miserably that one feels almost pity for them considering how they were pushed back in 6 days only, maybe Israel trying to defend themselves should be considered illegal, I'm sure it would please guys like you which keep on saying how Israel does not follow the UN rules but at the same time conveniently avoid to talk about that failed invasion and genocide.

Your friends tried and failed and honestly, Israel should have hit them way harder, taken half EACH of those countries as punishment. Right after having Israel's existence threatened to be wiped out, the UN and guys like you whining about Israel daring to take those countries, would have been totally secondary, like: We just kicked a failed genocide against us in the balls, so your western complaints about us defending ourselves is the least of our concerns... Well that's what I would have done cause Israel is too soft and democratic which against those terrorists is definitely not the solution as is proven by a conflict that has lasted since 1947 and will probably have no end for generations and generations...

What's next? I can totally see Iran one day carrying out their plan of wiping Israel off the map as they clearly said they would, or at least trying and the second Israel kicks their asses, you (and a few others in this thread) would whine about how Israel is aggressive towards Iran...

So allow me to doubt your happiness about Israel's success, cause it looks like, I don't know, Hitler's happiness if he was alive and saw the Jewish state standing up strong and very much alive.



CrazyGamer2017 said:
 

Yeah right, except it is your palestinian terrorist friends that are the aggressor, unless you will start arguing that their repeated attacks right after Israel was created is UN approved or something. Maybe the genocide they and all their muslim friends from all the Arab states around Israel which they tried to carry out in 1967 and which they failed so miserably that one feels almost pity for them considering how they were pushed back in 6 days only, maybe Israel trying to defend themselves should be considered illegal, I'm sure it would please guys like you which keep on saying how Israel does not follow the UN rules but at the same time conveniently avoid to talk about that failed invasion and genocide.

Your friends tried and failed and honestly, Israel should have hit them way harder, taken half EACH of those countries as punishment. Right after having Israel's existence threatened to be wiped out, the UN and guys like you whining about Israel daring to take those countries, would have been totally secondary, like: We just kicked a failed genocide against us in the balls, so your western complaints about us defending ourselves is the least of our concerns... Well that's what I would have done cause Israel is too soft and democratic which against those terrorists is definitely not the solution as is proven by a conflict that has lasted since 1947 and will probably have no end for generations and generations...

What's next? I can totally see Iran one day carrying out their plan of wiping Israel off the map as they clearly said they would, or at least trying and the second Israel kicks their asses, you (and a few others in this thread) would whine about how Israel is aggressive towards Iran...

So allow me to doubt your happiness about Israel's success, cause it looks like, I don't know, Hitler's happiness if he was alive and saw the Jewish state standing up strong and very much alive.

 

You're starting to sound like a Zionist sympathizer.

Ethnic cleansing is not self-defense. Having empathy for people suffering in gaza does not make people anti-semitic, nor does it make them anti-israel. It makes them human.

You don't even know what happen way before 1947.. They were all living peacefully, the Christians, Muslims, and Jews until Zionist moved in and started with their terrorist attacks against the Brits.

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deskpro2k3 said:

You're starting to sound like a Zionist sympathizer.

Ethnic cleansing is not self-defense. Having empathy for people suffering in gaza does not make people anti-semitic, nor does it make them anti-israel. It makes them human.

You don't even know what happen way before 1947.. They were all living peacefully, the Christians, Muslims, and Jews until Zionist moved in and started with their terrorist attacks against the Brits.

And as every other anti-semite in this thread you are conveniently ignoring the attempted genocide made by all the countries surrounding Israel in 1967 because Israel defending itself against barbaric people seems to bother you somehow but those people attacking to try and murder every last man woman and children in Israel does not seem to bother you that much...

As for a Zionist sympathizer, I never got that expression but if you mean that I am ok that the Jews reclaim a land that has been THEIRS for thousands of years, then yes I am most definitely a sympathizer and since some here would openly like to see Israel wiped off the map, I am not going to apologize for sympathizing with Israel.

Last edited by CrazyGamer2017 - on 17 December 2017

CrazyGamer2017 said:
deskpro2k3 said:

You're starting to sound like a Zionist sympathizer.

Ethnic cleansing is not self-defense. Having empathy for people suffering in gaza does not make people anti-semitic, nor does it make them anti-israel. It makes them human.

You don't even know what happen way before 1947.. They were all living peacefully, the Christians, Muslims, and Jews until Zionist moved in and started with their terrorist attacks against the Brits.

And as every other anti-semite in this thread you are conveniently ignoring the attempted genocide made by all the countries surrounding Israel in 1967 because Israel defending themselves against barbaric people seems to bother you somehow but those people attacking to try and murder every last man woman and children in Israel does not seem to bother you that much...

As for a Zionist sympathizer, I never got that expression but if you mean that I am ok that the Jews reclaim a land that has been THEIRS for thousands of years, then yes I am most definitely a sympathizer and since some here would openly like to see Israel wiped off the map, I am not going to apologize for sympathizing with Israel.

blah blah blah blah....

First of all learn your history. That conflict has been brewing since 1956-57 called Suez Crisis when Egypt nationalize the Suez Canal. Israel forces struck first pushing into Egypt and taking territory around the region. Since then the conflict in the middle east is unrest.

In 1982, Israel fulfilled the 1979 peace treaty by returning the last segment of the Sinai Peninsula to Egypt. Now the Gaza Strip is still in trouble, and Jordan lost the West Bank.

Last edited by deskpro2k3 - on 17 December 2017

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deskpro2k3 said:

blah blah blah blah....

First of all learn your history. That conflict has been brewing since 1956-57 called Suez Crisis when Egypt nationalize the Suez Canal. Israel forces struck first pushing into Egypt and taking territory. Since then the conflict in the middle east is unrest.

Oh I see so their attempted genocide against Israel is ok then...

Perhaps you should learn yours, I spoke of 1967 but the enemies of Israel in that region have begun attacking Israel since the very beginning and 1967 was just the biggest attack against Israel, the one where they hoped to do what Hitler couldn't...

So yeah you sympathize with those monsters if you want to and conveniently ignore the crimes they have committed against Israel. And just because they have so far failed in murdering every man, woman and child in Israel does not make their intentions any less evil or justifiable.

http://history-of-israel.org/history/chronological_presentation31.php

Oh and on a different note: Shadow of the Colossus was made by the Japanese not the Jews (in case you don't add that game in that poll cause you might think it's the Jews who made that game   I'd imagine you do know it's a Japanese game but it would not be the first time hatred of a country like Israel would make someone blind to the obvious).



I can only imagine one solution that can solve the situation in the long term. The city should be evacuated and then nuked to the point where no reasonable human being wants to go near it in the next 5000 years.



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

CrazyGamer2017 said:
deskpro2k3 said:

blah blah blah blah....

First of all learn your history. That conflict has been brewing since 1956-57 called Suez Crisis when Egypt nationalize the Suez Canal. Israel forces struck first pushing into Egypt and taking territory. Since then the conflict in the middle east is unrest.

Oh I see so their attempted genocide against Israel is ok then...

Perhaps you should learn yours, I spoke of 1967 but the enemies of Israel in that region have begun attacking Israel since the very beginning and 1967 was just the biggest attack against Israel, the one where they hoped to do what Hitler couldn't...

So yeah you sympathize with those monsters if you want to and conveniently ignore the crimes they have committed against Israel. And just because they have so far failed in murdering every man, woman and child in Israel does not make their intentions any less evil or justifiable.

http://history-of-israel.org/history/chronological_presentation31.php

Oh and on a different note: Shadow of the Colossus was made by the Japanese not the Jews (in case you don't add that game in that poll cause you might think it's the Jews who made that game )

 

I'm not talking about what if, and what have nots and other nonsense that's coming out from you. I clearly gave you information about why the conflict in 1967 happen. You can believe whatever the hell you want, facts and logic seems to fail you. By the way, the word "Crazy" in your name fits you will.

Last edited by deskpro2k3 - on 17 December 2017

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