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Forums - Gaming Discussion - VR has a better chance in undeveloped countries and here is why

Nautilus on 24 August 2016
invetedlotus123 said:
Swordmasterman said:

Of course there won't be any country that will purchase more than the USA. Wasn't the USA's population over 300-350 Millions of people ? Plus the fact that nearly every "undeveloped country" will order from USA, because paying in US$, paying for the transport, is still cheaper than  paying the tax in most countries.

I still don't know how Sony released the PS4 in Brazil for over 2200US$, It would be cheaper go to the USA and purchase a  PS4 than purchasing  the Brazilian version. Which would not be possible. I think that the USA or Brazil don't let you go back with something more expensive than 100-200US$ without paying Taxes.

In Brazil we can bring 500 USD with us whitout paying taxes if we travel through air, and we can buy 500 USD more at the free shop in the airport (most of the time those shops are extremely overpriced and it's better to buy in a regular shop, even with taxes). Brazil has a love case with consoles, ps2 is estimated to have sold around 8 million units here even whitout an official release. Our gaming scenario really improved at the 7th gen, games got much cheaper and the prices got desatached from the US pricing. Some games already passef the one million mark here, (ok, it was PES and counting all platforms, but anyway). It's a healthy market I can say, at least nowadays. Those OTHER markets are fundamental for the industry growth, with Japanese market only shrinking by the day there's a point where you can milk North America and Europe. 

You say that is a healthy market with that kind of price for the console?With game costing as much as 200 reais or more at launch?(I have friends there that keeps me informed about such things).Brazil is not a market that can be ignored, much as Mexico, but saying that thats healthy is simply wrong.And sure, it may have sold really well in the past, but nowadays its another story, specially with the current state of the brazillian economy.



My (locked) thread about how difficulty should be a decision for the developers, not the gamers.

https://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=241866&page=1

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Swordmasterman on 24 August 2016
Nautilus said:
invetedlotus123 said:

In Brazil we can bring 500 USD with us whitout paying taxes if we travel through air, and we can buy 500 USD more at the free shop in the airport (most of the time those shops are extremely overpriced and it's better to buy in a regular shop, even with taxes). Brazil has a love case with consoles, ps2 is estimated to have sold around 8 million units here even whitout an official release. Our gaming scenario really improved at the 7th gen, games got much cheaper and the prices got desatached from the US pricing. Some games already passef the one million mark here, (ok, it was PES and counting all platforms, but anyway). It's a healthy market I can say, at least nowadays. Those OTHER markets are fundamental for the industry growth, with Japanese market only shrinking by the day there's a point where you can milk North America and Europe. 

You say that is a healthy market with that kind of price for the console?With game costing as much as 200 reais or more at launch?(I have friends there that keeps me informed about such things).Brazil is not a market that can be ignored, much as Mexico, but saying that thats healthy is simply wrong.And sure, it may have sold really well in the past, but nowadays its another story, specially with the current state of the brazillian economy.

Even with the economy being down, the sales of next gen consoles were up by more than 100%YOY here on Brazil. 200R$  is = 100US$ (with the Dollar at the price it was for a very long time) With the current US$ it is = 62.5US$, last year was = 50US$, but,  like any other country, you can buy it  for less in a lot of places,  big retailers.



Roderic_Blackwood on 24 August 2016
Nautilus said:
Roderic_Blackwood said:

Sorry dude, I'm not rich. I'm in the middle class, I'm a worker. I hate those stereotypes that says that Mexicans are either super poor or filthy rich. Yes, we have them but we have a proper worker class as well: you work, you save money and you buy a Wii U or a PS4 or a PSVR or a PC for gaming, we're not that different from the rest of the world. And of course countries like the US  has more income than us but that doesn't mean companies like Sony are going to say "Hey, let's completely avoid the Mexican market because they're not as rich as the US citizens are". They just adapt to the market, put their systems on sell accoding with the economic reality of the countrie and voila!. Like XBOX which has in Mexico their biggest market in the world after the US, Microsoft sells more Xbox Ones here than in England or Germany.

I never said you were rich.I said that you probably belonged to the richer part of the society.There is a big, even if subtle, difference there.But that still dosent change the fact that videogames in general are a luxury.Sure you can save and buy your PS4, Wii U and what not, but you only do that because you put value on it.For a family that has only casual gamers, its still a big investment to put down the equivalent of 300 dollars plus all the games, acessories and everything else on something that is not necessary to survive or you dont fully enjoy, especially when you dont have much money to waste.And that would be especially true to VR devises, that has the equivalent of at least of 800 dollars of investment to use!If thats already expensive for a country such as US or a continent such as Europe, imagine for a country with much lower purchase power as Mexico.

I dont know where you got your data about the Xbox, but you cant just "adapt" in the sense you are implying.You cant just lower a system that costs $250 to make and lower to lets say $150 to the mexican matket and have profit with it.I mean, that beyond obvious.Products have their prices for a reason and the production costs(and shipments) dont magically lower when you move to a different country.I cant even believe i need to sau this.

And im not saying (nor the other guy) that VR cant sell there.Its just going to sell wayyyyy less than in the bigger markets.And not trying to piss on Mexico, thats simply how things are.

Yes, you can adapt, for example Microsoft have factories in Mexico and Brazil so it's way cheaper to buy an Xbox One (made in Mexico) than a PS4 (made in China), XBox One is relatively cheap here. And I'm not saying that we're going to buy more PSVR systems than in the US, it's impossible but that doesn't mean that we're not a good market for them.



Roderic_Blackwood on 24 August 2016
Swordmasterman said:
Nautilus said:

What he means is that mexicans wont buy in the same numbers as the north americans.For every potential mexican consumer there is, the US has 100.And thats due to the overall population income.There will always be the richer part of the population(which im guessing you are part of) but you are the exception and shouldnt be used as the rule.

I thought that Mexico had some kind of deal with the USA, and that the consoles don't  had much Taxes on the country.

We have NAFTA so the taxes for a console bought here or imported from the US via Amazon for example is not that much. Some retails like Gameplanet (biggest videogame retail in Mexico) sells "expensive" systems or games (for Mexican standards) because they want to have a big cut of the revenues. Overall If a PS4 is sold at $400 in the US (plus taxes) here in Mexico the price would be $420 (taxes included) more or less. An Xbox One is like $100 cheaper than a PS4 here. Nintendo's products are slightly more expensve because we do not have a Mexican branch (Sony and Microsoft does) so most of their stuff is imported from the US. 



invetedlotus123 on 24 August 2016
Swordmasterman said:
invetedlotus123 said:

In Brazil we can bring 500 USD with us whitout paying taxes if we travel through air, and we can buy 500 USD more at the free shop in the airport (most of the time those shops are extremely overpriced and it's better to buy in a regular shop, even with taxes). Brazil has a love case with consoles, ps2 is estimated to have sold around 8 million units here even whitout an official release. Our gaming scenario really improved at the 7th gen, games got much cheaper and the prices got desatached from the US pricing. Some games already passef the one million mark here, (ok, it was PES and counting all platforms, but anyway). It's a healthy market I can say, at least nowadays. Those OTHER markets are fundamental for the industry growth, with Japanese market only shrinking by the day there's a point where you can milk North America and Europe. 

The gaming market don't rely on a single market, even if something like the USA or Japan stop purchasing games, the market would continue, but at a very slow pace.

But Western Europe, Japan and North America are the bigger drivers of the market, the console market anyway. Just compare the numbers here in VgChartz with the Rest of the World Region compared to the others. VGchartz isn`t very reliable, but it`s the source of info we have. 



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invetedlotus123 on 24 August 2016
Nautilus said:
invetedlotus123 said:

In Brazil we can bring 500 USD with us whitout paying taxes if we travel through air, and we can buy 500 USD more at the free shop in the airport (most of the time those shops are extremely overpriced and it's better to buy in a regular shop, even with taxes). Brazil has a love case with consoles, ps2 is estimated to have sold around 8 million units here even whitout an official release. Our gaming scenario really improved at the 7th gen, games got much cheaper and the prices got desatached from the US pricing. Some games already passef the one million mark here, (ok, it was PES and counting all platforms, but anyway). It's a healthy market I can say, at least nowadays. Those OTHER markets are fundamental for the industry growth, with Japanese market only shrinking by the day there's a point where you can milk North America and Europe. 

You say that is a healthy market with that kind of price for the console?With game costing as much as 200 reais or more at launch?(I have friends there that keeps me informed about such things).Brazil is not a market that can be ignored, much as Mexico, but saying that thats healthy is simply wrong.And sure, it may have sold really well in the past, but nowadays its another story, specially with the current state of the brazillian economy.

People here finance everything. It isn`t uncommon for a person with a 1200 BRL montlhy income to have a 2000 BRL phone or buy other goods priced in proportion with their income would make any european or american call them insane.



Nem on 24 August 2016

I take issue with thinking that underdevoloped country = internet cafe. That is an issue you got there.

Just to give an example, south korea is a developed country and has internet cafe culture.

Second, of course not. Even if establishments were to buy such devices it would represent a miniscule number compared to mass market sales. You are talking about what is essentially an arcade. If those got into disuse, why do you think that is? ^^

To put this into perspective: Consumer electronics market >>>>>>>>> internet cafe electronics market. They represent a miniscule ammount in comparison. For it to be viable, the price would have to rise substancially.

So, no. I think the idea is completely off.



method114 on 24 August 2016

You are severely disconnected from what life is like in underdeveloped countries if you think they can even come close to affording stuff like this.



Swordmasterman on 24 August 2016
invetedlotus123 said:
Swordmasterman said:

The gaming market don't rely on a single market, even if something like the USA or Japan stop purchasing games, the market would continue, but at a very slow pace.

But Western Europe, Japan and North America are the bigger drivers of the market, the console market anyway. Just compare the numbers here in VgChartz with the Rest of the World Region compared to the others. VGchartz isn`t very reliable, but it`s the source of info we have. 

Western Europe is a different talk, it isn't just a country, but a Region. I'm saying that the Gaming market, any of the 3 (console, phone, pc), is much bigger than any other country, it can survive even without 1 of the biggest countries for gaming.

 

I think that China have over 23 Billions of gaming revenue, USA 21-22 Billions, Japan  12-14 Billions = 56-59 Billions of US$. After that we have Korea, Germany, UK (in that order) each with over 4 Billions in revenue = 12 = 68-71 Billions + France with over 3 Billions = 71-74 Billions from those major markets, beyong france there are countries with less than 2 Billions in revenue.

So, out-side the major countries for gaming (not region) there is still over 20-23 Billions of US$ in revenue. The worldwide market isn't so small, Vgchartz can't track it because those countries don't have any kind of research on gaming. Only the companies who sell the consoles, games, can tell how much they sold.

I'm sure that Brazil have a good ammount of consoles sold, but they never released any number, the only thing that we got is that, in 2014, Sega's Master System was selling on par with the PS4 (which was 2200US$ against  a 50US$ Master System), Master System sold 200K units in that year. In the same year, PS3 and Xbox360 were the best selling consoles, people here purchase more Last Gen than Next Gen consoles, because they released Last gen consoles at retail in 2012-2013 at a good price, while the other consoles are very expensive and they don't track imported units.



AlfredoTurkey on 24 August 2016

Why would anyone want to put something on their face that is used communally? My god, the virus and germ implications alone make me recoil is terror. Yuk.