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Forums - Sony Discussion - Aldro - The Order: 1886 REVIEW (Spoiler FREE)

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Mr Puggsly said:

The problem for me is gameplay and lasting appeal is more significant than graphics and sound. That system for scoring is... archaic.

It doesn't fit when you review great games with simple graphics and sound like the modern classic Rogue Legacy.

That's because you dont rereview games in the future and hold it up to the standards of today -_-, rather you do it with respect to their time of release. (and yknow once again the final verdict =/= overall score)



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Maybe we all should stop calling them reviewers, failures or fools is more appropriate or something else im sure you all could come up with something good. Calling them reviewers implies some competence and intelligence in actually giving a honest logical opinion on a product.



Aldro said:
Mr Puggsly said:

The problem for me is gameplay and lasting appeal is more significant than graphics and sound. That system for scoring is... archaic.

It doesn't fit when you review great games with simple graphics and sound like the modern classic Rogue Legacy.

That's because you dont rereview games in the future and hold it up to the standards of today -_-, rather you do it with respect to their time of release. (and yknow once again the final verdict =/= overall score)

 

But Rogue Legacy is a game of today and will likely be better remembered than a game like The Order. Reviews that give great scores because of pretty graphics and cool sounds are mostly useless which is why most critics don't do that anymore. If you feel the gameplay is only a 6 than maybe the game doesn't deserve an overall great score.

When it comes to the standards of the future, a game like Super Mario World is timeless because the gameplay is still great. While games like Ryse and The Order had mediocre gameplay at launch. At best, they will be remembered for being a worth a playthrough for their stories.



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Mr Puggsly said:
Aldro said:

That's because you dont rereview games in the future and hold it up to the standards of today -_-, rather you do it with respect to their time of release. (and yknow once again the final verdict =/= overall score)

 

But Rogue Legacy is a game of today and will likely be better remembered than a game like The Order. Reviews that give great scores because of pretty graphics and cool sounds are mostly useless which is why most critics don't do that anymore. If you feel the gameplay is only a 6 than maybe the game doesn't deserve an overall great score.

When it comes to the standards of the future, a game like Super Mario World is timeless because the gameplay is still great. While games like Ryse and The Order had mediocre gameplay at launch. At best, they will be remembered for being a worth a playthrough for their stories.

Cant really comment on Rogue Legacy as I have no clue what that is but the point of my review is to review what is there. If Rogue Legacy does something spectacular, then it can still achieve a high overall score despite the 'graphics' not being a 10. But for what The Order does which is telling a story, and telling it well => Graphics and Sound are absolute detrimental for its success and the gameplay being decent with gunplay far from bad gave me an overall great experience. Will i remember it in 10 years? I do not know. Is it great now? Yes.



Aldro said:

Cant really comment on Rogue Legacy as I have no clue what that is but the point of my review is to review what is there. If Rogue Legacy does something spectacular, then it can still achieve a high overall score despite the 'graphics' not being a 10. But for what The Order does which is telling a story, and telling it well => Graphics and Sound are absolute detrimental for its success and the gameplay being decent with gunplay far from bad gave me an overall great experience. Will i remember it in 10 years? I do not know. Is it great now? Yes.

Here's the thing, you used cutting edge graphics and sound to give The Order a great score. But in the long those things kinda don't matter, they can't even make bad gameplay enjoyable. Which is why many critics don't put much weight on those aspects.

I don't believe cutting edge graphics and sound are detrimental to The Order being an enjoyable experience. Those aspects certainly haven't been crucial to Telltale games being enjoyable.

It sounds like you think the gameplay is lacking, it has little value, but you feel the story is good. Based on the those aspects and your scores, the game deserves a 6.3 which is very close to its metacritic average. However, you actually gave the game an 8 because you like the graphics and sound. Ultimately, a good presentation isn't as appealing as strong gameplay. Therefore graphics, sound, and gameplay shouldn't be weighed the same.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

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Im a bit out of time so I just played a little bit of the game. I seriously cant see how this game would ever deserve the 2s and 5s it got, its a solid 7-8 easilly. Nothing has ever looked as gorgeous as it does btw.



Mr Puggsly said:
Aldro said:

Cant really comment on Rogue Legacy as I have no clue what that is but the point of my review is to review what is there. If Rogue Legacy does something spectacular, then it can still achieve a high overall score despite the 'graphics' not being a 10. But for what The Order does which is telling a story, and telling it well => Graphics and Sound are absolute detrimental for its success and the gameplay being decent with gunplay far from bad gave me an overall great experience. Will i remember it in 10 years? I do not know. Is it great now? Yes.

Here's the thing, you used cutting edge graphics and sound to give The Order a great score. But in the long those things kinda don't matter, they can't even make bad gameplay enjoyable. Which is why many critics don't put much weight on those aspects.

I don't believe cutting edge graphics and sound are detrimental to The Order being an enjoyable experience. Those aspects certainly haven't been crucial to Telltale games being enjoyable.

It sounds like you think the gameplay is lacking, it has little value, but you feel the story is good. Based on the those aspects and your scores, the game deserves a 6.3 which is very close to its metacritic average. However, you actually gave the game an 8 because you like the graphics and sound. Ultimately, a good presentation isn't as appealing as strong gameplay. Therefore graphics, sound, and gameplay shouldn't be weighed the same.

>bolded, No. They did not count toward the overall score of Great. I said in my opening paragraph that the game lives and dies with its story, and the story was Incredible. That was the main attraction. But yes, the graphics and sound help greatly to sell the story. Telltales game also have what I consider even worse gameplay than The Order so your argument fails in my eyes. Telltale also tells a fantastic story but it is a prime example of where graphics/sound isnt needed because in reality, a well told and written story CAN infact carry an entire game.



Aldro said:

>bolded, No. They did not count toward the overall score of Great. I said in my opening paragraph that the game lives and dies with its story, and the story was Incredible. That was the main attraction. But yes, the graphics and sound help greatly to sell the story. Telltales game also have what I consider even worse gameplay than The Order so your argument fails in my eyes. Telltale also tells a fantastic story but it is a prime example of where graphics/sound isnt needed because in reality, a well told and written story CAN infact carry an entire game.

Well I agree some of this. Its a game that people will probably appreciate for story and setting. I honestly don't think great visuals are the primary reason people will want The Order. People will buy The Order hoping for a good shooter.

Maybe the developers didn't know what they wanted to make. They wanted to tell a story like Quantic Dreams or Telltale... but there is more money shooters.

Maybe Sony should have been forthright about what kind of game The Order is. Sony got people excited for a shooter but disappointed them.

It sounds like you enjoyed the story, but the critics seem to have mixed feelings on execution.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Mr Puggsly said:
Aldro said:

>bolded, No. They did not count toward the overall score of Great. I said in my opening paragraph that the game lives and dies with its story, and the story was Incredible. That was the main attraction. But yes, the graphics and sound help greatly to sell the story. Telltales game also have what I consider even worse gameplay than The Order so your argument fails in my eyes. Telltale also tells a fantastic story but it is a prime example of where graphics/sound isnt needed because in reality, a well told and written story CAN infact carry an entire game.

Well I agree some of this. Its a game that people will probably appreciate for story and setting. I honestly don't think great visuals are the primary reason people will want The Order. People will buy The Order hoping for a good shooter.

Maybe the developers didn't know what they wanted to make. They wanted to tell a story like Quantic Dreams or Telltale... but there is more money shooters.

Maybe Sony should have been forthright about what kind of game The Order is. Sony got people excited for a shooter but disappointed them.

It sounds like you enjoyed the story, but the critics seem to have mixed feelings on execution.

Absolutely! The plot itself is very intruiging and the graphics/sound helped sell me on a story that I found to be overall incredible. I cannot explain without spoiling it however. The execution worked for me but I realize that I am in the minority in terms of critics. I am praying for future sequels nonetheless.



Really well done Review :) Thanks for keeping it Spoiler Free!