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Forums - Politics Discussion - People or Religion, who corrupts who?

 

People or Religion, who corrupts who?

Religion causes people to... 25 18.12%
 
People want to do bad thi... 69 50.00%
 
It's a two way street, t... 33 23.91%
 
See results 11 7.97%
 
Total:138
happydolphin said:
SvennoJ said:

It's a two way street, just like the Internet.
Does the internet corrupt people or do people corrupt the internet?

Religion is a great brainwashing tool to hide your ulterior motives behind. Corrupt people can use religion to corrupt further people.

I don't think people are not inherintly evil, they are inherintly greedy, selfish, lazy, are group animals and have a thirst for getting 'even' aka revenge. That can lead to evil behaviour. Those are all evolutionary traits.

Call it evil, call it evolutionary, call it corrupt, call it evolutionary. Essentially people are greedy, selfish, lazy, and other things that lead to causing other people to be greedy, selfish, lazy, etc. (which is essentially corruption).

As religion is a great brainwashing tool, so is non-religious ideology, even pseudo-science.

And yet gain, on the flipside, religion is a cleansing tool, as is non-religious ideology, even pseudo-science.

Lol!

Yeah, religion is just one of many tools. Might as well boil it down to ideas. Language/communication is the problem :) (and the solution)



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Religion truly is the opiate of the masses, and under its influence humans are capable of acts, thoughts, and deeds that they would otherwise not be capable of. That is where this thread is going, and while all of that may be true. It isn't really the heart of the matter. Religion foments divisions between people and peoples, and it is in those schisms between individuals and groups where evil festers.

Religion is the foundation from which racism, nationalism, feudalism, sexism, and slavery spring. It separates one group from another, and diminishes the respect of one individual for another. It doesn't just make it easier to justify bad acts against another. That is the natural byproduct of this way of thinking. Let us be clear about something religion in all its many forms is a way of thinking.

Religion isn't in itself bad, but it is bad in certain contexts. Ten thousand years ago religious thinking probably gave our ancestors a survival advantage, because it strengthened the group by giving it common purpose, and creating certain ways of behaving towards one another that minimized conflict, or allowed it to happen in a controlled form. However that was then, and this is now.

Religion puts up walls, and while those walls once helped us to keep our enemies at bay. Those walls have become our true enemy. The future of our species is becoming increasingly dependent on pluralism. A group of people who are sitting behind a wall going insane isn't self contained anymore. It doesn't really matter if it is just one group, and the other groups are pacifists. That one group can do damage on a global scale.

Religion by its very nature no matter what the adherent believes is a corrupting force. That actually does more harm now then it does good. If you doubt this at all. Look at the global trends. Nations where pluralism, non religiosity, and secularism are in the ascent. Very much dominate the Nations where that is not the case, and it isn't just in the form of militarism we are talking about.

Those nations having fewer boundaries between their citizens. Are able to work together to far greater effect. This is an evolution. Anywhere that religious thinking has started to wane. There has been a boon in the human capacity for creation. Everything goes right through the roof. Science, the humanities, civil engineering, and philanthropy. It is because religion is actually detrimental, and is that not a textbook definition of something that is evil.

Something that expressly harms the group. You can have any religion of any color you like, and have it lead by who ever you want, but it doesn't change the defining characteristics about religious thinking. It doesn't promote the exchange of ideas, or the creation of new ideas. Which are what drive progress.



DaRev said:

I might be mistaken, but that was a piss poor attempt at not being one-sided. So I can only conclude that you really are one-sided. In any event, let me ask you this, was your ancient gandmother an monkey and do you suppose that she had flees?

If by one-sided you mean logical, then yes it was one-sided. Otherwise, I acknowledged the validity of the claim of a supernatural being/force.

I'm not sure what you're looking for from an approach.

Nope, my grandmother is a homo sapien just as you and I are.

If that is supposed to be a slight to evolution, then you just demostrated your profound ignorance of the topic. We didn't evolve from monkeys. Modern primates (Humans, Chimps, Apes) share a common ancestor. That ancestor is an "ape-like" creature; that does not mean we came from monkeys.

If there is anything else I can educate you on, let me know since you don't seem to know much at all.



SvennoJ said:

Yeah, religion is just one of many tools. Might as well boil it down to ideas. Language/communication is the problem :) (and the solution)

I love it, well said. The root problem to the misuse of Language/communication are greed, bias, insecurity, timidity (not being courageous enough to challenge one's self), impatience (not taking the time to fully understand things) and a few others.

The opposite attitudes to those are the solution:

Objectivity, confidence, courage, patience, and a few others.



Both. Otherwise good people end up doing bad things because of religion and bad people use religion as an excuse to do bad things or control people.

But really, religion is utterly unnecessary so if we eliminate that and could help teach people to be nice and good to each other the negatives that religion inevitably brings can be entirely avoided.



A warrior keeps death on the mind from the moment of their first breath to the moment of their last.



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I said both but it's a cycle:

1. People create religion to explain the unknown (OK, this part is outside the circle and only needs to happen once)
2. People in power use religion as a tool to manipulate and control the masses
3. The masses further utilise religion to spread the doctrines further and carry out the preferred acts of person in step 2
4. Person in step 2 dies or is replaced. Steps 2-4 are repeated.

In human history, religion is probably the most powerful tool one can utilise to control a large population of people. Yes, there are other tools like political ideology, but religions seems to be the only one which can overcome generational gaps; most religious people are the same religion as their parents whilst the same is not true of political alignment. Furthermore, religion is typically ingrained in people from a young age when the mind is developing making it harder to step back and question it.



Scoobes said:
I said both but it's a cycle:

1. People create religion to explain the unknown (OK, this part is outside the circle and only needs to happen once)
2. People in power use religion as a tool to manipulate and control the masses
3. The masses further utilise religion to spread the doctrines further and carry out the preferred acts of person in step 2
4. Person in step 2 dies or is replaced. Steps 2-4 are repeated.

In human history, religion is probably the most powerful tool one can utilise to control a large population of people. Yes, there are other tools like political ideology, but religions seems to be the only one which can overcome generational gaps; most religious people are the same religion as their parents whilst the same is not true of political alignment. Furthermore, religion is typically ingrained in people from a young age when the mind is developing making it harder to step back and question it.

@bold. I know a few people that were raised Christian and are total atheists, and I'm pretty sure some people are today atheist because that's how they were raised.

It really goes both ways, I'm not sure how you get the distinction.



people are already corrupt



Bet reminder: I bet with Tboned51 that Splatoon won't reach the 1 million shipped mark by the end of 2015. I win if he loses and I lose if I lost.

If someone is going to say that "games don't corrupt people, the people made the decision to take the game a wrong way" or whatever, then you can't be so blindly biased as to say that religion makes people corrupt/"evil."

People make their own decisions, some of you just don't seem to take this into affect for something such as religion. Seriously, stop.



happydolphin said:
Scoobes said:
I said both but it's a cycle:

1. People create religion to explain the unknown (OK, this part is outside the circle and only needs to happen once)
2. People in power use religion as a tool to manipulate and control the masses
3. The masses further utilise religion to spread the doctrines further and carry out the preferred acts of person in step 2
4. Person in step 2 dies or is replaced. Steps 2-4 are repeated.

In human history, religion is probably the most powerful tool one can utilise to control a large population of people. Yes, there are other tools like political ideology, but religions seems to be the only one which can overcome generational gaps; most religious people are the same religion as their parents whilst the same is not true of political alignment. Furthermore, religion is typically ingrained in people from a young age when the mind is developing making it harder to step back and question it.

@bold. I know a few people that were raised Christian and are total atheists, and I'm pretty sure some people are today atheist because that's how they were raised.

It really goes both ways, I'm not sure how you get the distinction.

I can't remember where I read it but statistically people are more likely to stick with the religion of their parents than their political viewpoint. It was something like 40-50% stick to their parents politics whilst it's around 80% stick with their parents religious views.

That probably works with atheists too but then it's dificult to use atheism as a tool.