By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - Victory for the Constitution... in Illinois?!

Max King of the Wild on 12 December 2012
Marks said:
Max King of the Wild said:
Marks said:
Thank God people are finally realizing that gun control means more crime, not the other way around. Do you really think tons of gun control would have stopped shootings such as Columbine, Virginia Tech, or the Colorado movie theatre? No! But if some of the people in these places had been carry/concealing maybe they could have stopped it sooner.

I'm gonna have to say this: If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns.


Illinois isn't realizing this though. They actually fought tooth and nail on this. On top of this other restrictions were deemed unconstitutional previously in Illinois. I don't remember the exact laws but they were ridiculous to the point that it was impossible to have a gun. It was something like you needed to bring your gun to chicago to register it but then there was another law banning guns in the city limits of chicago. Something utterly ridiculous like that.


Wow that's absolutely ridiculous...I can't believe how people continue to ignore the facts and blame crime on guns/lack of gun control. I'd have to look it up but I'm almost certain I've read that more crime is prevented by armed law abiding citizens than by police...and much of this is just flashing your gun, not even shooting it. 

I'd believe it. In this thread I was quoting response times for high priority calls which were over ten minutes. Those include assaults and shootings in progress. I also quoted an episode of greg mathis (judge show based in chicago) where the plaintiff had to go to the police station to fill out an assualt police report because the police refused to respond basically.



Around the Network
Max King of the Wild on 12 December 2012
the2real4mafol said:
Max King of the Wild said:
the2real4mafol said:
Why was the right to carry a gun ever included in your constitution? i don't understand that


To prevent supression from local and federal governments. To protect friends family and loved ones from people with no regard for human life. To get food during harsh winters... many reasons

Well we Europeans don't need guns in our everyday life, why would you? You don't need guns to live. And if you get supressed by government, you can always raid a army base, like the Libyans did. And finally do you think guns will make the Government back off, just look at Syria currently, it's just made things worse. 


I'm pretty sure I answered your first question already. I don't know how the Libyans do things but I sure wouldn't want to go against thousands of soldiers armed with assault rifles, tanks, fighter planes, helicopters, ect. Put those same Libyans against a US Army base and they wouldn't get anywhere near the weapons. As for making things worse? If it ever comes to armed US citizens fighting the government I don't think it could possibly get worse



ninetailschris on 12 December 2012
the2real4mafol said:
Max King of the Wild said:
the2real4mafol said:
Why was the right to carry a gun ever included in your constitution? i don't understand that


To prevent supression from local and federal governments. To protect friends family and loved ones from people with no regard for human life. To get food during harsh winters... many reasons

Well we Europeans don't need guns in our everyday life, why would you? You don't need guns to live. And if you get supressed by government, you can always raid a army base, like the Libyans did. And finally do you think guns will make the Government back off, just look at Syria currently, it's just made things worse. 

You say Europeans don't need guns based on source or anything just claiming it really. You didn't compare anything with no gun control.

For example Switzerland has one of the lowest of crimes and they personal say it because of there no gun control.

Gun politics in Switzerland are unique in Europe. Switzerland does not have a standing army, instead opting for a peoples' militia for its national defence. The vast majority of men between the ages of 20 and 30 are conscripted into the militia and undergo military training, including weapons training. The personal weapons of the militia are kept at home as part of the military obligations; Switzerland thus has one of the highest militia gun ownership rates in the world.

Why do you believe the myth?



"Excuse me sir, I see you have a weapon. Why don't you put it down and let's settle this like gentlemen"  ~ max

gamelover2000 on 12 December 2012
ninetailschris said:
gamelover2000 said:

So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?

 

The constitution was made by the founding fathers who wanted a free country, but they owned slaves.

The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions.

 

The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal.

 

Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous.

All were deist they were in a group called masons. None where atheist please post your facts because I remember doing a project on the founders in high school where they were in fact mason which was deist a group.

"So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?"

Many complain about privacy and economic freedom stop pretending like your the only one who cares or is doing anything about to make yourself feel like special or making a point.

"The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions."

your point of irony tells us nothing about what is right or wrong is shows your lack of ability to give a support point. If you were right it doesn't change the fact that because x personal beliefs mean the opposite is wrong. There is no relation of two from the data to tells anything. This is common fallacy of the hitler fallacy in which if hitler believe x than x is wrong which is for simple minded people.

"The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal."

Wait what? Are you just ignorant or lying? You do realize in Florida if someone is caught trespassing on someone property for stealing or the harm a family member your aloud to kill the person? This is only one example.

In general, one (sometimes more) of a variety of conditions must be met before a person can legally use the Castle Doctrine:

An intruder must be making (or have made) an attempt to unlawfully and/or forcibly enter an occupied home, business or car. 
The intruder must be acting illegally—e.g. the Castle Doctrine does not give the right to attack officers of the law acting in the course of their legal duties 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to inflict serious bodily harm or death upon an occupant of the home 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to commit some other felony, such as arson or burglary 
The occupant(s) of the home must not have provoked or instigated an intrusion, or provoked or instigated an intruder to threaten or use deadly force 
The occupant(s) of the home may be required to attempt to exit the house or otherwise retreat (this is called the "Duty to retreat" and most self-defense statutes referred to as examples of "Castle Doctrine" expressly state that the homeowner has no such duty) 
In all cases, the occupant(s) of the home must be there legally, must not be fugitives from the law, must not be using the Castle Doctrine to aid or abet another person in being a fugitive from the law, and must not use deadly force upon an officer of the law or an officer of the peace while they are performing or attempting to perform their legal duties.

"Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous."

 Yup crazy that a guy came into someone house with a knife or weapon and kills your children.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/man-in-spider-man-mask-robs-domino-s-driver-in/article_7c4ad546-9380-52c9-aa22-87ceeab1c019.html

Man gets killed for pizza and money. He is then put in car.  All for pizza but hey no way someone would go in a house and kill someone whole family for more than that.

Because that never happens.

Stop pretending that giving everyone weapons can be justified due to violent crimes.

 

I am not from the United States and I Have never seen or heard a gun(shot) in my life. I life in a country that is pretty much better in every way possible as the United States. Stop acting like your country works differently and try our system and you will soon find improvement.

 

If you want to act like everyone having weapons is a good idea then go ahead, people will die because that is all guns do: Kill people.



Currently playing: MAG, Heavy Rain, Infamous

 

Getting Plat trophies for: Heavy Rain, Infamous, RE5,  Burnout and GOW collection once I get it.

 

the2real4mafol on 12 December 2012

I just don't see why ordinary people want or need guns, at least not to carry around in public anyway. Surely if they didn't have them, then we wouldn't hear constant stories of shootings, especially in America. Gun laws should at least be separate from the codified constitution anyway.

What also makes no sense to me is that people think liberal gun laws make sense, and yet prostitution and most drugs shouldn't be legal at all.



Xbox One, PS4 and Switch (+ Many Retro Consoles)

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch will sell better than Wii U Lifetime Sales by Jan 1st 2018

Around the Network
Max King of the Wild on 12 December 2012
gamelover2000 said:
ninetailschris said:

 

 

Stop pretending that giving everyone weapons can be justified due to violent crimes.

 

I am not from the United States and I Have never seen or heard a gun(shot) in my life. I life in a country that is pretty much better in every way possible as the United States. Stop acting like your country works differently and try our system and you will soon find improvement.

 

If you want to act like everyone having weapons is a good idea then go ahead, people will die because that is all guns do: Kill people.


Yes, that's all guns do is kill people. Every time someone pulls out a gun someone dies. You make very bold unsubstantiated claims



ninetailschris on 12 December 2012
the2real4mafol said:

I just don't see why ordinary people want or need guns, at least not to carry around in public anyway. Surely if they didn't have them, then we wouldn't hear constant stories of shootings, especially in America. Gun laws should at least be separate from the codified constitution anyway.

What also makes no sense to me is that people think liberal gun laws make sense, and yet prostitution and most drugs shouldn't be legal at all.


Explain why no gun zones have the highest in murders by guns? 

http://www.neontommy.com/news/2012/07/doing-math-guns

having a gun on you doesn't mean your out to kill people. I live in Florida and carry a gun on me all the time just for the protection of my family and myself.

Just because you have a gun doesn't make a person a killer. If your a killer you will kill legal or not.



"Excuse me sir, I see you have a weapon. Why don't you put it down and let's settle this like gentlemen"  ~ max

Max King of the Wild on 12 December 2012
ninetailschris said:
the2real4mafol said:

I just don't see why ordinary people want or need guns, at least not to carry around in public anyway. Surely if they didn't have them, then we wouldn't hear constant stories of shootings, especially in America. Gun laws should at least be separate from the codified constitution anyway.

What also makes no sense to me is that people think liberal gun laws make sense, and yet prostitution and most drugs shouldn't be legal at all.


Explain why no gun zones have the highest in murders by guns? 

http://www.neontommy.com/news/2012/07/doing-math-guns

having a gun on you doesn't mean your out to kill people. I live in Florida and carry a gun on me all the time just for the protection of my family and myself.

Just because you have a gun doesn't make a person a killer. If your a killer you will kill legal or not.


I love this thread because it shows everyones ignorance. I have never fired a gun (other than Airsoft or BB gun). Nor do I own a gun. I'm 26 years old. However, I have a FOID (Fire arm owners ID) card and am getting my conceal and carry permit in Wisconsin soon... I'll wait to see if they hold classes that would count for both Illinois and Wisconsin first. Hilarious thing though is in Wisconsin you can have a gun in a holster and carry it out in the open without a permit. When my mom found out I had a FOID card she was horrified.



ninetailschris on 12 December 2012
gamelover2000 said:
ninetailschris said:
gamelover2000 said:

So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?

 

The constitution was made by the founding fathers who wanted a free country, but they owned slaves.

The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions.

 

The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal.

 

Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous.

All were deist they were in a group called masons. None where atheist please post your facts because I remember doing a project on the founders in high school where they were in fact mason which was deist a group.

"So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?"

Many complain about privacy and economic freedom stop pretending like your the only one who cares or is doing anything about to make yourself feel like special or making a point.

"The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions."

your point of irony tells us nothing about what is right or wrong is shows your lack of ability to give a support point. If you were right it doesn't change the fact that because x personal beliefs mean the opposite is wrong. There is no relation of two from the data to tells anything. This is common fallacy of the hitler fallacy in which if hitler believe x than x is wrong which is for simple minded people.

"The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal."

Wait what? Are you just ignorant or lying? You do realize in Florida if someone is caught trespassing on someone property for stealing or the harm a family member your aloud to kill the person? This is only one example.

In general, one (sometimes more) of a variety of conditions must be met before a person can legally use the Castle Doctrine:

An intruder must be making (or have made) an attempt to unlawfully and/or forcibly enter an occupied home, business or car. 
The intruder must be acting illegally—e.g. the Castle Doctrine does not give the right to attack officers of the law acting in the course of their legal duties 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to inflict serious bodily harm or death upon an occupant of the home 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to commit some other felony, such as arson or burglary 
The occupant(s) of the home must not have provoked or instigated an intrusion, or provoked or instigated an intruder to threaten or use deadly force 
The occupant(s) of the home may be required to attempt to exit the house or otherwise retreat (this is called the "Duty to retreat" and most self-defense statutes referred to as examples of "Castle Doctrine" expressly state that the homeowner has no such duty) 
In all cases, the occupant(s) of the home must be there legally, must not be fugitives from the law, must not be using the Castle Doctrine to aid or abet another person in being a fugitive from the law, and must not use deadly force upon an officer of the law or an officer of the peace while they are performing or attempting to perform their legal duties.

"Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous."

 Yup crazy that a guy came into someone house with a knife or weapon and kills your children.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/man-in-spider-man-mask-robs-domino-s-driver-in/article_7c4ad546-9380-52c9-aa22-87ceeab1c019.html

Man gets killed for pizza and money. He is then put in car.  All for pizza but hey no way someone would go in a house and kill someone whole family for more than that.

Because that never happens.

Stop pretending that giving everyone weapons can be justified due to violent crimes.

 

I am not from the United States and I Have never seen or heard a gun(shot) in my life. I life in a country that is pretty much better in every way possible as the United States. Stop acting like your country works differently and try our system and you will soon find improvement.

 

If you want to act like everyone having weapons is a good idea then go ahead, people will die because that is all guns do: Kill people.


Switzerland has many guns and few murders. Don't like facts don't argue against it.
Switzerland has the most guns and the lowest crime everyone has a gun.
Your logic and arguments have been proven false.
You can accept the facts or live in a world that is made of misinformation.
I don't care for your personal experience as I lived in a gun control and saw people get killed all time. Your subjective experience isn't reality as whole accept that and grow from it.


"Excuse me sir, I see you have a weapon. Why don't you put it down and let's settle this like gentlemen"  ~ max

Mr Khan on 12 December 2012
ninetailschris said:
gamelover2000 said:
ninetailschris said:
gamelover2000 said:

So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?

 

The constitution was made by the founding fathers who wanted a free country, but they owned slaves.

The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions.

 

The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal.

 

Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous.

All were deist they were in a group called masons. None where atheist please post your facts because I remember doing a project on the founders in high school where they were in fact mason which was deist a group.

"So when United States citizens get raped from privacy and economic freedom noone cares but when they're GUNS get taken away they go 'muh freedom'?"

Many complain about privacy and economic freedom stop pretending like your the only one who cares or is doing anything about to make yourself feel like special or making a point.

"The founding fathers we're all deists/atheists or agnostic and now the United States is the most christian country on Earth with a few exceptions."

your point of irony tells us nothing about what is right or wrong is shows your lack of ability to give a support point. If you were right it doesn't change the fact that because x personal beliefs mean the opposite is wrong. There is no relation of two from the data to tells anything. This is common fallacy of the hitler fallacy in which if hitler believe x than x is wrong which is for simple minded people.

"The constitution is not being upheld and you can not shoot someone that is stealing your property because that is a crime. I have no problem with baseball bats as they are (with exceptions) non-lethal."

Wait what? Are you just ignorant or lying? You do realize in Florida if someone is caught trespassing on someone property for stealing or the harm a family member your aloud to kill the person? This is only one example.

In general, one (sometimes more) of a variety of conditions must be met before a person can legally use the Castle Doctrine:

An intruder must be making (or have made) an attempt to unlawfully and/or forcibly enter an occupied home, business or car. 
The intruder must be acting illegally—e.g. the Castle Doctrine does not give the right to attack officers of the law acting in the course of their legal duties 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to inflict serious bodily harm or death upon an occupant of the home 
The occupant(s) of the home must reasonably believe that the intruder intends to commit some other felony, such as arson or burglary 
The occupant(s) of the home must not have provoked or instigated an intrusion, or provoked or instigated an intruder to threaten or use deadly force 
The occupant(s) of the home may be required to attempt to exit the house or otherwise retreat (this is called the "Duty to retreat" and most self-defense statutes referred to as examples of "Castle Doctrine" expressly state that the homeowner has no such duty) 
In all cases, the occupant(s) of the home must be there legally, must not be fugitives from the law, must not be using the Castle Doctrine to aid or abet another person in being a fugitive from the law, and must not use deadly force upon an officer of the law or an officer of the peace while they are performing or attempting to perform their legal duties.

"Shooting someone for stealing your pink pelican from your front jard is fucking ridicilous."

 Yup crazy that a guy came into someone house with a knife or weapon and kills your children.

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/man-in-spider-man-mask-robs-domino-s-driver-in/article_7c4ad546-9380-52c9-aa22-87ceeab1c019.html

Man gets killed for pizza and money. He is then put in car.  All for pizza but hey no way someone would go in a house and kill someone whole family for more than that.

Because that never happens.

Stop pretending that giving everyone weapons can be justified due to violent crimes.

 

I am not from the United States and I Have never seen or heard a gun(shot) in my life. I life in a country that is pretty much better in every way possible as the United States. Stop acting like your country works differently and try our system and you will soon find improvement.

 

If you want to act like everyone having weapons is a good idea then go ahead, people will die because that is all guns do: Kill people.

 

Switzerland has many guns and few murders. Don't like facts don't argue against it.
Switzerland has the most guns and the lowest crime everyone has a gun.
Your logic and arguments have been proven false.
You can accept the facts or live in a world that is made of misinformation.
I don't care for your personal experience as I lived in a gun control and saw people get killed all time. Your subjective experience isn't reality as whole accept that and grow from it.

 

You need to learn basic rules of argument before arguing. Correlation != Causation



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.