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What is your honest opinion on the Forza Franchise? Compeditor to GT?

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coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).

Not exactly a fair comparison when only one game out of those two Sony series' mentioned have been on "Halo's level" (if talking main iterations of Halo) : Killzone 2 with a 91 meta.

That's precisely my point, neither franchise is on Halo's level, regardless of Meta scores. That's the same situation with Forza and GT, but flipped.



                                                                                                                                            

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selnor said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Apart from the fact that f4 takes a huge dump on gt5s visuals. And has the same visual fidelity on all cars. Not just 110 th looking good.


1. That post of mine was a joke. Pretty obvious is you check what I quoted.

2. Forza 4 hasn't been released yet, and pre-release footage of Forza 3 looked miles better than the final product. Forza 3 IS far below GT5. I actually checked them side-by-side on identical 42'' screens. When you move in close to the screen the difference is very clear.

3. Everyone knows you'll never concede a frontline 360 exclusive is inferior to the PS3's counterpart. CGI pretty much proved that above, but you'll never concede that either.*remembers thread you made that Alan Wake will have best console graphics - better than GoWIII*

4. You don't seem to know much of English grammar based on those sentances:

''Apart from...'' - Doesn't seem to make any sense...

''And has the same...'' - What so F3 or F4 has the same fideltitz on all cars? If F3, then hell no. If F4, then I think we should wait and see for something more solid eh.

''Not just 110 th looking good.'' - What does this mean?



Dr.Grass said:

fideltitz

'Nuff Said.

Ah fark! I just elongated the life of this thread.



trasharmdsister12 said:

Dr.Grass said:

fideltitz

'Nuff Said.

Ah fark! I just elongated the life of this thread.

-_-



CGI-Quality said:
coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).

Not exactly a fair comparison when only one game out of those two Sony series' mentioned have been on "Halo's level" (if talking main iterations of Halo) : Killzone 2 with a 91 meta.

That's precisely my point, neither franchise is on Halo's level, regardless of Meta scores. That's the same situation with Forza and GT, but flipped.

I'm just trying to point out your point is seems moot anyway.  Whether either of those series are on or above Halo's level is subjective to the gamer playing those games. 

I don't see how you can have "Meta score" and "most of the industry" in the sentence contradicting each other.  With the two this-gen Forza games receiving a 90, 92 average on metacritic and the none of the GT's released this gen getting above an 84 meta, you'll have to define what you mean by "GT's level".  With numbers like that, you'll really need to pull some quotes in order to prove most of the industry's stance on the recent releases in the GT series.  If anything, I see Dirt and Forza mentioned more, as of late.



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http://www.vgchartz.com/article/440852/greedfall-xone/ (Review - GreedFall 8/10)

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coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).

Not exactly a fair comparison when only one game out of those two Sony series' mentioned have been on "Halo's level" (if talking main iterations of Halo) : Killzone 2 with a 91 meta.

That's precisely my point, neither franchise is on Halo's level, regardless of Meta scores. That's the same situation with Forza and GT, but flipped.

I'm just trying to point out your point is seems moot anyway.  Whether either of those series are on or above Halo's level is subjective to the gamer playing those games. 

I don't see how you can have "Meta score" and "most of the industry" in the sentence contradicting each other.  With the two this-gen Forza games receiving a 90, 92 average on metacritic and the none of the GT's released this gen getting above an 84 meta, you'll have to define what you mean by "GT's level".  With numbers like that, you'll really need to pull some quotes in order to prove most of the industry's stance on the recent releases in the GT series.  If anything, I see Dirt and Forza mentioned more, as of late.

Well, that last sentence is a little contradictory (hard to argue against anecdote when you present some yourself)

Regardless, my view is simple (which I don't know if you've been reading, but I said this ages ago); Forza doesn't have the industry image that GT does. Not the same expectations, brand name, selling power (again, complimenting my point regarding Halo vs Killzone - or even better: CoD vs any other FPS on the market). I didn't say that can't ever change, but that's not how things are right now. If we use "the numbers", the reviewers themselves say GT is still better at what it seeks to do; be the industry's leading driving simulator for consoles, despite Forza being the better "modern racing game". We can even use your stance, Halo 3 must be better than Halo: Reach, as the numbers prove that, right? In fact, in Halo: Reach's case, many of the reviews that call it better than Halo 3 still graded it lower. I know, the situations are a little different, but are key when judging reviewers (especially as of late).

In the end, I just don't think these Meta scores are enough to guarantee a sure-fire shift in market position. Yes, Forza has scored higher than the most recent GT titles (and I can see why in many areas), but what difference has that made? Listening to actual driving/racing enthusiasts tells you where GT stands in the industry and it doesn't seem like Metacritic has impacted that stance in any substantial way.



                                                                                                                                            

CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).


your right....its clearly below it.

While industry experts say GT has a arguably better sim aspect......almost everybody agrees that Forza is the better overall package. This is after all.........video games, and Turn 10 simply makes a better video game.

Better customization, better online modes, menus, music, track detail, more "premium cars" then GT5s 200. 

If Forza 4 is any indication, this trend is going to stay the same. 

Overall.......when Forza keeps coming out every 2 years with a 90+ metascore while GT5 takes 5 years and ships with 800 ps2 cars and gets a 84 for being sloppy on the video game side of things........well enough said.

GT5 is honestly its own worst enemy. Takes too long per release and isnt even a AAA franchise anymore 



___________

Older and wiser. Still bias and proud though ;)

CGI-Quality said:
coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
coolbeans said:
CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:
Dr.Grass said:
Jay520 said:
LOL, why did you bring this thread back to life?


Because GT5's graphics blow Forza out of the water.

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).

Not exactly a fair comparison when only one game out of those two Sony series' mentioned have been on "Halo's level" (if talking main iterations of Halo) : Killzone 2 with a 91 meta.

That's precisely my point, neither franchise is on Halo's level, regardless of Meta scores. That's the same situation with Forza and GT, but flipped.

I'm just trying to point out your point is seems moot anyway.  Whether either of those series are on or above Halo's level is subjective to the gamer playing those games. 

I don't see how you can have "Meta score" and "most of the industry" in the sentence contradicting each other.  With the two this-gen Forza games receiving a 90, 92 average on metacritic and the none of the GT's released this gen getting above an 84 meta, you'll have to define what you mean by "GT's level".  With numbers like that, you'll really need to pull some quotes in order to prove most of the industry's stance on the recent releases in the GT series.  If anything, I see Dirt and Forza mentioned more, as of late.

Well, that last sentence is a little contradictory (hard to argue against anecdote when you present some yourself)

Regardless, my view is simple (which I don't know if you've been reading, but I said this ages ago); Forza doesn't have the industry image that GT does. Not the same expectations, brand name, selling power (again, complimenting my point regarding Halo vs Killzone - or even better: CoD vs any other FPS on the market). I didn't say that can't ever change, but that's not how things are right now. If we use "the numbers", the reviewers themselves say GT is still better at what it seeks to do; be the industry's leading driving simulator for consoles, despite Forza being the better "modern racing game". We can even use your stance, I guess Uncharted has now surpassed Gears (in the eyes of "the numbers"), correct? Hell, Halo 3 must be better than Halo: Reach, as the numbers prove that, right? In fact, in Halo: Reach's case, many of the reviews that call it better than Halo 3 still graded it lower. I know, the situations are a little different, but are key when judging reviewers (especially as of late).

In the end, I just don't think these Meta scores are enough to guarantee a sure-fire shift in market position. Yes, Forza has scored higher than the most recent GT titles (and I can see why in many areas), but what difference has that made? Listening to actual driving/racing enthusiasts tells you where GT stands in the industry and it doesn't seem like Metacritic has impacted that stance in any substantial way.


So your saying Forza doesnt have the sales of the GT series yet. Granted but every Forza sells more then the last, bundles or not while GT5 seems to be on the decline more or less with the series track record. 

Just saying though....that being the better sim doesnt mean much when its lacking in being a video game......cause thats what it is no matter how you slice it.

Its a driving simulator video game.

Now Forza succeeds in being a great (maybe not the best) sim but also a excellent video game. Add to that it comes out every 2 years vs 5 years for GT5. 

With uncharted and gears, Halo 3 vs Reach..........your comparing games all in their 90's on metacritic. lol it doesnt matter what they are so long as they are above 90. GT5 vs forza however is another story as one is AA where as one is AAA. A much better basis to say one is clearly above the other. 

Its overall the poor time span in between releases thats hurting GT the most. 5 years per game while Turn 10 keeps cranking out new 90+ forzas every 2 years. Eventually the fans are gonna get tired of waiting when theres a perfectly overall better package on the 360 that doesnt keep their fans waiting for great sims with boring video game aspects. 



___________

Older and wiser. Still bias and proud though ;)

sales2099 said:
CGI-Quality said:
sales2099 said:

Graphics? thats about the ONLY thing GT5 excells over Forza. The gap is small actually, especially with forza 4.

 

but overall, if release frequency and scores are anything to go by.....GT has clearly been knocked out of being the best of what it does

Dissecting the actual words of reviewers, they don't seem to agree.

And despite it's 84 Meta score, most in the industry would tell you that Forza isn't on GT's level (the same way Resistance nor Killzone are on Halo's level).


your right....its clearly below it.

While industry experts say GT has a arguably better sim aspect......almost everybody agrees that Forza is the better overall package. This is after all.........video games, and Turn 10 simply makes a better video game.

Better customization, better online modes, menus, music, track detail, more "premium cars" then GT5s 200. 

If Forza 4 is any indication, this trend is going to stay the same. 

Overall.......when Forza keeps coming out every 2 years with a 90+ metascore while GT5 takes 5 years and ships with 800 ps2 cars and gets a 84 for being sloppy on the video game side of things........well enough said.

GT5 is honestly its own worst enemy. Takes too long per release and isnt even a AAA franchise anymore 

Well, I wouldn't almost everybody agrees, but I would agree that Forza 3 is better for the modern racing fan, it just doesn't offer the better driving experience for those looking for the best simulator they can get on consoles. That says a lot, because if Forza can't match GT on GT's biggest selling point, what's the point in reminding people about numbers?

When asked about Forza vs GT, most reviews (and many gamers) have agreed with what I'm saying;  while Forza is better for the new/modern racing fan, GT sticks to it's guns offering what it's fans have grown accustomed to (even if it doesn't come without it's flaws). In so doing, it's still "the best driving simulator consoles have to offer".



                                                                                                                                            

sales2099 said:
CGI-Quality said:
coolbeans said:

I'm just trying to point out your point is seems moot anyway.  Whether either of those series are on or above Halo's level is subjective to the gamer playing those games. 

I don't see how you can have "Meta score" and "most of the industry" in the sentence contradicting each other.  With the two this-gen Forza games receiving a 90, 92 average on metacritic and the none of the GT's released this gen getting above an 84 meta, you'll have to define what you mean by "GT's level".  With numbers like that, you'll really need to pull some quotes in order to prove most of the industry's stance on the recent releases in the GT series.  If anything, I see Dirt and Forza mentioned more, as of late.

Well, that last sentence is a little contradictory (hard to argue against anecdote when you present some yourself)

Regardless, my view is simple (which I don't know if you've been reading, but I said this ages ago); Forza doesn't have the industry image that GT does. Not the same expectations, brand name, selling power (again, complimenting my point regarding Halo vs Killzone - or even better: CoD vs any other FPS on the market). I didn't say that can't ever change, but that's not how things are right now. If we use "the numbers", the reviewers themselves say GT is still better at what it seeks to do; be the industry's leading driving simulator for consoles, despite Forza being the better "modern racing game". We can even use your stance, I guess Uncharted has now surpassed Gears (in the eyes of "the numbers"), correct? Hell, Halo 3 must be better than Halo: Reach, as the numbers prove that, right? In fact, in Halo: Reach's case, many of the reviews that call it better than Halo 3 still graded it lower. I know, the situations are a little different, but are key when judging reviewers (especially as of late).

In the end, I just don't think these Meta scores are enough to guarantee a sure-fire shift in market position. Yes, Forza has scored higher than the most recent GT titles (and I can see why in many areas), but what difference has that made? Listening to actual driving/racing enthusiasts tells you where GT stands in the industry and it doesn't seem like Metacritic has impacted that stance in any substantial way.


So your saying Forza doesnt have the sales of the GT series yet. Granted but every Forza sells more then the last, bundles or not while GT5 seems to be on the decline more or less with the series track record. 

Just saying though....that being the better sim doesnt mean much when its lacking in being a video game......cause thats what it is no matter how you slice it.

Its a driving simulator video game.

Now Forza succeeds in being a great (maybe not the best) sim but also a excellent video game. Add to that it comes out every 2 years vs 5 years for GT5. 

With uncharted and gears, Halo 3 vs Reach..........your comparing games all in their 90's on metacritic. lol it doesnt matter what they are so long as they are above 90. GT5 vs forza however is another story as one is AA where as one is AAA. A much better basis to say one is clearly above the other. 

Its overall the poor time span in between releases thats hurting GT the most. 5 years per game while Turn 10 keeps cranking out new 90+ forzas every 2 years. Eventually the fans are gonna get tired of waiting when theres a perfectly overall better package on the 360 that doesnt keep their fans waiting for great sims with boring video game aspects. 

Again, that "AAA" status hasn't done much to penetrate the GT name, making that element of debate meaningless. To most who bought it, GT5's 84 Meta score (which isn't even a bad score, all things considered) made little to no difference because the GT brand is big enough that it would take more than a few points down on Metacritic to have any substantial impact (which is why my other Meta score references apply). We can talk about what may/could eventually happen all we like, but that's a "what if" scenario and doesn't say much right now.

Bottom line; GT is a stronger, bigger brand than Forza. 90s vs 80s ("AAA" vs "AA") isn't changing much of that and while we're on the subject of sales declines, GT5 is currently sitting higher than it's predecessor in the same time frame (only bringing the franchise to a notable decline in one region - which is being offset in another).