blunty51 said:
tarheel91 said:
blunty51 said:
tarheel91 said:
blunty51 said: It's just the description it's gotten over the years to distinguish the two different art styles. Notice they're calling the realistic Zelda the 'mature' look, but not calling the cellshaded version an 'immature' one.
Also, the 'realistic style' Link is a very serious person. Cell shaded link has more cartoony facial expressions and jokes etc. |
A description given to it by detractors of the style. Calling it less mature is poisoning the well, no two ways around it.* There is nothing more mature about realism vs. cel shading. It's the same shit people pull with Mario, calling it kiddy. Why is Mario kiddy? Uh, uh, no guns or boobs! Right, so there's no real reason. It's the same thing with cell shading. The humor in both WW and TP is the same, and while Link can be more expressive in WW thanks to the style, that's not just limited to funny expressions, but also those of anger, frustration, etc. It's like the names used in political debates (e.g. people in favor of abortion call themselves pro choice, but their opposers call them anti-life). There's no real substance behind such names, they are simply used because of their connotation and how they change people's view of something before a discussion can even begin.
*For those of you who've never heard of poisoning the well: Poisoning the well (or attempting to poison the well) is a logical fallacy where adverse information about a target is pre-emptively presented to an audience, with the intention of discrediting or ridiculing everything that the target person is about to say.
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Name came from detractors of the style? I dunno...I mean, I love both styles and I have no problems calling one 'mature' and the other 'cell shaded'. I'm not sure there is another universally accepted comfortable word to describe it to be honest.
As for poisoning the well...I think the Zelda franchise is too well established to let a label like that dampen anything, and if at all, it'll be in the extreme minority. Well this is just my view anyway.
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Really, you don't think "realistic" works for describing the TP style? Cause that's kind of what you've been using interchangeably with "mature."
You don't see how calling one "mature" poisons the well? Let me spell it out for you. Calling one mature implies that the other is not mature, or at least, is not as mature. So really, although they don't say anything about the WW style by calling the TP style mature, they imply a lot (it's just how pro-choice implies that the opposing group is anti-choice, and pro-life implies that their opposers are anti-life). Along with lacking maturity in the video game world comes terms like "kiddie" and "casual." These labels discourage people from defending WW, as it's now associated with terms they dislike, and if they try to defend it, they're also labeled as such.
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But even if we use the word 'realistic', some (maybe not you) would find the same arguement there as well (Calling it realistic would imply that the other is unrealistic, or not a 'real' game). Don't get me wrong I know where you are coming from, but at the end of the day we're just talking about the art style right? In your Mario example I don't think you can fault anyone for looking at it and thinking it has a 'kiddy' looking art style. Even diehard fans can say it looks kiddy on the surface but knows very well that it's not a kid game. I think that's just an eventuality of the gaming world tagging something based on how they see it. In Zelda's case, it was of my view that everyone knows that the game is a teen/mature title that everyone can play, so even the names it got over the years (mature and cel-shaded, which isn't so bad in itself) would have minimal impact (the impact would really be on individuals that never played/heard of the franchise before). But hey...I'm just speculating and you could be totally spot on, which is why I have respect for what you have said. Just discussing.
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Wonderful strawman argument there. I love how you created your own argument and defeated it. You're clearly right, what was I thinking. No, seriously, neither I nor any other logical person thinks TWW's artstyle is just a realistic as TP. TWW clearly goes for a far more stylized world, where TP attempts to more closely resemble reality (that's not to say it's going for hyper-realism; it's got some style of it's own, but far less than TWW). TP is objectively more realistic than TWW. Again, that is an objective fact, and that's why you should use it to describe TP instead of "mature," a word loaded with unappropriate connotation. To make any connection between the realism in a game's graphics and how much of a "real" game something is makes absolutely no sense. Again, no logical person would ever make that connection. You're just using twisted semantics to fit your argument.
What, exactly, is kidding looking about Mario? Objectively explain that to me. After you try and fail, I'll explain to you why it isn't. ;)