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Forums - Gaming - Same Engine? Same Gameplay? Same Basic Features? In a New Game?

Xxain said:
mirgro said:
Xxain said:
Wats your definition clone?

If you have to ask then you probably wouldn't understand my ranting since I don't know how much you played back when game clones were considered bad. But anyhow a clone is a game which has similar gameplay to another game. It make have better/different graphics, "cool" additions, and other such things, but in the end it's still the same old as the game it clones.

 

I will agree that Killzone 2's multiplayer is different than Halo 3's, that's for sure.


I have to asked is usually used in a very ignorant way most of time, We have several Genres that all have the " basic design approach " and it was these developers but on top of that basic design the differences there game from all the rest in same genre, I dont see how KZ2 is a clone of HALO other than sharing the same genre thus the same basic design

How did Half-Life set itself apart from the pack? What about Serious Sam/Painkiller? Games can be different and still have the same genre.



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mirgro said:
twesterm said:
mirgro said:
twesterm said:
If it's a good game why break what's broken?

Yeah, your rant makes since on a high level but when you get bogged down in it, you see why publishers do what they do.

Making a AAA games is a huge risk that has a very high possibility of blowing up in your face. If you have something that you know works, you keep it.

You do everything you can to keep risk as low as possible so that means you keep the same engine, you make only basic tweaks, and you just improve upon what you already have.

Since AAA games cost a stupid amount of money and there's already a stupid high risk, it doesn't make since to take 5 years to make a game with a new engine and completely new unproven play mechanics.

Well then wouldn't it turn into a "survival of the fittest" scenario? The developers who make the good games will continue making them, the ones that don't go bankrupt. If anything that would be better for gaming as a whole.

So you want two or three games a year?

Make an expansion for them. Starcraft has lasted over 10 years, Diablo 2 as well. Good games can be played for a long period of time. If those 2 or 3 games were of the quality of Baldur's Gate 2, DIablo 2, Zelda OoT, Mario 64, etc. then having just 2 or 3 a year would not be a problem at all. Also sorry, I sneaked in an edit, but it pertained to something else.

I'm sorry, but that's just horrible thinking.  If we're relying on the type of game that can still be played 10 years later, the game industry would die a quick death.

How often do those types of games come along?

Do you realize that games would then be an even bigger risk and would be even more derivative to mitagate that risk?

What happens if you don't like Starcraft VI, Shiny New Mario, or Halo 8?  Do you just have to wait until next year to get a game?  Sucks to be you!

Sorry, again, no offense, but that's just a horrible way of thinking.

Back to your original argument, if you don't think a game is worth your money, just don't buy.  If a game doesn't sell it will stop being made or forced to changed.  Lucky for you, you apparently still have games to play and are fine with playing those for 10 years so there's no worry for you.



all games are clones



"Clones" were reviewed bad back in the day? Here's a few notable clones of the 5th generation that didn't fair so badly:

Banjo-Kazooie, Donkey Kong 64 (Super Mario 64)
Final Fantasy Tactics (Tactics Ogre)
Tekken (Virtua Fighter)
Dino Crisis (Resident Evil)
Perfect Dark (GoldenEye 007)
Diddy Kong Racing (Mario Kart)
WipEout (F-Zero)
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (Super Metroid)

You might want to recall some of those sequels back then that were just like the sequels of today. Basically minor improvements on a good formula. Have you forgotten:

Tekken 2 and 3
Virtua Fighter 2
Street Fighter Alpha 2 and 3
Banjo-Tooie
Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
Gran Turismo 2
Resident Evil 2 and 3
Dino Crisis 2
Syphon Filter 2 and 3
WipEout 2097 and 3
Panzer Dragoon Zwei
Oddworld: Abe's Exodus
Driver 2
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2
Colony Wars Vengeance and Red Sun
Tomb Raider 2 and 3
Crash Bandicoot 2 and Warped

I mean do I really need to continue?

 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



Onyxmeth said:

"Clones" were reviewed bad back in the day? Here's a few notable clones of the 5th generation that didn't fair so badly:

Banjo-Kazooie, Donkey Kong 64 (Super Mario 64)
Final Fantasy Tactics (Tactics Ogre)
Tekken (Virtua Fighter)
Dino Crisis (Resident Evil)
Perfect Dark (GoldenEye 007)
Diddy Kong Racing (Mario Kart)
WipEout (F-Zero)
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (Super Metroid)

You might want to recall some of those sequels back then that were just like the sequels of today. Basically minor improvements on a good formula. Have you forgotten:

Tekken 2 and 3
Virtua Fighter 2
Street Fighter Alpha 2 and 3
Banjo-Tooie
Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
Gran Turismo 2
Resident Evil 2 and 3
Dino Crisis 2
Syphon Filter 2 and 3
WipEout 2097 and 3
Panzer Dragoon Zwei
Oddworld: Abe's Exodus
Driver 2
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2
Colony Wars Vengeance and Red Sun
Tomb Raider 2 and 3
Crash Bandicoot 2 and Warped

I mean do I really need to continue?

 

I didn't want to do any finger pointing on this thread, but I guess I have no choice. Notice all those games you listed are console games. Leaving the "PC>Console" argument behind, it'd be nice to know exactly how those consoles were supposed to give developers the choice of expansion packs. Now that the consoles are wannabe PCs, expansions through online download/install to HDD are perfectly valid and possible. Yet it's still not happening. At least developers had an excuse back then.

 

@twesterm

If you didn't like Mario 8 then you wouldn't like any of the clones. So you'd STILL be stuck without a good game until a new one comes out a year or so later. In fact in that scenario you'd be more screwed cause if people thought Mario 8 was good then you'd never see something different because people will be making Mario 8 clones for the next 5 years. But at least you'd have those games that last 10 years with you... oh wait.. you don't, they don't make them anymore. Sucks to be you!



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mirgro said:
Onyxmeth said:

"Clones" were reviewed bad back in the day? Here's a few notable clones of the 5th generation that didn't fair so badly:

Banjo-Kazooie, Donkey Kong 64 (Super Mario 64)
Final Fantasy Tactics (Tactics Ogre)
Tekken (Virtua Fighter)
Dino Crisis (Resident Evil)
Perfect Dark (GoldenEye 007)
Diddy Kong Racing (Mario Kart)
WipEout (F-Zero)
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (Super Metroid)

You might want to recall some of those sequels back then that were just like the sequels of today. Basically minor improvements on a good formula. Have you forgotten:

Tekken 2 and 3
Virtua Fighter 2
Street Fighter Alpha 2 and 3
Banjo-Tooie
Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
Gran Turismo 2
Resident Evil 2 and 3
Dino Crisis 2
Syphon Filter 2 and 3
WipEout 2097 and 3
Panzer Dragoon Zwei
Oddworld: Abe's Exodus
Driver 2
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2
Colony Wars Vengeance and Red Sun
Tomb Raider 2 and 3
Crash Bandicoot 2 and Warped

I mean do I really need to continue?

 

I didn't want to do any finger pointing on this thread, but I guess I have no choice. Notice all those games you listed are console games. Leaving the "PC>Console" argument behind, it'd be nice to know exactly how those consoles were supposed to give developers the choice of expansion packs. Now that the consoles are wannabe PCs, expansions through online download/install to HDD are perfectly valid and possible. Yet it's still not happening. At least developers had an excuse back then.

That only addresses the second list I made. There is another list above it you've ignored. 



Tag: Became a freaking mod and a complete douche, coincidentally, at the same time.



@migro - that's exactly I what I said in last post which is why askin u to xxplain how halo and kz2 are clones



Why in the world would you build a completely new engine for every game? Halo 3's engine for example has really great hit recognition, physics and even capable particle effects, and of course AA since it's not running at 720p. The engine itself is fine, excellent really, and would do 95% of what is needed for the next game. Why go through all that for the last 5% which can be handled by just tweaking the existing engine? I am at a loss.



Onyxmeth said:
mirgro said:

I didn't want to do any finger pointing on this thread, but I guess I have no choice. Notice all those games you listed are console games. Leaving the "PC>Console" argument behind, it'd be nice to know exactly how those consoles were supposed to give developers the choice of expansion packs. Now that the consoles are wannabe PCs, expansions through online download/install to HDD are perfectly valid and possible. Yet it's still not happening. At least developers had an excuse back then.

That only addresses the second list I made. There is another list above it you've ignored. 

Indeed, I have not much to fight with on your 1st list except for reviewer scores:

Banjo Kazooie 92% (granted)

DOnkey Kong 64 64%

Tekken 75%

DIno Crisis 83%

Perfect Dark 94%

Wipeout 90%

DDR 89%

Castlevania 93%

 

Only 5 of the ones you listed were rated at 90, and I'd put them as the best ones I can think of as well from that generation.

The "sequel" issue however is painfully obvious in today's day and age.



CommonMan said:
Why in the world would you build a completely new engine for every game? Halo 3's engine for example has really great hit recognition, physics and even capable particle effects, and of course AA since it's not running at 720p. The engine itself is fine, excellent really, and would do 95% of what is needed for the next game. Why go through all that for the last 5% which can be handled by just tweaking the existing engine? I am at a loss.

I'm fine with people using the same engine, but then charge less for the game, like $30 or $40 instead of 60.