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Forums - Gaming - Mistwalker in FINISHING stage for their NEW GAME (What Console?!!)

Seraphic_Sixaxis on 18 October 2009

A New game for PSP or PS3/360.



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outlawauron on 18 October 2009
Khuutra said:
outlawauron said:
Khuutra said:
outlawauron said:

Lost Odyssey is a unfinished product that lacked any original gameplay. I can admit that and I still think it's my 2nd favorite game this generation. How can reviewers reward an unpolished and completely uncreative design? The story was fantastic in my opinion and it was tons of fun, but judging fun is not part of a review.

...Why the Hell not?

Because that is completely subjective and will change based on the reviewers tastes in the genre. I will no fun playing a Tom Clancy title, but I'm not going to tell you that they're bad games. They're great games, but just not for me. Same with other series where I may not have much fun, but I recognize that's a high quality, top notch title.

A review is not just the listing of objective qualities, it is also about subjective qualifications of experience. Reviews without subjectivity - which do not address fun - are worse than useless, they're sterile.

Yes, but what you like or don't like should not affect the score you give it. That's just what I was saying.

Based on the amount of fun I've had with Lost Odyssey I'd give it a 10, but I know it's not a perfect game and it has tons of issues.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

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Khuutra on 18 October 2009
outlawauron said:
Khuutra said:
outlawauron said:

Because that is completely subjective and will change based on the reviewers tastes in the genre. I will no fun playing a Tom Clancy title, but I'm not going to tell you that they're bad games. They're great games, but just not for me. Same with other series where I may not have much fun, but I recognize that's a high quality, top notch title.

A review is not just the listing of objective qualities, it is also about subjective qualifications of experience. Reviews without subjectivity - which do not address fun - are worse than useless, they're sterile.

Yes, but what you like or don't like should not affect the score you give it. That's just what I was saying.

Based on the amount of fun I've had with Lost Odyssey I'd give it a 10, but I know it's not a perfect game and it has tons of issues.

A perfect score does not imply a perfect game.



Kenryoku_Maxis on 18 October 2009
loves2splooge said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
perpride said:
@kenryoku - you are agreeing with me here right???

For the most part.  The media and reviewers clearly have a bias towards Final Fantasy, comparing EVERY RPG to it.  But I don't think FFXII was the best JRPG of last gen and a large part of the reason people think it was is because of the hype and media attention behind it.

Boneitis said:
LF-A said:
Maybe wii, choosing to release on 360 has been quite the sales failure of a decision.

To the contrary Lost Odyssey is one of the best selling JRPGs this gen. Blue Dragon also did pretty well for a crappy game.

I'm sure Microsoft pays a pretty penny for exclusivity and the games tend sell a fairly well even with a smaller Japanese userbase. I don't understand at all how its a "failure of a decision."

As has been shown many times before, plenty of DS and PSP JRPGs have done much better than Lost Odyssey.  In fact, they make Lost Odyssey (and most Mistwalker games) look pretty avg.  When most of the SquareEnix RPGs on the DS or PSP are selling between 800,000-2 million units (and then you got stuff like DQIX going for 4 million), stuff like Lost Odyssey is nowhere near one of the best selling JRPGs of this gen.

Now, if you want to say 'one of the best selling CONSOLE JRPGs', maybe.  But its just been proven that JRPGs are doing poorly on consoles so that's not a big achievement.

Only a handful of PS2 jrpg IPs out of a gazillion jrpgs on the console sold better than what Lost Odyssey did. Let's list them off.

Final Fantasy X

Final Fantasy XII

Kingdom Hearts

Final Fantasy X-2

Dragon Quest VIII

Kingdom Hearts II

Dragon Quest V (Japan-only remake port)

Star Ocean 3

Dark Cloud

That's a pretty exclusive list dominated by Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, Dragon Quest, Star Ocean (which sold 250,000+ less than Lost Odyssey this generation. SO4 will only beat LO when it goes multi-plat) and Dark Cloud. The fact that Lost Odyssey would make the "top 10" on the PS2 list is very impressive considering how over-saturated PS2 was with jrpgs and how big the PS2 install base was.

Lost Odyssey is not a part of the jrpg elite (The Square-Enix triforce of Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts and Dragon Quest + Pokemon and Monster Hunter.) but I'd say 800,000+ is great for a new IP. Especially when they even beat Star Ocean this gen on the 360. That is very interesting. Both are jrpgs, on the same platform so I'd say it's a fair comparison. Star Ocean needs the benefit of going multi-plat, a benefit LO won't have, in order to win this generation.

Mistwalker should definitely continue with the Lost Odyssey series. Maybe the next time they can hit 1 million with the benefit of a larger install base this time around.

Oh don't get me wrong,  Ithink Lost Odyssey did fine and wasn't a 'failure' by any standard.  But what I'm trying to hit home is that, like all other JRPGs that were 360 exclusives, it lost a great deal of sales and its not hitting its market correctly.  Sure it got some help from the heavy marketing campaigns and because it has such good graphics (both of which I think are the reason it sold, not so much the game content itself), but it still could have sold much more on another system. 

If it followed the same trend the other JRPGs are doing currently and was re-released on PS3 with 'added features', I bet you the Japanese sales of the game would double or even triple what the 360 sales were.  But even more important, if the game had been made for the DS instead of an 'HD' system, I think it might have done even better in sales.  Of course, then it would have been an entirely different game, and that's the problem with RPGs in this gen.  The divide between the 'HD' and 'Nintendo' consoles have given RPG developers a tough choice....make the game with bigger and better graphics...or sell more units and make a better profit on the DS (and possibly Wii).

outlawauron said:

Yes, but what you like or don't like should not affect the score you give it. That's just what I was saying.

Based on the amount of fun I've had with Lost Odyssey I'd give it a 10, but I know it's not a perfect game and it has tons of issues.

A large part of reviews from internet sites to magazines are always their own opinions.  That's partially why their scores are so different and why you get so many opinions mixed in with the subjective 'review' of the game.  Its in my opinion that reviews should just be a straight report of the games content.  And they should have a seperate 'opinion' column at the end to express their views and experiences while playing the game.  But the majority of people who read reviews seem to go to reviewers for the drama and opinions, not the content of wanting to know what the games actual content is.

So when you are reading the 8.6's and 9.8s for your favorite games, take it with an extreme grain of salt.  Because there's about 5 people reviewing 200+ games a year.  And your favorite game is just another 1-5 hour piece of 'work' to them.



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

themanwithnoname on 18 October 2009
outlawauron said:
Khuutra said:
outlawauron said:
Khuutra said:
outlawauron said:

Lost Odyssey is a unfinished product that lacked any original gameplay. I can admit that and I still think it's my 2nd favorite game this generation. How can reviewers reward an unpolished and completely uncreative design? The story was fantastic in my opinion and it was tons of fun, but judging fun is not part of a review.

...Why the Hell not?

Because that is completely subjective and will change based on the reviewers tastes in the genre. I will no fun playing a Tom Clancy title, but I'm not going to tell you that they're bad games. They're great games, but just not for me. Same with other series where I may not have much fun, but I recognize that's a high quality, top notch title.

A review is not just the listing of objective qualities, it is also about subjective qualifications of experience. Reviews without subjectivity - which do not address fun - are worse than useless, they're sterile.

Yes, but what you like or don't like should not affect the score you give it. That's just what I was saying.

Based on the amount of fun I've had with Lost Odyssey I'd give it a 10, but I know it's not a perfect game and it has tons of issues.

I agree to a certain extent. It's always annoying to read reviews that criticize certain elements of the game that are staples of the genre.



themanwithnoname's law: As an America's sales or NPD thread grows longer, the probabilty of the comment "America = World" [sarcasticly] being made approaches 1.

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outlawauron on 18 October 2009
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
outlawauron said:

Yes, but what you like or don't like should not affect the score you give it. That's just what I was saying.

Based on the amount of fun I've had with Lost Odyssey I'd give it a 10, but I know it's not a perfect game and it has tons of issues.

A large part of reviews from internet sites to magazines are always their own opinions.  That's partially why their scores are so different and why you get so many opinions mixed in with the subjective 'review' of the game.  Its in my opinion that reviews should just be a straight report of the games content.  And they should have a seperate 'opinion' column at the end to express their views and experiences while playing the game.  But the majority of people who read reviews seem to go to reviewers for the drama and opinions, not the content of wanting to know what the games actual content is.

So when you are reading the 8.6's and 9.8s for your favorite games, take it with an extreme grain of salt.  Because there's about 5 people reviewing 200+ games a year.  And your favorite game is just another 1-5 hour piece of 'work' to them.

Which is a major problem with reviews. Reviewers will throw in some rant or put up a controversial score, because it creates interest for obvious reasons.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.