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Forums - General - World Cup qualifiers controversy?

Europeans have magic too...



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pastro243 said:
luisgvm said:
Kasz216 said:
kowenicki said:
@slimenbeast

That is exactly what I was saying. I think global qulaification would be right, why wouldnt it still be the world cup?

all we end up with now is gimmes in the actual finals... pointless.

My way you would actually get more different winners of the trophy as the group stages in the finals would be far tougher and a few upsets would occur.



Because no African or asian teams would make the world cup.

Ever.

Not because the europeon nations are "better" or care more but because the europeon nations are RICHER and can waste more time and money developing world class atheletes.

Sure in countries like the US the teams aren't as good because the best atheltes go to other sports...

but for nations like africa.  It's that they can't afford the massive amount of time effort and money it takes to cultivate world class atheletes and squads.

 

i think money doesnt make a team better. just because you have more money to invest in an team doesnt mean it will be better. because we can see the world cup history and latinoamerica has win a lot of world cups.

Thats because South America has magic, other continents like Europe rely on investment, so only SA and EU can win the WC.

Brazil and Argentina have substatial GDPs compaired to African south asian nations.

Additionally Brazil while a little poorer has a GIANT talent pool to draw from and a large gini coefficent leading to there being plenty of "Upper level" people to set up and recruit the stars of tommorrow.

Argentina is similarly "blessed" when it comes to a large population.


Here is an easy way to put it.  Say there is some phenom at age 10-12 playing soccer in the street or in a local league... and he's showing potetial years ahead of where he should be.

In Countries like England, Brazil, Italy... they would be recruited and watched after given top notch coaching.

In Africa or poorer nations in asia he doesn't get this.  He has to work to survive most likely.

Atheletes now are bigger, stronger and faster then they've ever been.  It's not because they are more enthisaistc about the game.  It's because they're getting trained younger, getting supplements, doctors, nutritionists...

the kinds of things poorer nations can't afford or can on a smaller scale.

 



Esmoreit said:
Slimebeast said:
kowenicki said:
world cup qualifying is actually biased against good to strong european nations, thats the main problem here.

You are insane. Why?


What I think that Kowenicki is saying is that it is unfair against strong European nations because they have an infair chance of being knocked out in favor of weaker non-european nations.

Europe is a continent that loves football, no exceptions really. The internal competition is incredibly strong (Uefa) and the continent has more nations here then for instance northern America or south Amerika... maybe even more so then Afrika I have to check on that. The result is that on paper at least we can expect a nation like Portugal, Finland, Austria, Turkey or the Czech republic to be somewhat better then the US for instance (Again, I would have to check the rankings but you get the gist). Still, Portugal, Finland, Austria, Turkey or the Czech republic seem to be not qualifying. While I'm sure that if we had cross-global competition they would sure to be in by now while it diminishes the chances for the on paper weaker US.

I know that FIFa will compensate by adjusting for the number of groups in each poule and I certainly welcome the US in the fray (with a bit of luck they might even get to enjoy the sport) but I think that Kowenicki means that it is biased like that.

The problem is that pathetic teams from certain parts of the world are qualifying easily into World Cup due to politicall correctness and geographicall key of FIFA when the football powerhouses from Europe which represent much better levels of gameplay often have to stay at home due to murderous qulifications.

Also this could be said about African continent as well to a bit smaller extent.



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Kasz216 said:
pastro243 said:
luisgvm said:
Kasz216 said:
kowenicki said:
@slimenbeast

That is exactly what I was saying. I think global qulaification would be right, why wouldnt it still be the world cup?

all we end up with now is gimmes in the actual finals... pointless.

My way you would actually get more different winners of the trophy as the group stages in the finals would be far tougher and a few upsets would occur.



Because no African or asian teams would make the world cup.

Ever.

Not because the europeon nations are "better" or care more but because the europeon nations are RICHER and can waste more time and money developing world class atheletes.

Sure in countries like the US the teams aren't as good because the best atheltes go to other sports...

but for nations like africa.  It's that they can't afford the massive amount of time effort and money it takes to cultivate world class atheletes and squads.

 

i think money doesnt make a team better. just because you have more money to invest in an team doesnt mean it will be better. because we can see the world cup history and latinoamerica has win a lot of world cups.

Thats because South America has magic, other continents like Europe rely on investment, so only SA and EU can win the WC.

Brazil and Argentina have substatial GDPs compaired to African south asian nations.

Additionally Brazil while a little poorer has a GIANT talent pool to draw from and a large gini coefficent leading to there being plenty of "Upper level" people to set up and recruit the stars of tommorrow.

Argentina is similarly "blessed" when it comes to a large population.


Here is an easy way to put it.  Say there is some phenom at age 10-12 playing soccer in the street or in a local league... and he's showing potetial years ahead of where he should be.

In Countries like England, Brazil, Italy... they would be recruited and watched after given top notch coaching.

In Africa or poorer nations in asia he doesn't get this.  He has to work to survive most likely.

Atheletes now are bigger, stronger and faster then they've ever been.  It's not because they are more enthisaistc about the game.  It's because they're getting trained younger, getting supplements, doctors, nutritionists...

the kinds of things poorer nations can't afford or can on a smaller scale.

 


Yeah, I knwo what you mean, it was a joke the thing I said. Other thing is culture too, there are countries in which people and children dedicate themselves to playing football more than other places and teams know they can find more talents in those places, thats why they search SA and dont search the US or asia as much for talents.



Dude Zlejedi

Calling teams from asia, africa an oceania pathetic is just wrong.

When comparing them to European teams they might look weak. When they are playing within their own competition its actually WAY more exciting than European football. I was watching the J league sometime ago and it was at a much fatser pace than the la liga etc.

Look at the progress these "pathetic" nations have made. Some of these countries just started getting leagues 20 years ago and they can compete with the worlds best. Korea beat Spain Italy in 2002, aUSTRALIA got unlucky vs Italy, usa beat spain, ghana beat czech republic, senegal beat france and their are probably many more results that i cannot think of right now.

Soccer really only started getting popular and developed in these nations about 30 years ago and they are sending teams to the world cup, and their players to top european leagues...

And those teams that have to got to a 2n round of qualification in UEFA liek Ireland would get beaten by teams like South Korea and Australia.



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It wasn't Korea that beaten Spain and Italy, those teams in Korea/Japan World Cup lost to referee only.

And while it's cool they make progress they are playing on mundial so often because of geographicall key at sport level they would strugle to win european qualification groups so often.



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But what if teams like Ireland, Russia, Croatia, Norway, Bosnia, Sweden etc got to the world cup. What would these teams accomplish? None of them including teams like Poland, Czech Republic, Scotland, Swiss, Turkey Greece are capable or winning a world cup with all that stiff competition from teh stronger nations.

The only teams I mentioned that have gone far in a tournament are Greece, Croatia an the Czechs. Even then, they wernt able to repeat there performances. They are capable of making the quarter finals at least and it would be better to have some asian or african even a concacaf nation make it to the quarter finals because they work harder to imrpove due to their lack of resources.

Also, those European countries are just content on staying theway they are. Ireland and Scotland for example have some class players playing in England yet they cant reahc teh World Cup. There is no hunger in them. When you see Korea, Ghana, Nigeria South Africa Japan play in teh World Cup they try extra hard to make thier country proud and give in 100 timesm ore effort. I really hope at leats 3 "pthetic" nations whip spain, italy and Germanys ass next year. Spain got it by USA, Italy almost got it by teh aussies and Germany needs a taste.



Zlejedi said:
It wasn't Korea that beaten Spain and Italy, those teams in Korea/Japan World Cup lost to referee only.

That's what I was going to say.  Especially Spain (Italy kind of did it to themselves, although the referee doomed them).  I still remember Vieri missing from 2 yards out with an open goal!



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Lol but if teams like Spain and Italy are so superior, they should be able to beat Korea EASILY.
Barcelona did it to Chelsea kind of.



CaptainPrefrences said:
Lol but if teams like Spain and Italy are so superior, they should be able to beat Korea EASILY.
Barcelona did it to Chelsea kind of.

Very true.  Italy dominated Korea, scored, and then decided (in typical Italian fashion) that they could grind out 1-0, or maybe just sit back and counterattack for the rest of the match.  They missed easy chances, the refs made bad offside calls, Korea tied the match and then the referee ridiculously sent off Totti in extra time.

Spain also dominated Korea, scored a perfectly legitimate goal that was called back incorrectly for being out of bounds (the ball didn't even touch the line much less cross it, so this was a pretty bad call), had about 10 one-on-one breakaways called back for phantom offsides calls, and still the match went to penalties.

But by all means, even with the bad refereeing they still should have won, both teams were so far superior to Korea.



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