The OP had a point. Most common thing why people are poor, is because of their own actions. In the west atleast. Of course, there are lots of people who can't help their position, but that's the minority.

As for the social welfare, it has two purposes:
Keep the poor people alive.
Keep the poor people spending.

In a modern capitalistic society, we don't have anything, that didn't benefit the capitalist. Sometimes it benefits the poor too and sometimes don't.

Now, when it comes to taxes, keep in mind that government isn't a corporation that's supposed to make profit, governent is supposed to have a bottomline of 0 and use the taxes collected to create welfare for the people.
Everyone can argue how the money could be used better, but the idea is to keep money in the circulation, since the worst thing that could happen is to have it removed from the market into savings, for example.

Well, that isn't too different from Germany I guess. You get a phone for free or for a very cheap price (e.g. iPhone) but are then bound to a 2-year contract. I do understand the necessity of checking peoples credibility, what surprised me though is, that you are actually the person to check their credibility.

As I understand it in Germany there is an institution to check such things. This institution ensures peoples credibility. So if for example one of your credit cards is not working anymore because you are in debt to your knees, it won't help you to just use another credit card (company).

I guess there is a difference in mentality as I know that a big part of the German population is trying to avoid buying anything on credit. One major example for this is that credit cards are mostly not accepted in Germany, at least when compared to the U.S..

I myself don't like to buy anything which I cannot afford buying in cash.

What I am trying to say is that from my perspective - and I am aware that it is the perspective of a foreigner without much of a first-hand experience - the mentality in the U.S. seems to support this kind of things happening. That people live above their means, especially the poor people.

This is not to say that things are so much better here. In fact we are having the same issues, just on a much smaller scale.

@bdbdb: the worst thing that could happen is that people actually save their money? where did that come from? I can agree that a very high savings rate can hurt the economy, but what a low, or even negative savings rate can do... I think we saw that in the financial crisis. And you must not forget that peoples savings are also making up the capital base which the banks are working with, which in exchange are lending money to companys which again keeps the economy rolling.

So if you are saying that saving money is in itself just a bad thing for the economy, I have to strongly disagree with you.

@Sommarnacht: Oh, that wasn't what i meant. What i meant was, that the continous process of people making more than they spend is bad for economy, and i don't mean "normal" savings that you often spend into something, but a situation where money is piling to your account. Inflation do tackle the savings of course, but it would also tackle the motivation to save money.
The situation wouldn't be much different from todays recession, since what's causing the recession, is the money that is leaving the market in the form of loan payments, at the same time people aren't taking as much new loans.

Basically what i said in the earlier post follows Keynesian way of economics.

yeah thats right, im a Scot in a Scottish university so its all paid for. thats my point, though. the costs are still there, they're just picked up by the Government. so i don't really have any right to object to taxes etc. later in life, because i'll have had my share of "freebies".  however, this may well change when i become another tax-paying citizen.

 yeah, but you were in education when YOU were a child, right? and so back and so back through the generations. its like learning first, picking up the tab later. i know that over here we have a lot more government-funded programmes than you guys though, so i can see how its different for people in different countries. as for sales tax, im assuming thats like our VAT (calue added tax) which is applied to most goods and services (at a rate of 15%), but most of the time when im buying things in shops i dont even think "how much of this is tax?" perhaps thats just inexperience on my part though, lol.

agreed, some people have a poor sense of priorities

No, I have never been in a public school ever, I was homeschooled. My parents paid taxes even though we never received a penny for it, and my kids will also be homeschooled. Hopefully my grandkids will be homeschooled since I think homeschooling is great. So that will be ~60 years of taxes just from me (or ~240k) that I never get a peny out of for any of my family in either direction.

Also, our taxes aren't like VAT. VAT is included in the sticker price. So if you buy a 20GBP item, then at the register it is 20GBP. If you buy a $20 item in the US then at the register it is $21.65. (tax varies by area) While most the time I don't care about the sales tax, sometimes you really have to sit down and figure out if you can afford it due to the taxes.

holy shit, i see now why you're so against it. o.0

homeschooling isn't all that common here, most people are state-schoolies. and that VAT thing must be confusing

thank you for taking the time to clarify everything, i really am ignorant of the US way of things.

i don't mind paying taxes if I know that its going to a good place. Schools? Sure no problem. Roads? Yeah we need roads. 911? Absolutely. Police/Fire/Ambulance? Check, check, and check.

Even unemployment/welfare/foodstands/SSI for people like ironman who has a good head on his shoulders, but just happens to be down on his luck because of the times.

But what I cannot stand is those people who use MY tax dollars, not to get themselves out of a bad situation, but to buy stupid crap AND THEN find loop holes to continue receiving benefits.

People living above their means is a scary thing. They buy a $250,000 house when they're on welfare or making minimum wage.

Well, as I said, the worst thing about the school tax is they give us a rebate. Which is stupid.

The worst thing about taxes (in their current form anyway) is that they are oppressive to poor people. I know some people that are going to lose their house even though they own it. They owe a lot in taxes that they can't afford and because they owe property tax if they can't pay it off the government will kick them out of their house and sell it to collect. Now, it is partially the situations surrounding them as people refused to pay for services rendered, but they are partially to blame for their problems. Due to not paying off high interest loans compared to low interest loans (and instead they piled up) and not eating at home for lunch ($3/lunch compared to $8, which would save them ~3k/year) amonst other easy money savers, it still really sucks for them. If they swapped over to an income tax only, or possibly a income/sales tax combination they wouldn't be threatened to lose their house.

Ultimately, if you want to be rich, learn to pinch pennies now, as simple tricks can really add up in the future once you really have a good savings to work with. Ultimately the rule is, spend as little as possible and pay as late as possible while collecting as early as possible and as much as possible.