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Forums - Microsoft - Real Thread about the Real Price Drop..It's time to Finish the Fight!!

selnor on 22 August 2009
inverted3reality said:
selnor said:
inverted3reality said:
selnor said:
Seihyouken said:
Is it really accurate to call the new $299.99 "Elite" model a price drop? The fact of the matter is that the 360 isn't any cheaper than it was two months ago. $199.99 and $299.99 (and Microsoft's Euro/Pound/Yen conversions) are still the two opening prices with which to purchase a 360. All that's changed is that there simply isn't an option to pay $100 more for 60 more GBs, an HDMI cable and a black finish.

Speaking of which, now that the Elite console doesn't offer an HDMI cable, can it really be considered an Elite? The truth is that all the current Elite is is essentially a black pro with 60 more GBs.

No matter how you look at it, Microsoft's move of "price-cutting" the Elite to $299 isn't any different than when they exchanged the 20GB Pros for 60GB models last year or when Sony turned the 40GBs into 80GBs. It's not price cutting. What it is is adding value which has never led to a noticable increase in hardware sales so far this generation and won't begin to now.

If Microsoft wants to avoid completely getting dominated by Sony and Nintendo in the similar or even worse way than Sony was dominated by Microsoft and Nintendo last year, they're going to have to actually drop the price of at least one of their two models.

You assume that the PS3 being $299 is what consumers have been waiting for. Personally I believe it will get an initial spike and fall back to last again. I believe in the mainstream non hardcore market the 360 games offer more to those people. The 360 beat PS3 this week by nearly double the sales.

Also assuming Blu Ray is what everyone wants is also flawed. I wont buy Blu Ray because of the extortinate film prices. The same film in UK can release on DVD for £10 cheaper. The average consumer sees that, hence why Blu Ray still has just one aisle in all major UK outlets and is not even sold in some small outlets.

It's my opinion though. We will see how it pans out.

Actually, people are buying blu-ray. And, whether you like it or not, it IS going to become the standard for disc media. Blu-ray will be the only sold media for movies soon enough. Do you not remember VHS to DVD? You realize that took a long time as well? The difference is now that our technology improves at a very fast pace. Before you know it HDTV's are going to be much cheaper. When that happens, and the dev prices of blu-ray movies drop, dvds will be fazed out. It is a dead format, the movie industry will eventually no longer support it.

 

Blu-ray will be the last supported hard copy media for entertainment. After that, it's all digital. And you wont be seeing all digital for at least another 10 years.. because our internet infastructure is not good enough for it right now.

 

Sony has themselves in a fantastic place. Blu-ray scales much better than any other media. If you get a bigger DVD.. well.. you still get a linear increase in write speed, while blu ray is exponential?(Possibly quadratic, I have not looked hard at it)  In terms of capacity, people were all on about the new 100gb DVD, but 100gb, 200gb and 400gb blu-ray discs are already done. Infact, they're working on 1 TB blu-ray discs right now.

 

Yes blu-ray is not fully adopted yet, yes the prices are high, but they will come down and people will go over. What happens when our tvs go to a higher resolution? Of course they will, my monitor does now. You'll need 50gb or MORE to do that. You simply cannot fit a 1080p movie onto a DVD, it just wont work. Imagine larger..?

It didn't take that long for VHS to be taken over.

DVD will always be around alongside BLURAY. I can't ever see Bluray as the dominant format. To many households dont see a picture difference worth it. Downloads of films and media thanks to Netflix and Live has actually increased faster than anybody thought this year. I remeber seeing an article saying it's growth this year was faster than Bluray over it's first 4 month period. We are talking about HD films downloaded against how many Bluray films sold. It was only US though.

What you're talking out of thin air selnor.
Blu-Ray adoption rates are significantly faster than DVD.

 

http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/01/08/live-from-the-2009-blu-ray-disc-association-press-conference/


They are talking about the actual players when they say that figure. Which includes the PS3. But look at the movie disc sales. They aren't that great.

If you include PS2 in DVD players when it released it went off the hook. It cant be compared because PS3 was essentially a launch player. And many PS3 owners dont buy films on Bluray I know 2 who haven't bought a single disc. The only 2 people I know with a PS3. Before Bluray ever takes over from DVD, downloads will be huge.



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inverted3reality on 22 August 2009
selnor said:
inverted3reality said:
selnor said:
inverted3reality said:
selnor said:
Seihyouken said:
Is it really accurate to call the new $299.99 "Elite" model a price drop? The fact of the matter is that the 360 isn't any cheaper than it was two months ago. $199.99 and $299.99 (and Microsoft's Euro/Pound/Yen conversions) are still the two opening prices with which to purchase a 360. All that's changed is that there simply isn't an option to pay $100 more for 60 more GBs, an HDMI cable and a black finish.

Speaking of which, now that the Elite console doesn't offer an HDMI cable, can it really be considered an Elite? The truth is that all the current Elite is is essentially a black pro with 60 more GBs.

No matter how you look at it, Microsoft's move of "price-cutting" the Elite to $299 isn't any different than when they exchanged the 20GB Pros for 60GB models last year or when Sony turned the 40GBs into 80GBs. It's not price cutting. What it is is adding value which has never led to a noticable increase in hardware sales so far this generation and won't begin to now.

If Microsoft wants to avoid completely getting dominated by Sony and Nintendo in the similar or even worse way than Sony was dominated by Microsoft and Nintendo last year, they're going to have to actually drop the price of at least one of their two models.

You assume that the PS3 being $299 is what consumers have been waiting for. Personally I believe it will get an initial spike and fall back to last again. I believe in the mainstream non hardcore market the 360 games offer more to those people. The 360 beat PS3 this week by nearly double the sales.

Also assuming Blu Ray is what everyone wants is also flawed. I wont buy Blu Ray because of the extortinate film prices. The same film in UK can release on DVD for £10 cheaper. The average consumer sees that, hence why Blu Ray still has just one aisle in all major UK outlets and is not even sold in some small outlets.

It's my opinion though. We will see how it pans out.

Actually, people are buying blu-ray. And, whether you like it or not, it IS going to become the standard for disc media. Blu-ray will be the only sold media for movies soon enough. Do you not remember VHS to DVD? You realize that took a long time as well? The difference is now that our technology improves at a very fast pace. Before you know it HDTV's are going to be much cheaper. When that happens, and the dev prices of blu-ray movies drop, dvds will be fazed out. It is a dead format, the movie industry will eventually no longer support it.

 

Blu-ray will be the last supported hard copy media for entertainment. After that, it's all digital. And you wont be seeing all digital for at least another 10 years.. because our internet infastructure is not good enough for it right now.

 

Sony has themselves in a fantastic place. Blu-ray scales much better than any other media. If you get a bigger DVD.. well.. you still get a linear increase in write speed, while blu ray is exponential?(Possibly quadratic, I have not looked hard at it)  In terms of capacity, people were all on about the new 100gb DVD, but 100gb, 200gb and 400gb blu-ray discs are already done. Infact, they're working on 1 TB blu-ray discs right now.

 

Yes blu-ray is not fully adopted yet, yes the prices are high, but they will come down and people will go over. What happens when our tvs go to a higher resolution? Of course they will, my monitor does now. You'll need 50gb or MORE to do that. You simply cannot fit a 1080p movie onto a DVD, it just wont work. Imagine larger..?

It didn't take that long for VHS to be taken over.

DVD will always be around alongside BLURAY. I can't ever see Bluray as the dominant format. To many households dont see a picture difference worth it. Downloads of films and media thanks to Netflix and Live has actually increased faster than anybody thought this year. I remeber seeing an article saying it's growth this year was faster than Bluray over it's first 4 month period. We are talking about HD films downloaded against how many Bluray films sold. It was only US though.

What you're talking out of thin air selnor.
Blu-Ray adoption rates are significantly faster than DVD.

 

http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/01/08/live-from-the-2009-blu-ray-disc-association-press-conference/


They are talking about the actual players when they say that figure. Which includes the PS3. But look at the movie disc sales. They aren't that great.

If you include PS2 in DVD players when it released it went off the hook. It cant be compared because PS3 was essentially a launch player. And many PS3 owners dont buy films on Bluray I know 2 who haven't bought a single disc. The only 2 people I know with a PS3. Before Bluray ever takes over from DVD, downloads will be huge.

Sadly neither of us know that for sure, but current trends and costs of internet providers say you are absolutely incorrect.
2ish more years and dvd movies cease to exist.



dsister44 on 22 August 2009
selnor said:
inverted3reality said:

What you're talking out of thin air selnor.
Blu-Ray adoption rates are significantly faster than DVD.

 

http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/01/08/live-from-the-2009-blu-ray-disc-association-press-conference/


They are talking about the actual players when they say that figure. Which includes the PS3. But look at the movie disc sales. They aren't that great.

If you include PS2 in DVD players when it released it went off the hook. It cant be compared because PS3 was essentially a launch player. And many PS3 owners dont buy films on Bluray I know 2 who haven't bought a single disc. The only 2 people I know with a PS3. Before Bluray ever takes over from DVD, downloads will be huge.

3, I have not bought one Blu-ray disc.



numonex on 22 August 2009

XBox 360 Elite 120GB HDD replaces the XBox 360 Pro 60GB HDD model. Elite gets a $100 price cut and the Pro is no more.

XBox 360 Elite is now only $299 - the premium XBox 360 system. Hurry stocks will not last XBox 360 Elite is a bargain. Aesthetically it looks a lot better than the PS3 Slim.

XBox 360 has a much bigger, better games library than the PS3.



psrock on 22 August 2009

The PS3 has a Slim chance now, right.



 Next Gen 

11/20/09 04:25 makingmusic476 Warning Other (Your avatar is borderline NSFW. Please keep it for as long as possible.)
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inverted3reality on 22 August 2009
dsister44 said:
selnor said:
inverted3reality said:

What you're talking out of thin air selnor.
Blu-Ray adoption rates are significantly faster than DVD.

 

http://www.engadgethd.com/2009/01/08/live-from-the-2009-blu-ray-disc-association-press-conference/


They are talking about the actual players when they say that figure. Which includes the PS3. But look at the movie disc sales. They aren't that great.

If you include PS2 in DVD players when it released it went off the hook. It cant be compared because PS3 was essentially a launch player. And many PS3 owners dont buy films on Bluray I know 2 who haven't bought a single disc. The only 2 people I know with a PS3. Before Bluray ever takes over from DVD, downloads will be huge.

3, I have not bought one Blu-ray disc.

I have over 100 blu ray movies, do I make up for all  3 of you? yes.



Munkeh111 on 22 August 2009
Zizzla_Rachet said:
Munkeh111 said:
Do you get Netflix with your elite? No, you have to pay for it after the first month... and that is only true in the US.

We have already had several discussions on this, but I don't think it changes much, people generally go for an HDD version or an arcade, it will boost a little, but not the same as the PS3 price cut

NEtflix is an NA Service...And MS never said you were getting anything free...They always stated at no additional charge to gOld members...Since you not a gold memeber...And not american..you have no idea how much people actually use this...at least half of my friends list uses Netflix daily...No one is disscussing Netflix..casper was asking a question and I did not unstand it about netflix and his connection...Again..MS never promised Free Netflix on you 360 streaming...but you can use it on your XBL gold account.It's about the value..On PSN if you rent a movie..it's 2.00 or more depending on the movie.MS offers the same movies with the exception of the Sony one's but I don't know if they are on there and on top of that they offer Netflix compatability as well...Again...it's value... 10 movie rentals on PSN in one month 20 dollars* 10 movie rentals on XBL with netflix 8.99...In NA this counts...

You obviously haven't seen their LBP song stealing adverts... that says Xbox live is free, I know it does not say gold but still, confusing for the consumer as that advert talks about online MP. The only reason I brought it up is because you said those are the main battlepoints, Netflix versus blu-ray. And yes, I am a gold user at the moment, I probably worth it as I played a lot of Halo Wars online and a bit of Gears 2, and it is generally useful for sending messages from your PC and getting content earlier.

And for me, it is not worth it, but that is because I don't really watch many movies, and I like having the tangible media. And I have a PS3 attached to the main TV in the house as a blu-ray player, and so renting through that is going to become more useful when that launches.

Netflix is clearly a great service, I think the gold subcription offers good value for money in the US, I just don't think you should charge for online MP, and it is not a factor that can be considered worldwide



Stan85 on 22 August 2009
Cthulhu said:
Like it or not, last or first, PS3 is the better device at the same price point

Wait for the 50$ price drop on all the models...in october or movember.

Why? because of the die shrinking inside the 360...less expensive,less heat,less power usage.

The same was done with the ps3 and they managed to do a 100$ price drop.



dsister44 on 22 August 2009

That is a rather strange response. We are arguing the adoption of Blu-ray disc. One person buying a lot of discs does not prove the adoption rate. A lot of people buy PS3 just for the games



Munkeh111 on 22 August 2009
Stan85 said:
Cthulhu said:
Like it or not, last or first, PS3 is the better device at the same price point

Wait for the 50$ price drop on all the models...in october or movember.

Why? because of the die shrinking inside the 360...less expensive,less heat,less power usage.

The same was done with the ps3 and they managed to do a 100$ price drop.

Did you not see the financial results of Microsoft... unless 360 sales are half PS3 sales, they won't need to