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Forums - Microsoft - Microsoft Thread: Evidence of new Xbox 360 holiday bundles

madskillz on 01 October 2007
TheBigFatJ said:
madskillz said:
starcraft said:
The problem with this is that those prices will struggle to compete with a $399 PS3, even if the PS3 is dummed down. You cant have a blu-ray-less console at just 50 dollars cheaper even if it does come with good games and have access to a better library. it also has a smaller hard drive

I beg to differ. Seriously, if Sony drops the price of the P$3 to $399, it will be losing money like a hemophiliac losing blood. They would be in it just to say they beat the 360, but it would still need a huge surge to sustain momentum. And at what cost? Just look at it - the 40gb PS3, with just software emulation, will compete with a 360 with 2 games (That's like $100) and the even lower Arcade version at $279. The PS3 will still suffer a gaming defiency, and with no real games out this holiday season, the sales will surge temporarily and then start falling again.

My question is ... what compelling reasons NOW does the average gamer have to buy a PS3? Nothing comes to mind for me ...

And of course, M$ will just match their price cut - eventually - but with Halo 3 burning the charts, Sony's looking very, very desperate these days ...

Getting two free games isn't like $100. It's like 80 cents. And if you don't want the games, it's no value at all. Giving people $100 off would be real value, and that was a big part of MS' success last holiday. Let people decide which games to get with that money.

The average gamer may have no compelling reasons to buy the PS3 now other than the Playstation brand. And for many gamers, that is still enough. They may not be able to point to a game and say, "Man, I want that" but they know the PS2 is where they had their fun last generation and the PS3 seems like the logical choice. They don't know MS and Nintendo have all of the good games right now.

A $399 PS3 would be compelling for me. The biggest reason I prefer the 360 over the PS3 right now is because the 360 has Viva Pinata, and that's not even for me but for my fiancee. Sure, there are a few other reasons I want a 360 and no reasons I want a PS3 yet, but there just isn't enough motivation to put another device in my crowded entertainment center.

Want to know why MS won't offer good discounts this holiday? Because they need to show their investors they can generate a profit. They've told them that this will be the fiscal year they generate a profit, and even if they don't count the cost of repairs and considering the huge financial windfall from Halo 3, they are going to be right on the edge of generating a profit. This would be a big opportunity for Sony if they had any good games coming out.


I hear you on the free games - but still, folks that don't like them will flip them on eBay for $40, and you get your money back, to a point.

As far as M$ giving gamers $100, you know they wouldn't do that ... they are selling consoles without a price cut - more profit for them. And with the 65nm chips coming out - that will lure folks as well. And you are correct, folks don't know about lineups for the Wii and 360 - and the 360's got one strong one, definitely.

I have a PS2 and was convinced I'd buy a PS3 before it came out - didn't really think about a 360 until I played 'Call of Duty 2' on a 360 in Wal-Mart. I was hooked. I also saw Ghost Recon and a few others coming out, so I made the plunge and haven't regretted it. For the PS3, I just sat back and saw how Sony had misstep after misstep. And M$ doesn't have to worry about the PS3 hurting its sales - it's hurting itself. So sad ...

And Viva Pinata is a trip - but my Wii has really stolen its thunder in our house! 



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Zyzomys on 01 October 2007

A price cut doesn't mean anything if 360s keep dying due to hardware failures.

It must really bug you that the PS3 has never out sold the Xbox 360. All those failures, and the sales continue to grow. Xbox Live Marketplace slows down, and the sales march on. When will it end? When will the Sony domination begin? :)



libellule on 01 October 2007

- the PS3 has always sold out or being about equal to the Xbox360 in all the territory excep in UK and NA and except for the month of september 2007 where the Xbox360 was dominating

- The Xbox360 sales are decreasing in the whole european market, including the UK, since the 23 august 2007 (see VGchartz : 44k 40k 38k etc... when the PS3 sales are stable)

- The Xbox360 sales are still nothing in japan (maybe 6k this week for Halo3 ?)

So yes, the Xbox360 sales are very good in NA but outside it is nothing.
Remember the Xbox360 is using her main bullet right now with some price drop + big games (bioshock/halo3). At the opposite, the PS3 have average/good title (Lair/HS/Warhawk) and no price drop.

It is also right to say that the very good Xbox360 numbers in NA allow the console to outsell the PS3 easly in WW (last NA : 88k Xbox360, 30k PS3 !!).

But how long before the Europe+japan wake up to save the PS3 ?
How long before Sony use his own bullet (GT5/MGS4+price drop+the potential BR adoption by the mass market)

That are the questions ...



Time to Work !

madskillz on 01 October 2007
libellule said:
- the PS3 has always sold out or being about equal to the Xbox360 in all the territory excep in UK and NA and except for the month of september 2007 where the Xbox360 was dominating

- The Xbox360 sales are decreasing in the whole european market, including the UK, since the 23 august 2007 (see VGchartz : 44k 40k 38k etc... when the PS3 sales are stable)

- The Xbox360 sales are still nothing in japan (maybe 6k this week for Halo3 ?)

So yes, the Xbox360 sales are very good in NA but outside it is nothing.
Remember the Xbox360 is using her main bullet right now with some price drop + big games (bioshock/halo3). At the opposite, the PS3 have average/good title (Lair/HS/Warhawk) and no price drop.

It is also right to say that the very good Xbox360 numbers in NA allow the console to outsell the PS3 easly in WW (last NA : 88k Xbox360, 30k PS3 !!).

But how long before the Europe+japan wake up to save the PS3 ?
How long before Sony use his own bullet (GT5/MGS4+price drop+the potential BR adoption by the mass market)

That are the questions ...

And you are basing this on ... I know you may love the PS3, but apparently, you don't see the stagnant numbers of the machine worldwide. Where is it leading? And as far as Japan, ok ... it's selling like 10-11K vs. 1k ... like those are killer numbers. Over time, maybe that would erode the overall lead, but that's like trying to transplant a beach with a plastic spoon.

The PS3 had a couple weeks, but what's the overall picture? A lot of folks are still holding off buying a 360 or a PS3 because of several reasons - for the PS3, lack of games - and the console is schizo - doesn't know for sure if it wants to be a computer entertainment center - not sure if it wants to be a Blu Ray player - the cheapiest, mind you - and not sure if it wants to be a gaming system. I mean, come on ... all I ever here about the PS3 are the rumble controller ... the new DVR features ... and rarely about the new, fresh gaming lineup that keeps getting put back - and back ... and back. Please, spare me the drama.

A lot of folks were duped into buying a PS3 because of the PS in front. They were *loyal* to Sony and it's obvious - look at the software numbers. Have ANY of the PS3 games hit a million yet? Why? Sony sold it as the cheapiest Blu Ray player on the market ... AND it plays games.

2008 will make or break the PS3. If there are still more and more excuses as the PS3 enters year two, I would advise you to jettison your PS3 stock and just turn to the dark side of the force, young Jedi.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but the PS3 is only leading the 360 in ...

Japan - 11k vs. 1k (gasp!)

Germany - 2,453 vs. 1,726

Spain - 3,039 vs. 2,703

Italy - 2,533 vs. 2,487

Other Europe - 3,454 vs. 2,583

But ... world totals overall - excluding NA - are: 138,109 (360) vs. 66,179 (PS3)

And you are saying that the PS3 is gonna make a comeback? The PS3's price drop was a joke - and there was a surge of sales but it fizzled like a 40-year-old soda pop ... and the 360 went how long without a pricecut? Are you just pulling my leg to get a rise outta me? ROTFL ...

I am calling it like I see it. After gaming for nearly 30 years, I have seen tons of stuff ... bonehead ideas, stupid endeavours and the like. This, my microphoned friend, is a steaming pile if I've ever saw one ...



W29 on 01 October 2007

@madskillz

Good point and analysis I agree on all points.



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endimion on 02 October 2007

@madskillz

yeah agreed I would add that in most places the total sale is at almost double the PS3 everywhere (yeah I know one more year) but still with the selling rate of both console) you'd have to have either the XB sale dropping of 50% and stay that way for a while or the PS3 sale almost triple... neither of it is happening anytime soon... and you'll have a snowball effect....like for PS2.... so the more XB sale and PS3 stay behind even with the same difference..... the less chance PS3 as to come back even with halo 3 like games..... for many reason 3 party letting down PS.... people seeing XB as a generic product especially kids and elders (PS2 effect, how many of you have heard a grand ma say Playsatation what ever the console of her grand son was ??? ).... etc..... it's a principle of the market...... PS3 could get the best game in the world ever fitting the taste of every single players on the planet..... if it's TOO LATE IT'S TOO LATE (for that generation of course)
well I'm not saying it's too late yet though... I'm just saying that as more time is passing the toughest task is going to be for Sony.... for video games.... they can still market their console as a BR player as main function in the future if they are dead for gaming....

we'll see... meeting in 365 and we'll know better about PS3 capacity to come back or not....



madskillz on 02 October 2007
W29 said:
@madskillz

Good point and analysis I agree on all points.

 Thanks a million! I would like to buy a PS3 one day, but right now, it's not appealing to me at all. Warhawk reminds me of Crimson Skies - and I'll just pop that into my 360 and play. The only other game I want to play is that F1 racing game. 



madskillz on 02 October 2007
endimion said:
@madskillz

yeah agreed I would add that in most places the total sale is at almost double the PS3 everywhere (yeah I know one more year) but still with the selling rate of both console) you'd have to have either the XB sale dropping of 50% and stay that way for a while or the PS3 sale almost triple... neither of it is happening anytime soon... and you'll have a snowball effect....like for PS2.... so the more XB sale and PS3 stay behind even with the same difference..... the less chance PS3 as to come back even with halo 3 like games..... for many reason 3 party letting down PS.... people seeing XB as a generic product especially kids and elders (PS2 effect, how many of you have heard a grand ma say Playsatation what ever the console of her grand son was ??? ).... etc..... it's a principle of the market...... PS3 could get the best game in the world ever fitting the taste of every single players on the planet..... if it's TOO LATE IT'S TOO LATE (for that generation of course)
well I'm not saying it's too late yet though... I'm just saying that as more time is passing the toughest task is going to be for Sony.... for video games.... they can still market their console as a BR player as main function in the future if they are dead for gaming....

we'll see... meeting in 365 and we'll know better about PS3 capacity to come back or not....

I see your points and I definitely agree. It's not over just yet for the PS3, but the big thing is - investors. You have to please them. If you don't, they'll call for your head.

A lot of companies are frustrated with developing for the PS3. I have been gaming since Pong, but when I heard that Lair's creator was calling out the PS3 right before his game dropped, I know it was trouble. I have said this sooooooo many times - I guess folks just ignore my post count, but so what - but developers want to get paid - feed their families - and if they can do that with less effort, why not? Doing it for the sake of gamers went out with bellbottoms, passion marks and butterfly collars. Folks are in it FTW - and if they can do that making games on the 360 and Wii, they'll do just that. And the press is really covering the PS3's slow ascent closely. And it doesn't help when  you have a solid week of Halo 3 coverage, or stories about Wii shortages. Folks listen to that ... and the PS3's lackluster of exclusives is killing them big time. Who in the devil wants a game that has a man flying on a dragon? I mean - you saw how horrible Eragon was ... they yanked the demo off Live like within an hour or two. And Heavenly Sword ... yeah ... if I want some good ol' slashing, gimme Ninja Gaiden.

And GTAIV will be complete on the 360. A lot of folks say they won't buy it - the extra content - but trust me - after they play the game, they'll get it.

As much as I was rooting for Sony to make this a contest, I am pretty much resigned to believe the PS3 will go the way of the Jaguar, the Sega 32-X, 3DO and the Apple video game ...