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Forums - Microsoft - 3rd video for Splinter Cell is up

Akvod on 30 May 2009
Slimebeast said:
Akvod said:
Slimebeast said:
Akvod said:
Until they redeem themselves for DA (especially the bad porting for PS3), and for the horrible, horrible gameplay footage of Convictions a few years back, and return Sam Fisher where he really belongs (back in the shadows), then I won't be jealous about this game being exclusive.

Please, give us old Clancy-esque technothriller stories, with shadow/light+sound mechanics, instead of a Bourne-esque thriller, with social stealth+hand to hand combat.


Why was it horrible? Only in light of SC being a stealth game I hope.

And what was the footage, and was there any footage even? I forgot.

Please don't tell me that you're equating Light and Shadow stealth with Social stealth?

Will you even equate MGS with SC? They're both stealth, but they're completely different. I've heard the most ridiculous arguments such as "the crowd is now the new shadow". Shadow and light stealth is about hiding by staying out of sight. Social is about hiding by staying plain sight.

I'm sorry to be accustaory, but have you even played Splinter Cell 1-3? How can you possibly imagine that social stealth and light and shadow stealth are remotely the same? It's like saying Portal or Mirror's Edge are the same as Call of Duty because they share the FPS frame. But the inner contents are completely different.

lol, no I haven't. Not for real, Ive only tried them for a couple of minutes or maybe an hour or so.

I don't really like stealth games (xcept for fake-stealth games like Assassin's Creed).

I wasn't taking any stance by my comment lol. I just wondered if it was in light of the "true" vs "non-true" Splinter Cell point of view, or if the trailer hinted anything about bad game making qualities in general for the next iteration of SC, but from ur reply I understand it's the former.

Now I'm gonna watch all those trailers u posted.

I'm sorry, I thought when you bolded "stealth" you were emphasizing that they were both stealth games, so therefore, they were the same. The internet is hard to catch subtle things that (such as sarcasm).

The dialogue in the bank one is fucking awesome. That is the true character of Sam Fisher, not the emo shit you hear in 4 and the trailers for 5 from a younger Sam (yes, they pushed back his age to late 40's or early 50's I think).



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Akvod on 30 May 2009
Cueil said:
Akvod said:
Cueil said:
Montreal makes the odd games... Shanghai did 2 and DA


Montreal made the good games (1 and 3, and last gen DA. Pandora was decent though, and really was great for its multiplayer, despite me sucking at it). I don't like their job with AC, and I'm not excited about social stealth. It's a sub genre of its own, and the last game footage had NOTHING in common with any of the SC's. There's a difference between change, and a complete overhall (sp?).


I really depends on how far they take it... and if they keeps some of the elements in... one of the reasons they droped the game and restarted was because of the bad preview from fans and the excuse that AC's crowd system was farther ahead.  I just hope that they balance the gameplay... maybe an open world setting... you have to make your way to your destination and that is social stealth, but once there it takes a more traditional stealth.

The most I'll compromise for is very similar to what you said. You know how you press R1 for "Active mode" in AC? I hope you can "toggle" between social and stealth mode, so you'll be in social mode, walking down a street, being followed by 2 FBI agents. You quietly slip into a dark alley, quickly go into stealth mode, and like a cat, rush up ladder, or hide near a dumpster, and take the 2 guys out the traditional way.

But I doubt it =/ I can't see Ubisoft listening to their fans. When have corporations ever done that? They're still going with the Bourne theme. Hell, they changed everything in DA so that it'll be more appealing to new fans, but by completely compromising the atmosphere, story, and character =/

They just needed better marketing if they were looking for a million seller. I mean, SC was released in a really crowded market anyway, and was still very popular amongst hard core gamers. They shouldn't of fucking kicked that hardcore base in the balls, because what happens if they don't appeal to the casual/new fans? They'll have nobody to fall back on. You need the hardcore as a support base in case the shit hits the fan.



Cueil on 30 May 2009

emo Sam has reasons to be emo... his daughter just died... that's pretty hard on a father... I'm sure she was a big reason he fought



 
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Slimebeast on 30 May 2009

Akvod don't kill me, but damn I would have prefered the gameplay of how Conviction was first planned to be (before the overhaul).

The crew talking in my mic all the time is very annoying (I fink MGS games are like that too rite?) and it's painful to walk around slowly and carefully watching the surroundings paying attention to every lil detail.

I wanna run and gun lol.



Quickdraw McGraw on 30 May 2009
Shadowblind said:
Cueil said:
Chaos Theory is still the best Stealth Action game hands down

Damn straight it is. As far as actual STEALTH goes in games, Splinter Cell is king without competition. The only besmirchment on the record is DA which wasn't made by the same company as 1, 2, 3, and 5.

Clearly you guys haven't played the Thief series .



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Cueil on 30 May 2009
Quickdraw McGraw said:
Shadowblind said:
Cueil said:
Chaos Theory is still the best Stealth Action game hands down

Damn straight it is. As far as actual STEALTH goes in games, Splinter Cell is king without competition. The only besmirchment on the record is DA which wasn't made by the same company as 1, 2, 3, and 5.

Clearly you guys haven't played the Thief series .

I have and it's not as good... they were limited technologicly untill 3... and really I'm sure if you're a hardcore fan you probably have issues with 3.



 
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Cueil on 30 May 2009
Akvod said:
Cueil said:
Akvod said:
Cueil said:
Montreal makes the odd games... Shanghai did 2 and DA


Montreal made the good games (1 and 3, and last gen DA. Pandora was decent though, and really was great for its multiplayer, despite me sucking at it). I don't like their job with AC, and I'm not excited about social stealth. It's a sub genre of its own, and the last game footage had NOTHING in common with any of the SC's. There's a difference between change, and a complete overhall (sp?).


I really depends on how far they take it... and if they keeps some of the elements in... one of the reasons they droped the game and restarted was because of the bad preview from fans and the excuse that AC's crowd system was farther ahead.  I just hope that they balance the gameplay... maybe an open world setting... you have to make your way to your destination and that is social stealth, but once there it takes a more traditional stealth.

The most I'll compromise for is very similar to what you said. You know how you press R1 for "Active mode" in AC? I hope you can "toggle" between social and stealth mode, so you'll be in social mode, walking down a street, being followed by 2 FBI agents. You quietly slip into a dark alley, quickly go into stealth mode, and like a cat, rush up ladder, or hide near a dumpster, and take the 2 guys out the traditional way.

But I doubt it =/ I can't see Ubisoft listening to their fans. When have corporations ever done that? They're still going with the Bourne theme. Hell, they changed everything in DA so that it'll be more appealing to new fans, but by completely compromising the atmosphere, story, and character =/

They just needed better marketing if they were looking for a million seller. I mean, SC was released in a really crowded market anyway, and was still very popular amongst hard core gamers. They shouldn't of fucking kicked that hardcore base in the balls, because what happens if they don't appeal to the casual/new fans? They'll have nobody to fall back on. You need the hardcore as a support base in case the shit hits the fan.

But if they do that... I will be happy... damnit you got me even more excited... *sigh*  now I've got my hopes up that it will meet our lofty expectations



 
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Akvod on 30 May 2009
Cueil said:
emo Sam has reasons to be emo... his daughter just died... that's pretty hard on a father... I'm sure she was a big reason he fought

I know, it was such a Deus Ex Machina though, and a really cheap and sappy one. He also continued fighting after his daughter died. The reason why he became completely emo was oh noes, Enrica died! Lambert dying felt a bit like a copout too.

The best analogy I can give is when both Micky and... Apollo died in Rocky III and IV. I fucking hate that shit (Rocky I, II, and Balboa are the good ones, with I being the only excellent one).

@ Slimebeast

I'm not arguing that SC Convictions (in its current form, before anything gets revealed at E3) won't be fun. As much as I hated AC, many people loved it. I'm just saying that I felt that it's unfair for Ubisoft to abandon the veryfans that built up the name and franchise of Splinter Cell, so they can use that very same and powerful brand to push for more profits.

If you want to play Social Stealth, or a TPS you have so many options and so many dedicated franchises and brands for that. But not only have they completely fucked up a franchise, which was built on S/L stealth, but we have nothing left (I never played Thief, and haven't heard anything about Thief 3).

As for action, the beauty of CT was that you COULD go and shoot everyone. Granted, you can strafe, nor stand in place and shoot. But you could still, as long as you use stealth and suprise to your advantage, go out and bash a door (knocking out the guy in front of it), and immedietly shoot your shotgun attachment, and proceed to spray everyone with you SMG/Assault Rifle.



Cueil on 30 May 2009
Akvod said:
Cueil said:
emo Sam has reasons to be emo... his daughter just died... that's pretty hard on a father... I'm sure she was a big reason he fought

I know, it was such a Deus Ex Machina though, and a really cheap and sappy one. He also continued fighting after his daughter died. The reason why he became completely emo was oh noes, Enrica died! Lambert dying felt a bit like a copout too.

The best analogy I can give is when both Micky and... Apollo died in Rocky III and IV. I fucking hate that shit (Rocky I, II, and Balboa are the good ones, with I being the only excellent one).

@ Slimebeast

I'm not arguing that SC Convictions (in its current form, before anything gets revealed at E3) won't be fun. As much as I hated AC, many people loved it. I'm just saying that I felt that it's unfair for Ubisoft to abandon the veryfans that built up the name and franchise of Splinter Cell, so they can use that very same and powerful brand to push for more profits.

If you want to play Social Stealth, or a TPS you have so many options and so many dedicated franchises and brands for that. But not only have they completely fucked up a franchise, which was built on S/L stealth, but we have nothing left (I never played Thief, and haven't heard anything about Thief 3).

As for action, the beauty of CT was that you COULD go and shoot everyone. Granted, you can strafe, nor stand in place and shoot. But you could still, as long as you use stealth and suprise to your advantage, go out and bash a door (knocking out the guy in front of it), and immedietly shoot your shotgun attachment, and proceed to spray everyone with you SMG/Assault Rifle.


You kill Erica?  AND Lambert!  You're fucking evil... I lost major points to save both... anyway... I can totally see where you are comming from.  I really do love the tactics that were prominent in SC:CT... I was a mix between Ninja and Merc... Sometimes I felt massive deadly force was need other times I just wanted to snap some fools necks



 
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Slimebeast on 30 May 2009
Akvod said:

 

@ Slimebeast

I'm not arguing that SC Convictions (in its current form, before anything gets revealed at E3) won't be fun. As much as I hated AC, many people loved it. I'm just saying that I felt that it's unfair for Ubisoft to abandon the veryfans that built up the name and franchise of Splinter Cell, so they can use that very same and powerful brand to push for more profits.

If you want to play Social Stealth, or a TPS you have so many options and so many dedicated franchises and brands for that. But not only have they completely fucked up a franchise, which was built on S/L stealth, but we have nothing left (I never played Thief, and haven't heard anything about Thief 3).

As for action, the beauty of CT was that you COULD go and shoot everyone. Granted, you can strafe, nor stand in place and shoot. But you could still, as long as you use stealth and suprise to your advantage, go out and bash a door (knocking out the guy in front of it), and immedietly shoot your shotgun attachment, and proceed to spray everyone with you SMG/Assault Rifle.


I completely agree with you. I wouldn't want to hijack a franchise like that, just because it happens to suit my tastes. As you say, there's plenty of other games to satisfy those needs, while SC is in a very specific niche.

Of course Ubisoft should keep SC 'true'.