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Forums - Sony - Sony Considers Selling Production Facility

Besides the obvious considerations, that this may mean that Sony wants to find a way to make the PS3 cheaper, also I think that this may be a way to pressure Toshiba into just bowing out of the HD-DVD/BD war to end it once and for all or even coming to BD's side.  In other words, if Sony demonstrates that they want to have a lasting and mutually beneficial business relationship with Toshiba, Toshiba might decide that this HD-DVD stuff is for the birds and drop it like its hot.   



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Dallas let me get this straight Sony is selling off multiple assets. They are laying off employees around the world. Their products are doing poorly in part due to being too expensive for the average consumer, and you think Toshiba is intimidated by Sony?

Meanwhile Toshiba obviously has money to burn since they are the ones Sony is supposedly selling too. They have only spent a lot of money on their format, and have only gained more support. While their product is fast approaching the soft spot for consumers. Sometimes I am shocked how ignorant this forum is on pricing. A $200 dollar difference in the U.S. is a huge difference, and if you own a 360 you can get one for $270 less then the cheapest BluRay available. No Toshiba is in the better position. You do not quit the race when you have your opponent on the ropes. They have every rational reason to believe they will win this holiday season.

Sony is not giving the plant away. Sony is selling the plant. Toshiba is buying it, and not receiving it as a token gift. Companies can do business even if they are competitors in one area. You do know that Sony buys a number of sub components from Toshiba right. Thats why they are not worried about selling this plant to them. They know they will just buy the new chips from Toshiba.



Your implied point that the only reason that a company would want to sell off a factory is that the product itself has poor potential is quite false. You aren't even considering any other possibilities at all.

Sony is a hardware company, but not a manufacturing company, in fact they get third parties to manufacture a lot of their equipment. What makes you think that the PS3 cannot be made more efficiently by someone else? In either case, at least consider that other things might be going on before giving off some arrogant air b/c you aren't even thinking critically.



Sony selling a plant is not going to convince Toshiba to drop out of the race, it will only convince them that they can win the war with the right applied pressure. And if Toshiba is in fact the one buying it, then this shouldn't be too hard.



PS3: 5.51m/51w, avg 108,039/w (up 239)
360: 12.93m/102w, avg 126,764/w (up 625), leads PS3 by 7.42m (up 70k), avg lead 18,725/w (up 386)
Wii: 13.52m/51w, avg 265,098/w (dn 1,102), leads PS3 by 8.01m (up 90k), avg lead 157,059/w (dn 1,341)

If 360 sales stabilize, PS3 sales increases needed to pass 360 by...
01/08: (008w) +875.8%, 04/08: (021w) +344.4%, 07/08: (034w) +219.3%, 10/08: (047w) +163.5%
01/09: (060w) +131.8%, 04/09: (073w) +111.4%, 07/09: (085w) +098.1%, 10/09: (099w) +086.7%
If Wii sales stabilize, PS3 sales increases needed to pass Wii by...
01/08: (008w) +1072.%, 04/08: (021w) +498.4%, 07/08: (034w) +363.4%, 10/08: (047w) +303.1%
01/09: (060w) +269.0%, 04/09: (073w) +246.9%, 07/09: (085w) +232.6%, 10/09: (099w) +220.3%
If PS2 sales freeze, Wii sales increases needed to pass PS2 (as of Mar07, 108.4m) by...
2008: (008w) +4373.8%, 2009: (060w) +0496.5%, 2010: (112w) +0219.6%, 2011: (165w) +0116.9%
2012: (217w) +0064.9%, 2013: (269w) +0033.1%, 2014: (321w) +0011.5%, 2015: (376w) -0004.8%
At +0% it will pass it in 358w, the week ending September 19th, 2014, at an age of 409w (7y44w).
Current age of PS2: 7y37w.

Last update: Week ending November 3, 2007

Everything that I have read about this says that Sony is also wanting to make a deal with Toshiba to start a joint-venture in the manufacturing of the Cell. This tells me that they currently need some better expertise in their manufacturing, and B, that Toshiba is going to be a close partner, so therefore I would expect this to be some form of pressure on toshiba to quit selling HD-DVD players that it isn't even making a profit on.



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Toshiba would be the dominant partner within the relationship so by your logic the pressure would be on Sony to discontinue their format not for Toshiba to discontinue theirs. They are not doing Toshiba a favor. They are not in some position to place leverage on Toshiba hell it is actually Toshiba that can lay down pressure.

Have you considered that Sony might need to sell these plants. Not just to get money, but they need someone to produce a retooled Cell. To drive down costs on their machine they will need to have cheaper chips produced, but perhaps Sony can no longer afford that, or will not be able to afford that and drop prices on their systems. They really might need Toshiba to up their investment in the Cell.

When you look at it like that, and mind you I do not agree with the logic. Toshiba would be in a prime position to shake Sony down. They basically could say you choose format or game console. Basically Sony is caught in a position where they have to give up one. They keep their format and their console gets eaten alive on the price front. They side with the cell, and they have to abandon their format.

Like I said I do not agree with the logic in fact I doubt it would be legal to do so. However if you believe this deal could be used to strong arm one of the parties. Then Toshiba would be the one doing the strong arming. They would have the power not Sony. Even if the deal goes through Toshiba will have the power. They would own the manufacturing, and Sony would have no power in that situation. They cannot change the design of their system. Toshiba could horde the chips for their products, and if they wanted to they could starve Sony. People who own things have the right to use those things however they want as long as it is legal.



Dodece said:
Toshiba would be the dominant partner within the relationship so by your logic the pressure would be on Sony to discontinue their format not for Toshiba to discontinue theirs. They are not doing Toshiba a favor. They are not in some position to place leverage on Toshiba hell it is actually Toshiba that can lay down pressure.

Have you considered that Sony might need to sell these plants. Not just to get money, but they need someone to produce a retooled Cell. To drive down costs on their machine they will need to have cheaper chips produced, but perhaps Sony can no longer afford that, or will not be able to afford that and drop prices on their systems. They really might need Toshiba to up their investment in the Cell.

When you look at it like that, and mind you I do not agree with the logic. Toshiba would be in a prime position to shake Sony down. They basically could say you choose format or game console. Basically Sony is caught in a position where they have to give up one. They keep their format and their console gets eaten alive on the price front. They side with the cell, and they have to abandon their format.

Like I said I do not agree with the logic in fact I doubt it would be legal to do so. However if you believe this deal could be used to strong arm one of the parties. Then Toshiba would be the one doing the strong arming. They would have the power not Sony. Even if the deal goes through Toshiba will have the power. They would own the manufacturing, and Sony would have no power in that situation. They cannot change the design of their system. Toshiba could horde the chips for their products, and if they wanted to they could starve Sony. People who own things have the right to use those things however they want as long as it is legal.

1.  Toshiba would become the dominant partner with my logic???   If what you are describing as my logic was true, then no joint-ventures would ever happen, as somebody would have to necessarily be getting the shaft.  But, this isn't true. 

2.  You are bringing up the possibility of Sony retooling the Cell.  This was even stupider dude.  How could Sony retool the Cell, and still make it better?  Your speculation is going to have to have some kind of grounding before I'm going to take it seriously.  Let alone for the fact that a retooled Cell, which implies a different design, would probably mean games that are incompatible with the PS3s with the previous model of Cell.  So, problems like this instantly come to mind with your ideas.  And they are interesting don't get me wrong, but you really aren't very impressive with your reasoning.

 

3rd Paragraph:  Please use complete sentences. And i've read the rest of the post, and its just a bunch of dumb blathering.  Just give the stupidity dude. 



...he was using complete sentences. You, however, were using some pretty poor grammar ("Just give the stupidity dude")

Don't criticize people if you're going to be a hypocrite about it.



PS3: 5.51m/51w, avg 108,039/w (up 239)
360: 12.93m/102w, avg 126,764/w (up 625), leads PS3 by 7.42m (up 70k), avg lead 18,725/w (up 386)
Wii: 13.52m/51w, avg 265,098/w (dn 1,102), leads PS3 by 8.01m (up 90k), avg lead 157,059/w (dn 1,341)

If 360 sales stabilize, PS3 sales increases needed to pass 360 by...
01/08: (008w) +875.8%, 04/08: (021w) +344.4%, 07/08: (034w) +219.3%, 10/08: (047w) +163.5%
01/09: (060w) +131.8%, 04/09: (073w) +111.4%, 07/09: (085w) +098.1%, 10/09: (099w) +086.7%
If Wii sales stabilize, PS3 sales increases needed to pass Wii by...
01/08: (008w) +1072.%, 04/08: (021w) +498.4%, 07/08: (034w) +363.4%, 10/08: (047w) +303.1%
01/09: (060w) +269.0%, 04/09: (073w) +246.9%, 07/09: (085w) +232.6%, 10/09: (099w) +220.3%
If PS2 sales freeze, Wii sales increases needed to pass PS2 (as of Mar07, 108.4m) by...
2008: (008w) +4373.8%, 2009: (060w) +0496.5%, 2010: (112w) +0219.6%, 2011: (165w) +0116.9%
2012: (217w) +0064.9%, 2013: (269w) +0033.1%, 2014: (321w) +0011.5%, 2015: (376w) -0004.8%
At +0% it will pass it in 358w, the week ending September 19th, 2014, at an age of 409w (7y44w).
Current age of PS2: 7y37w.

Last update: Week ending November 3, 2007

FishyJoe said:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118982504239228518.html?mod=yahoo_hs&ru=yahoo

Sony Considers Selling Production Facility
By YUKARI IWATANI KANE
September 14, 2007 11:20 p.m.

TOKYO -- Sony Corp. is considering selling the production facility where it makes the advanced processor used in its PlayStation 3 videogame console, as part of its ongoing effort to focus more on its core electronics business.

People familiar with the situation said the company was in discussions with Toshiba Corp., Japan's largest chip manufacturer, which had worked with Sony and International Business Machines Corp. to develop the so-called Cell chip. They said a deal could be reached by the end of the year.

Such a move would fit into Sony's overall strategy to focus on products in its mainstay consumer electronics business and make chips only in areas where it has a competitive edge, such as the specialized chips used in digital cameras.

Sony invested 200 billion yen ($1.7 billion) a few years ago to develop the Cell processor, which is significantly more powerful than the chips typically used in PCs. But it would need to make a significant investment again to make the next-generation version. Toshiba and IBM both have the capability to make the same chips.

For Toshiba, the deal would help beef up its processor business, which is not as strong as its flash memory business.


Thanks for posting that information



urz-truly said:
FishyJoe said:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118982504239228518.html?mod=yahoo_hs&ru=yahoo

Sony Considers Selling Production Facility
By YUKARI IWATANI KANE
September 14, 2007 11:20 p.m.

TOKYO -- Sony Corp. is considering selling the production facility where it makes the advanced processor used in its PlayStation 3 videogame console, as part of its ongoing effort to focus more on its core electronics business.

People familiar with the situation said the company was in discussions with Toshiba Corp., Japan's largest chip manufacturer, which had worked with Sony and International Business Machines Corp. to develop the so-called Cell chip. They said a deal could be reached by the end of the year.

Such a move would fit into Sony's overall strategy to focus on products in its mainstay consumer electronics business and make chips only in areas where it has a competitive edge, such as the specialized chips used in digital cameras.

Sony invested 200 billion yen ($1.7 billion) a few years ago to develop the Cell processor, which is significantly more powerful than the chips typically used in PCs. But it would need to make a significant investment again to make the next-generation version. Toshiba and IBM both have the capability to make the same chips.

For Toshiba, the deal would help beef up its processor business, which is not as strong as its flash memory business.


Thanks for posting that information


 Thanks for bumping a two month old thread