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Forums - Gaming Discussion - My XBox 360 vs PS3 comparison (mostly technical)

MikeB on 24 September 2007

@ Final-Fan

MikeB, it doesn't help your case to go around quoting Sony press releases, especially when it's Jack Tretton saying, "The original PlayStation lasted ten years -- a tremendous innovation when other platforms died and were all but forgotten," conveniently forgetting that the NES lasted just as long.


The NES is very old. IMO Sony has some bragging rights as the Playstation sold more and lasted longer than all other consoles except for the Playstation 2.

They have a point, I expect the PS3 to last for 10 or more years.

Seriously, you're posting pictures of wireless headsets and USB keyboards! Are you looking at what you're posting? Can you see what you've been reduced to? Raging fanboyism does not help your argument. I mean, yes it may be cool that you can use all that stuff on the PS3, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Am I wrong?


I don't agree, the message was in support of the original post. I intend to buy both and so to me it's relevant if I compare platforms. Convenient wireless Bluetooth devices, which IMO adds to the overall user experience.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

Around the Network
MikeB on 24 September 2007

@ kamekazai

Xbox was more powerful than ps3 but lost.


You probably meant to say PS2. Both platforms had their technological strongpoints. Power isn't the only factor, games have to build on this potential. The PS2 is a far stronger gaming platform than the XBox was, which was often looked at as a lowend cutdown PC (not as a powerful device).

The most important aspects when it comes down to systems selling are timing, pricing and games.


Agreed, and specifications. For instance the 60GB PS3 greatly outsold the cheaper 20 GB version.

The truth of the matter is that from a profit and market share currently the Wii is dominating


It's called: "Making an investment into the future". The PS3 wasn't designed to make a profit its first year on the market, Sony looks at the device for the long run.

I am glad Nintendo is making healthy profits and I hope they multiply their amount of employees accordingly. Currently they have a tiny workforce, with Sony employing over 54 times as many people.

Nintendo is the only company making a profit on ever system, something microsoft just started doing and that sony still isn't.


Do you have any proof with regard to this?

Microsoft claimed to shareholders they would be making a profit last fiscal year. Only the last minute did they inform their shareholders about the mass failing XBox 360 hardware, something we already knew since launch. This devision lost a grand total of 1.9 Billion USD! So multiple times the loss of Sony's gaming devision for the XBox 360's second year on the market!

One thing I noticed was how lots of people say give sony time and wait till there games start hitting, but your biggest games are still far behind Halo in terms of selling power. Halo as a francise is the single highest grossing entertainment francise.


Both Gran Turismo and Final Fantasy games have outsold Halo games. And Sony doesn't depend on a single francise, they have multiple and together with their partners create many new francises (some more successful than others) as they have done with Motorstorm, Resistance Fall of Man, Lair and soon Uncharted for the PS3.

Looking at the list of PS3 games to be released, it certianly doesn't lack in the game varierty department. The XBox and XBox 360 games library is pretty much dominated by 3D shooters. The PS2 wasn't well equipped to fully address this gerne, but the PS3 is.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

Final-Fan on 24 September 2007
MikeB said:
@ Final-Fan

MikeB, it doesn't help your case to go around quoting Sony press releases, especially when it's Jack Tretton saying, "The original PlayStation lasted ten years -- a tremendous innovation when other platforms died and were all but forgotten," conveniently forgetting that the NES lasted just as long.


The NES is very old. IMO Sony has some bragging rights as the Playstation sold more and lasted longer than all other consoles except for the Playstation 2.

They have a point, I expect the PS3 to last for 10 or more years.

Seriously, you're posting pictures of wireless headsets and USB keyboards! Are you looking at what you're posting? Can you see what you've been reduced to? Raging fanboyism does not help your argument. I mean, yes it may be cool that you can use all that stuff on the PS3, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Am I wrong?


I don't agree, the message was in support of the original post. I intend to buy both and so to me it's relevant if I compare platforms. Convenient wireless Bluetooth devices, which IMO adds to the overall user experience.


But surely you concede that (A) calling it an "innovation" is silly in the first place, and downright stupid when they weren't the first to do it; (B) no one is disputing that portion of the OP right now; and (C) posting pictures of random USB devices?  Come on.

If he'd said "accomplishment" instead of "innovation" I wouldn't have a problem, except with the fact that you were quoting an article (clearly fanboy in origin) quoting a Sony exec saying, "Playstation rocks!" to no apparent purpose. 



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

kamekazai on 24 September 2007
MikeB said:
@ kamekazai

Xbox was more powerful than ps3 but lost.


You probably meant to say PS2. Both platforms had their technological strongpoints. Power isn't the only factor, games have to build on this potential. The PS2 is a far stronger gaming platform than the XBox was, which was often looked at as a lowend cutdown PC (not as a powerful device).

The most important aspects when it comes down to systems selling are timing, pricing and games.


Agreed, and specifications. For instance the 60GB PS3 greatly outsold the cheaper 20 GB version.

The truth of the matter is that from a profit and market share currently the Wii is dominating


It's called: "Making an investment into the future". The PS3 wasn't designed to make a profit its firts year, Sony looks at the device for the long run.

I am glad Nintendo is making healthy profits and I hope they multiply their amount of employees accordingly. Currently they have a tiny workforce, with Sony employing over 54 times as many people.

Nintendo is the only company making a profit on ever system, something microsoft just started doing and that sony still isn't.


Do you have any proof with regard to this?

Microsoft claimed to shareholders they would be making a profit last fiscal year. Only the last minute did they inform their shareholders about the mass failing XBox 360 hardware, something we already knew since launch. This devision lost a grand total of 1.9 Billion USD! So multiple times the loss of Sony's gaming devision for the XBox 360's second year on the market!

One thing I noticed was how lots of people say give sony time and wait till there games start hitting, but your biggest games are still far behind Halo in terms of selling power. Halo as a francise is the single highest grossing entertainment francise.


Both Gran Turismo and Final Fantasy games have outsold Halo games. And Sony doesn't depend on a single francise, they have multiple and together with their partner create many new francises (some more successful than others) as they have done with Motorstorm, Resistance Fall of Man, Lair and soon Uncharted for the PS3.

Looking at the list of PS3 games to be released, it certianly doesn't lack in the game varierty department. The XBox and XBox 360 games library is pretty much dominated by 3D shooters. The PS2 wasn't well equipped to fully address this gerne, but the PS3 is.

In regards to profits, I was refering to per console sales not over divisions. Last I heard Sony was losing money per system and microsoft just started making money per system.

In regards to PS3 being developed as a long term console, then I wonder what was sony thinking. One of their major advantages in the last 2 generation was being first to the table, which gives a huge advantage. Was it worth it to through that advantage out just so you could push you propiertary format?

The other problem with the "long-term design" is that it only works if in the long term nothing better come out. What happens if 4 years from now as the ps3 picks up steam, then blam a new system drops which at that time would have significantly more powerful hardware. Sony has been touting the system as a 10 year system, which as the playstation 2 shows is possible, the problem was power wasn't what made it possible which is all sony appears to care about with ths design.

 

In regards to game lineups I think both systems are diverse, both have shooters, racers, rpgs, etc. In fact this generation is alot more even than last in terms of both systems having diversity thus the only things that will break the mold are big titles and ports (and which system they play better on.)  



MikeB on 24 September 2007

@ Final-Fan

But surely you concede that (A) calling it an "innovation" is silly in the first place, and downright stupid when they weren't the first to do it;


But I called it "convenient", not per se innovative.

(B) no one is disputing that portion of the OP right now;


Consider it an addition, IMO it's nice to add a case example.

C) posting pictures of random USB devices? Come on.


Not USB, they are (PS3 compatible) Bluetooth devices. So completely wireless, you for example don't need a wireless USB adapter to use them wirelessly (that's what I am currently using for my PS3).

If he'd said "accomplishment" instead of "innovation" I wouldn't have a problem


Oh, I see. You are referring to this?

"Logitech
Logitech is a world leader in personal peripherals, driving innovation in PC navigation, Internet communications, digital music, home-entertainment control, gaming and wireless devices. Founded in 1981, Logitech International is a Swiss public company traded on the SWX Swiss Exchange (LOGN) and on the Nasdaq Global Select Market (LOGI)."

IMO that's just plain standard marketing speech. Anyhow the usage of wireless Bluetooth keyboards and mice can be considered somewhat innovative if speaking about game consoles.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

Around the Network
MikeB on 24 September 2007

@ kamekazai

In regards to profits, I was refering to per console sales not over divisions. Last I heard Sony was losing money per system and microsoft just started making money per system.


Personally I always consider the costs when speaking about profits.

Was it worth it to through that advantage out just so you could push you propiertary format?


I believe you are mistaken. The PS3 product as a whole just wasn't done yet. Mature dev kits weren't even available to developers since a few months before release. Surely that's not Blu-Ray related! Would you have wanted the PS3 to ship to consumers before the developers had access to a mature enough development platform?

I am glad my PS3 includes a Blu-Ray drive though.

And I don't think the one year headstart for the XBox 360 really will mean much for the long run, this mostly offers PR advantages, which may have some little effect in the US but globally speaking I don't think this will matter much.

Last year the PS2 greatly outsold the XBox 360 and this year the Nintendo Wii, maybe next year by the PS3. All in all the XBox 360 only really does great in the US and UK, but even in the US there are 5 times as many people playing on a PS2 than on a XBox 360 (June 2007 survey, NPD).

The other problem with the "long-term design" is that it only works if in the long term nothing better come out. What happens if 4 years from now as the ps3 picks up steam, then blam a new system drops which at that time would have significantly more powerful hardware.


Simple, the PS3 will have a larger established games library and most likely cheaper costs. A game project on the scale of God of War takes at least 3 years to complete, so the new console won't have this advantage.

Sony has been touting the system as a 10 year system, which as the playstation 2 shows is possible, the problem was power wasn't what made it possible which is all sony appears to care about with ths design.


Playing God of War 2 (on my PS3 of course), I can say the PS2 was one heck of a powerful platform for its price at the time. This old beast can be pushed to extremes by talented coders.

In regards to game lineups I think both systems are diverse, both have shooters, racers, rpgs, etc.


Yes, the XBox 360 offers more game diversity than was the case with regard to the original XBox. But still Sony's partners seem to be working on far more game gernes. Everything from Singstar to Ratchet, from Super Stardust to Eye of Judgement, from Killzone 2 to LittleBigPlanet, etc, etc.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

Final-Fan on 24 September 2007

But surely you concede that (A) calling it an "innovation" is silly in the first place, and downright stupid when they weren't the first to do it;

But I called it "convenient", not per se innovative.

I was talking about the Jack Tretton quote in point (A). Now, then, do you concede that Jack Tretton saying that the Playstation's lasting a decade on the market is a "tremendous innovation" is not only silly but stupid?

C) posting pictures of random USB devices? Come on.

Not USB, they are (PS3 compatible) Bluetooth devices. So completely wireless, you for example don't need a wireless USB adapter to use them wirelessly (that's what I am currently using for my PS3).

I stand corrected. Allow me to rephrase: "Posting pictures of random Bluetooth devices? Come on."

If he'd said "accomplishment" instead of "innovation" I wouldn't have a problem

Oh, I see. You are referring to this?

Jack Tretton again, see above.

I didn't mean to come down super hard on you, but the product placement seemed just bizarre to me, and the regurgitated Sony PR only hurts your cause by undermining your credibility.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Final-Fan on 24 September 2007
kamekazai said:
Halo as a francise is the single highest grossing entertainment francise.

I didn't notice this little gem until just now.  In what way does the Mario franchise not blow Halo out of the water with the greatest of ease?  Numbers plz. 

Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Final-Fan on 25 September 2007

So, sieanr, let's try this again: does your continued silence on the subjects I named, the arguments I restated, and the statements I made at 06:06 09/24/07 in this thread in fact imply that you concede that they are valid and true?

Since I know you have been monitoring this thread until quite recently, and since you asked me specifically to name and state those things, I WILL take silence as assent.  [edit:  I don't demand instantaneous response, of course.  Don't fear that I will declare victory without giving you plenty of time to see this.]



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

MikeB on 25 September 2007

@ Final-Fan

I was talking about the Jack Tretton quote in point (A). Now, then, do you concede that Jack Tretton saying that the Playstation's lasting a decade on the market is a "tremendous innovation" is not only silly but stupid?


Not really stupid, IMO just PR talk. He just wanted to underline how well Playstation lasted and performed compared to rivals.

Similar statements seem everyday's business for endless products and market segments. So it doesn't raise an eyebrow for me.

I stand corrected. Allow me to rephrase: "Posting pictures of random Bluetooth devices? Come on."


No not random, AFAIK these are the first Bluetooth ones supported. I have been eagerly awaiting such devices for the PS3. So excuse my enthusiasm.

I didn't mean to come down super hard on you, but the product placement seemed just bizarre to me, and the regurgitated Sony PR only hurts your cause by undermining your credibility.


I mostly read beyond the PR inserts. IMO he actually made a good point, Sony has experience like no other company how to make their home consoles last. BTW, I like the current execs Jack Tretton, Phil Harrison and Kaz Hirai, they aren't perfect but IMO much better than the spokesman Microsoft's gaming devision has to offer.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales