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Forums - General - If You Could Ask God ONE QUESTION

Tyrannical on 28 March 2009
mmnin said:
tombi123 said:
can you create a stone so heavy, you can't lift it?

 

This is an interesting one. 

 

 It's just as boring as how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

It's all part of a particularly useless and boring line of theological thought. If that doesn't disinterest you enogugh, you can read up on Thomas Aquinas as he spent a lot of time thinking about silly things.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

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mmnin on 28 March 2009
Tyrannical said:
mmnin said:
tombi123 said:
can you create a stone so heavy, you can't lift it?

 

This is an interesting one. 

 

 It's just as boring as how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

It's all part of a particularly useless and boring line of theological thought. If that doesn't disinterest you enogugh, you can read up on Thomas Aquinas as he spent a lot of time thinking about silly things.

 

haha.  I guess I meant interesting as in it is used frequently as the end all for people to discredit the Christian religion.




tombi123 on 28 March 2009
mmnin said:
tombi123 said:
can you create a stone so heavy, you can't lift it?

 

This is an interesting one.  I never wanted to sit and think it out, but this time I did.  Ok.  here goes.

The answer:  Yes, if He wants to.  The thing is God doesn't deal with our logic.  Yes, it seems like an impossible scenario according to the rules of this world and the understanding that we have, but if He created this world, then He is responsible for its rules and logic therefore His logic must be much more than we can even fathom with our limited sources of existence.

Think of this it this way.  If He is all powerful, then he can create a stone of an infinite amount of weight.  He can also make that stone more of an infinite amount of weight than the highest of infinity.  So He can make the stone the infinity of the infinity of the infinity of the infinity of the infinity...... etc (to infinity). amount of weight.

But since He can do anything, surely He can lift it, yes.  BUT if He can do anything, He can also determine if He can lift it.  One moment, He can decide that He can lift it.  The next moment, He could lift infinity times even that rocks weight.  If God is all powerful then He can do whatever He desires with no bounds.

Well going by what you say, God can't make a stone so heavy he can't lift it. So he can't do whatever he desires, therefore he is not all powerful.

 



mmnin on 28 March 2009

:)  What we consider absolute is not the same as what an all powerful God would consider absolute. Where we have one instance in our existence, He would have many.

Do you believe in fate tombi or do you believe that we make choices and have a right to choose whatever actions we make?




Tyrannical on 28 March 2009
mmnin said:
Tyrannical said:

 

 It's just as boring as how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

It's all part of a particularly useless and boring line of theological thought. If that doesn't disinterest you enogugh, you can read up on Thomas Aquinas as he spent a lot of time thinking about silly things.

 

haha.  I guess I meant interesting as in it is used frequently as the end all for people to discredit the Christian religion.

 

I've never heard of it being used at all as an end to discredit Christianity. Certainly not an argument I would expect an educated person to make, as this fell out of poplar usage several hundred years ago. I don't even think it was taken too seriously back then either.



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

Around the Network
mmnin on 28 March 2009
Tyrannical said:
mmnin said:
Tyrannical said:

 

 It's just as boring as how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

It's all part of a particularly useless and boring line of theological thought. If that doesn't disinterest you enogugh, you can read up on Thomas Aquinas as he spent a lot of time thinking about silly things.

 

haha.  I guess I meant interesting as in it is used frequently as the end all for people to discredit the Christian religion.

 

I've never heard of it being used at all as an end to discredit Christianity. Certainly not an argument I would expect an educated person to make, as this fell out of poplar usage several hundred years ago. I don't even think it was taken too seriously back then either.

Ah.  well there you go.  I'm in Tennessee.  I hear that argument quite a bit.  And even those who do not live around me who have used that argument, may not necessarily be of the highest educational background.  It is a popular one in at least some areas apparently. 

 

 




Tyrannical on 28 March 2009
mmnin said:
Tyrannical said:
mmnin said:
Tyrannical said:

 

 It's just as boring as how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

It's all part of a particularly useless and boring line of theological thought. If that doesn't disinterest you enogugh, you can read up on Thomas Aquinas as he spent a lot of time thinking about silly things.

 

haha.  I guess I meant interesting as in it is used frequently as the end all for people to discredit the Christian religion.

 

I've never heard of it being used at all as an end to discredit Christianity. Certainly not an argument I would expect an educated person to make, as this fell out of poplar usage several hundred years ago. I don't even think it was taken too seriously back then either.

Ah.  well there you go.  I'm in Tennessee.  I hear that argument quite a bit.  And even those who do not live around me who have used that argument, may not necessarily be of the highest educational background.  It is a popular one in at least some areas apparently.

 

I think they should stick to the simpler "Why does the righteous man also suffer?"

 



Yet, today, America's leaders are reenacting every folly that brought these great powers [Russia, Germany, and Japan] to ruin -- from arrogance and hubris, to assertions of global hegemony, to imperial overstretch, to trumpeting new 'crusades,' to handing out war guarantees to regions and countries where Americans have never fought before. We are piling up the kind of commitments that produced the greatest disasters of the twentieth century.
 — Pat Buchanan – A Republic, Not an Empire

FaRmLaNd on 28 March 2009

"why should I follow your rules?"



mmnin on 28 March 2009

@ Tyrannical


Actually, thinking back on it. A lot of educated people do use that argument, though they may not be educated in what they need to be in order to understand any weaknesses it might have. Typically someone thought it was witty and used it in their presence or a fellow skeptic passed along the thought and since they couldn't disprove it on the fly, they decided to use it. Then considering that most Christians, lower income protestants which make up the majority, are generally not of the highest education and probably would not be able to combat the phrase either, they then would think that it was a perfect way to make their point quickly. Usually I see these people, as Tombi seems to have done, throwing the statement to the world, even if it is just to one person, as if to rid it of all deities.




tombi123 on 28 March 2009
mmnin said:

:)  What we consider absolute is not the same as what an all powerful God would consider absolute. Where we have one instance in our existence, He would have many.

Do you believe in fate tombi or do you believe that we make choices and have a right to choose whatever actions we make?

 

I don't believe in fate or destiny. I do believe we make choices and have a right to choose whatever actions we make, as long as those choices don't harm others. The right for me to swing my fist ends where the other man's nose begins.