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Forums - General - The First sub $200 HD Player

KBG29 said:
To thouse who think Blu-ray is just a little better than HD-DVD please go look at the actual specs first. Blu-ray is already bigger than the biggest HD-DVD beleived to be possible 50>45. Blu-ray can theoretically go up to 200GB and TDK has already been able to creat a disc that can do it. The read speed for HD-DVD is 48Mbps while Blu-ray has a 72Mbps read speed. In the future if Blu-Ray wins we will have a product that can get better and better over time. Mitsubishi is already talking about Filming in 3DHD and making it possible only on Blu-ray. Other benifits are bigger disk size equals less disks for things like TV shows, and franchises. Imagine if you could get all the Star Wars films on 2 disks, it is possible, but only on Blu-ray. If HD-DVD wins we will all be looking at the same thing we are right now for the next 8 years, with Blu-ray as the victor the future is open to more possibilites.

 This needs to be quoted more just because of how outright wrong it is.

"The read speed for HD-DVD is 48Mbps while Blu-ray has a 72Mbps read speed."

For starters, you're confusing the maximum bit-rate of both formats with the read speed of the disk. Speaking of which, the read speed is dependant on the reader and is no way inherintly limited by the format.

"Imagine if you could get all the Star Wars films on 2 disks, it is possible, but only on Blu-ray."

Lulz. Why not claim you can have the whole trilogy on one disc, since it is possible with high compression/low quality encoding on Bluray. But seriously, do multiple disc matter that much to you? 



Leo-j said: If a dvd for a pc game holds what? Crysis at 3000p or something, why in the world cant a blu-ray disc do the same?

ssj12 said: Player specific decoders are nothing more than specialized GPUs. Gran Turismo is the trust driving simulator of them all. 

"Why do they call it the xbox 360? Because when you see it, you'll turn 360 degrees and walk away" 

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Entroper said:
I'd just like to point out that not every movie contains solely 24 fps footage. Many popular titles run the CG in 60 fps.

Err, no, all Blu Ray and HD DVD movies are 24fps. DVD's are 60 but only because of 3:2. The only thing you will find at native 60fps is video based material, ie. TV shows and music videos.



naznatips said:
lvader said:
Hmmm, the fact remains is that the new HD formats are well ahead of where DVD was at the same point in it's life.

HD DVD player prices are already getting close to the point where people will just buy it instead of a DVD player and once the media prices come down there will be no point in buying DVDs anymore. It's quite possible that the likes of Paramount and Universal might release ALL films as DVD/HD DVD dual format in the future.

PS There is NO difference between feeding a 1080p display 1080i or 1080p from a HD DVD or Blu Ray film. It's a completely lossless conversion.

That's not true at all.  The only difference is that Blu-Ray had a movie sell 100,000 copies faster than ever before.  It takes both formats combined to even get near the market share that DVD had at this point in it's life. 


DVD managed 300'000 in the 1st year, 1.1M in the 2nd and 4M in the 3rd. Blu Ray has that beat on it's own easily.  Even HD DVD isn't that far behind. 

 



lvader said:
naznatips said:
lvader said:
Hmmm, the fact remains is that the new HD formats are well ahead of where DVD was at the same point in it's life.

HD DVD player prices are already getting close to the point where people will just buy it instead of a DVD player and once the media prices come down there will be no point in buying DVDs anymore. It's quite possible that the likes of Paramount and Universal might release ALL films as DVD/HD DVD dual format in the future.

PS There is NO difference between feeding a 1080p display 1080i or 1080p from a HD DVD or Blu Ray film. It's a completely lossless conversion.

That's not true at all. The only difference is that Blu-Ray had a movie sell 100,000 copies faster than ever before. It takes both formats combined to even get near the market share that DVD had at this point in it's life.


DVD managed 300'000 in the 1st year, 1.1M in the 2nd and 4M in the 3rd. Blu Ray has that beat on it's own easily. Even HD DVD isn't that far behind.

 


 Just curious, are you counting the PS3 as a BluRay player in your estimate?  If so that's just wrong.  Remember that onyl a good 40% know that the PS3 has a BluRay player and not even all of those use it as a BluRay player.  I know if I had a PS3 I still wouldn't bother buying BluRay players because I don't want to buy a format that might lose (not saying it is just that it can).



twesterm said:

Just curious, are you counting the PS3 as a BluRay player in your estimate? If so that's just wrong. Remember that onyl a good 40% know that the PS3 has a BluRay player and not even all of those use it as a BluRay player. I know if I had a PS3 I still wouldn't bother buying BluRay players because I don't want to buy a format that might lose (not saying it is just that it can).


I'd be willing to buy a format that might lose if I needed a new, decent DVD player anyhow and it was $99.  There is a reasonable chance HD-DVD players will be available with 5+ free movies for $99 - $149 this holiday season.  At those prices, people would be willing to buy it for the free HD movies alone.



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I am counting the PS3 but it's difficult not to, the dedicated players are truely awful and no one is buying them. People with didicated home theaters are buying PS3s just for Blu Ray. I recon a good 40-50% have had some use as a player even if it was just 1 or 2 discs.



TheBigFatJ said:
twesterm said:

Just curious, are you counting the PS3 as a BluRay player in your estimate? If so that's just wrong. Remember that onyl a good 40% know that the PS3 has a BluRay player and not even all of those use it as a BluRay player. I know if I had a PS3 I still wouldn't bother buying BluRay players because I don't want to buy a format that might lose (not saying it is just that it can).


I'd be willing to buy a format that might lose if I needed a new, decent DVD player anyhow and it was $99. There is a reasonable chance HD-DVD players will be available with 5+ free movies for $99 - $149 this holiday season. At those prices, people would be willing to buy it for the free HD movies alone.


 Being cheap does help things out A LOT.  Actually, HD DVD currently has two great things going for it Blu-Ray cannot boast:

  1. It's cheaper.  In the eyes of mass consumers cheaper is always better.
  2. HD DVD/DVD combo movies.  Suddenly buying an HD DVD  movie isn't a risk.


lvader said:
I am counting the PS3 but it's difficult not to, the dedicated players are truely awful and no one is buying them. People with didicated home theaters are buying PS3s just for Blu Ray. I recon a good 40-50% have had some use as a player even if it was just 1 or 2 discs.

Ok, lets take all that as fact just for fun.

Look at the PSP. A lot of people buy PSP's and buy one or two games so why aren't developers taking more notice of the PSP? Because people only buy one or two games and then pirate the rest. Now I'm not saying people pirate BluRay movies but people do notice that people aren't buying the movies.

Now to take what you say seriously.

You recon that 40-50% of PS3's are used as BluRay players? Well since you recon it must be absolutely true and your word must be infallible. In my previous post I mentioned that a good 40% of people even know that they're PS3's are HD compatible. Do you assume (or recon) that everyone who knows that their PS3 is HD compatible automatically buys BluRay movies? Well you shouldn't. Just because people know about it doesn't mean they actually use it. I know a few people who own a PS3 with no HDTV so there's no need for them to buy BluRay movies and actually nobody I know who owns a PS3 owns a single BluRay movie except Taladega Nights. Now saying that is about as scientific as you recon, but I recon that the majority of people who own a PS3 don't use it as a BluRay player.

-edit-
And if the dedicated players are so awful why are you assuming that  BluRay is so great?  Do people really want something that is awful and expensive?



I don't think Blu Ray is great, I think it's a flawed format which will go the same way as UMD. HD DVD has had pretty much everything going against it from the start, but slowly but surely it is coming through.

 



I would like everyone to know that this thread finally pushed me over the edge. I finally gave in and joined the High Definition nation. I decided to go with a 37" High Definition LCD flat panel. The price was reasonable in that it did not cost me over a thousand dollars. That said I am mired in some buyers remorse. Please let me have no regrets lord.

Seriously I had put it off for far too long. My old clunker was going on twenty years old only supported cable, and the sound and visual were not up to par. Sound was cutting out during gaming, and the games themselves looked scratchy. Even a brand new coaxial was not helping all that much, and who knows how long my VCR will hold out. That would be my primary by the way. Everything runs through the VCR. So the choice was getting to be one of I was going to be spending money so why not invest upwards.

I have some questions for the peanut gallery. The model I bought only supports up to 1080i. I seriously considered buying a model that supported both however the price difference was fantastic. I was already determined to stick to a budget that, and I was pushing with screen size. Push come to shove I would rather have a bigger screen rather then support a expensive format.

From what I understand BluRay runs on 1080p. Does that mean on my television that both formats will look exactly the same, or would the BluRay actually look worse. Would I notice any visual difference at all. Has my television made the format choice for me? Even if both formats play equally well I think I would defer to the cheaper format.

I am also curious that since the PS3 is a BluRay player. Would there be any visual difference between a PS3 game and 360 game at all? Curious if the format has a bearing on the quality of gaming visuals. Obviously with the dent in my wallet it will be some time before I make a decision. Just curious have I already made the decision.