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Forums - General - Should the US legalize drugs?

@JV - hell, Im referring to the cokeheads who ARE from rich/upper middle class families. Theyre the worst of them all.

@esmoreit - last drug death I can recall was 72 hours ago, my GF's cousin OD'ed. 37 years old.

@rubang - I understand, but do we really want to promote these things to a society that can barely hold their booze, nevermind hard drugs? Our societies are wasting away as it is, regressing to caveman behavior, do we want to further promote their escapism? We need solutions in this dying world, not more people caring about nothing but getting high.

@Nirvana - Its not an issue of drastic measure, as I mentioned to Rubang above, but more of society becoming a useless broken cog in a machine that is falling apart. Our planet is dying, and a lot of the blame goes onto the shoulders of a selfish society. Drug addicts are among the most selfish, contributing nothing good to the solution, just wasting away and getting high. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.



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bardicverse said:
@JV - hell, Im referring to the cokeheads who ARE from rich/upper middle class families. Theyre the worst of them all.

@esmoreit - last drug death I can recall was 72 hours ago, my GF's cousin OD'ed. 37 years old.

@rubang - I understand, but do we really want to promote these things to a society that can barely hold their booze, nevermind hard drugs? Our societies are wasting away as it is, regressing to caveman behavior, do we want to further promote their escapism? We need solutions in this dying world, not more people caring about nothing but getting high.

@Nirvana - Its not an issue of drastic measure, as I mentioned to Rubang above, but more of society becoming a useless broken cog in a machine that is falling apart. Our planet is dying, and a lot of the blame goes onto the shoulders of a selfish society. Drug addicts are among the most selfish, contributing nothing good to the solution, just wasting away and getting high. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

Your nitpicking my post. but alright. What did he OD on? Would he have Od'ed if he had taken that drug in a (professional) supervised place?

I'll respond to your response to rubang aswell: We are not regressing. When it comes to monkey behaviour we are no different then our grandparents, and their grandparents. The focus on what is acceptable changes, as have our means of finding and knowing about this behaviour. 20 years ago I would not have known about your OD'ing cousing in law.

And as to your response to nirvana... I believe we are less selfish then we used to be but that's a debate for another time. Drug addicts we will have wether we legalize drugs or not. We saw it with booze, we will see it with drugs.
And as I described, legalizing drugs, at least getting it out of the shady circuit we can elp the addicts even... 

 



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@esmoreit -

1. unsure yet, waiting for more info. they have to autopsy etc. As for your 2nd question, its conjecture, so we will never know

2 & 3. Technology and regressing behavior are not the same. Your behavior does not affect technological progress, unless you are an inventor or otherwise contributing to building new technology. We are very much so regressing. People had priorities other than their own selfish baking of themselves.

I think you'll never understand this until you've walked a mile in another person's shoes. I used to be a teacher in a very poor urban neighborhood, at times ranked the 3rd most dangerous city in the USA. I've seen mothers, fathers, grandparents even, come in, high as hell, to PTA meetings to discuss their kid's academics. The kids are neglected by their drug abusing parents, and they in turn have no one to turn to. They are afraid of having their parents reported for this, and they often deny their parents are neglecting them, out of fear.

I understand that its easy to look at the world from a very "leftist" viewpoint when you're in your university years, but once you go out and actually walk through this beautiful planet and see how messed up and disgusting society is, you'll know what I was talking about. Its a sad reality that will hit you in time. I once shared similar viewpoints to you, but you'll see. I can't explain any further until you get out there.



@bardicverse

I hate to break it to you but alcohol is a hard drug, especially when it comes to important factors such as its lethal dose to effective dose ratio. It's easier to overdose on alcohol (LD:ED ratio of 10:1) than cocaine (LD:ED ratio of 15:1).



bouzane - It is a drug, not categorized as a "hard drug" by the FDA. It's also harder to OD on alcohol, because you need to consume several glasses of it. Your natural reaction to overconsumption is to puke it back up, whereas cocaine can be snorted excessively without the body trying to shove it back out. Of course, alcohol poisoning does happen, and strong hard liquor can be lethal (like Everclear- 190 proof grain alcohol).

Also, there is no "addictive" ingredient in alcohol like cocaine or cigarettes (nicotine). Alcoholism is a serious thing, agreed, I dont deny that, and probably has a bigger ratio mostly due to availability (perhaps a good point to show what would happen by making hard drugs like cocaine legal)



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bardicverse said:
@esmoreit -

1. unsure yet, waiting for more info. they have to autopsy etc. As for your 2nd question, its conjecture, so we will never know

2 & 3. Technology and regressing behavior are not the same. Your behavior does not affect technological progress, unless you are an inventor or otherwise contributing to building new technology. We are very much so regressing. People had priorities other than their own selfish baking of themselves.

I think you'll never understand this until you've walked a mile in another person's shoes. I used to be a teacher in a very poor urban neighborhood, at times ranked the 3rd most dangerous city in the USA. I've seen mothers, fathers, grandparents even, come in, high as hell, to PTA meetings to discuss their kid's academics. The kids are neglected by their drug abusing parents, and they in turn have no one to turn to. They are afraid of having their parents reported for this, and they often deny their parents are neglecting them, out of fear.

I understand that its easy to look at the world from a very "leftist" viewpoint when you're in your university years, but once you go out and actually walk through this beautiful planet and see how messed up and disgusting society is, you'll know what I was talking about. Its a sad reality that will hit you in time. I once shared similar viewpoints to you, but you'll see. I can't explain any further until you get out there.

I wouldn't suggest generalizing this discussion into a left/righ political stance.  Since I know many people on both sides of the political spectrum that have various view points of the issue (in fact look above in this thread and TheRealMafoo has a pro-legalize drug stance despite being one of the most right wing advocates on this site).

I would also attribute a majority of social problems on poverty, not drug abuse.  Since it appears that people living in poverty are more likely to be drug abusers (alcohol and smoking included), so the drug abuse is clearly an effect of social standing, not the other way around.

One other benefit of legalizing drugs is by making drugs less taboo, getting help for addicts will be easier because you are able to remove a large level of fear that may be held by anyone living with unwanted addiction.

 



@bardicverse

The FDA's categorization of alcohol is wrong then. I've known plenty of people who have died from alcohol poisoning (had an uncle die about 6 years ago) but I've never seen anybody OD on coke and I know plenty of coke users. As for alcohol's addictive qualities; did you ever see a case of the DTs? Alcohol is extremely addictive and its withdrawal is ugly. The long term physical and mental damage from alcohol is staggering. Horrible physique, reduced intelligence, increased aggression and a spongey liver await most alcoholics. The only way in which cocaine is a bigger problem than alcohol is the fact that abuse may cause psychosis, although I've never seen a case. Personally, I'll do coke but I won't drink anymore.



largedaryll - From what Ive witnessed, it was exactly opposite of what you said. The people living in poverty were there because they spent all their money on their addiction, and the people doing better, trying to get out of the hood steered clear of drugs in their family. I didnt mean to generalize left vs right wing, as right wing people would probably promote the idea of selling drugs in a corporate market, aka Phillip Morris.



@bouzane - Ironic then, that the founding fathers of the United States were heavy drinkers. They were pretty brilliant people, and yes, I have known 2 people from high school that od'd on coke. As for physique, I suppose a heavy alcoholic might be altered, but I know quite a few hot ladies that can drink me under the table. =) Most coke users I've dealt with have been very aggressive for no reason, much more unable to cope with basic things like managing bills and taking care of house chores. I know, I lived with a coke addict and a guy who used coke lightly. THe light user was ok, but the addict could barely function



I've got to agree with good ol' Milton on this one.

It seems like a lot of pepole against this think that if a drug becomes legal, everyone will suddenly start using it, get addicted, and society will go to hell. There are lots of people who don't drink, and even more who don't smoke. It will be the same with the other drugs.



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