By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General - University/College education is so over rated

Well actually it isn't free here either.

The government pays a portion of our fees and then loans us money on the other portion. When we are earning over $40,000 they tax us an extra 4% up to 8% for over 70,000 until the student contribution (our loaned portion) is paid back.

I also agree that it's complete bull to say the education is worthless and it also sounds like the OP didn't really research his career path very well so it's his fault he's in this situation.



 

Around the Network

I wouldn’t say that University education is worthless as much as I would say that some degree paths graduate far too many people. Essentially, there may be 10 post-graduate positions for further study in this field, 25 post-graduate positions for study in another related field, 65 positions in industry on a typical year, the University allows 600 students to enrol in the field in their first year and 300 of those students graduate with a degree.

More practical fields like Engineering and Computer science tend not to have this happen as much, and the worst fields for this seem to be those that act as feeders to law (Basically the Humanities and Social Sciences) and medicine (Primarily Biology and Chemistry).



To be honest, I'm tempted to do a MSc (and perhaps subsequently a PhD) and avoid the economic downturn until companies start employing and the world becomes more prosperous. It would also be a very constructive thing to do during this time, which will help me out a lot when I actually start applying for real jobs.

urgh, I'm so depressed about my future now lol



You're only saying that because you got a business degree.  Anyone who goes to college and doesn't know what they want to do gets a business degree which means:

  1. You have a lot of people with business degrees
  2. You have a lot of really good people with business degrees taking the better entry jobs
  3. You have a lot of people that aren't really good getting frustrated they can't find a job because everyone else who went to college and didn't know what they wanted to do did the same thing and aren't interested in what they're doing

Getting an education is not overrated.  Don't blame other people because you or your friends are not good enough to get hired.  Just because you have a degree in something does not mean that someoe has to hire you.  Someone once told me that looking for a job is like a full time job and they're right. 

Getting a job is tough and you have to do everything you can possibly do to make yourself stand out.  That means you have to get up every morning, respond to emails, look for new job postings, revise your resume to fit whatever new posting you found, write a new cover letter for each job, schedule interviews, send follow up emails, make thank you calls or thank you emails, ect. 

I'm sorry to sound cynical but most people that get a degree and complain about not being able to find job simply aren't working hard to find a job or they aren't good at what they're doing (or they got a philosophy degree).  They will stay up until 3AM watching TV or play games or whatever, get up when the sun is nice and warm, and then do nothing all day expecting employers to come to them.  Meanwhile, the people that actually care are actually trying to get a job and beating the lazy people.

I should know, after graduating with a CS degree I thought the same thing until much later I realized I had barely done any work to find a job (I expected them to come to me) and I wasn't that great of a programmer (I already knew this).  I was pretty much that above person and eventually settled onto a job at working the Geek Squad because I couldn't get anything as a programmer.  Talk about a wasted education.

Even after later graduating from the Guildhall I almost fell into the same trap again.  Luckily someone kicked me in the butt and got me going.  I had a late start at really looking for a job and had the additional trouble of wanting to stay in the Dallas area, but after 3 months of being unemployed, out of school, and a lot of hard work I finally landed a really good job.



Isn't this just supply and demand? If so, why are you complaining? There can only be so many jobs for qualified graduates. Those who aren't better than the rest won't get the job. Its as simple as that. Sometimes that means going back for even more school.

I graduated a year early because I knew I would have to spend at least three more years in school. Not being aware of the job market is nobody's fault except the person who makes the wrong choices.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

Around the Network
twesterm said:

You're only saying that because you got a business degree.  Anyone who goes to college and doesn't know what they want to do gets a business degree which means:

  1. You have a lot of people with business degrees
  2. You have a lot of really good people with business degrees taking the better entry jobs
  3. You have a lot of people that aren't really good getting frustrated they can't find a job because everyone else who went to college and didn't know what they wanted to do did the same thing and aren't interested in what they're doing

Getting an education is not overrated.  Don't blame other people because you or your friends are not good enough to get hired.  Just because you have a degree in something does not mean that someoe has to hire you.  Someone once told me that looking for a job is like a full time job and they're right. 

Getting a job is tough and you have to do everything you can possibly do to make yourself stand out.  That means you have to get up every morning, respond to emails, look for new job postings, revise your resume to fit whatever new posting you found, write a new cover letter for each job, schedule interviews, send follow up emails, make thank you calls or thank you emails, ect. 

I'm sorry to sound cynical but most people that get a degree and complain about not being able to find job simply aren't working hard to find a job or they aren't good at what they're doing.  They will stay up until 3AM watching TV or play games or whatever, get up when the sun is nice and warm, and then do nothing all day expecting employers to come to them.  Meanwhile, the people that actually care are actually trying to get a job and beating the lazy people.

I should know, after graduating with a CS degree I thought the same thing until I realized I had barely done any work to find a job (I expected them to come to me) and I wasn't that great of a programmer (I already knew this).  I was pretty much that above person and eventually settled onto a job at working the Geek Squad because I couldn't get anything as a programmer.

Even after later graduating from the Guildhall I almost fell into the same trap again.  Luckily someone kicked me in the butt and got me going.  I had a late start at really looking for a job and had the additional trouble of wanting to stay in the Dallas area, but after 3 months of being unemployed, out of school, and a lot of hard work I finally landed a really good job.

 

Even working amazingly hard, it can still be really tough to find that first job ...

Most jobs are gained through networking and very few students actively build a decent network of contacts while they're in school. What this means is they depend heavily on luck of a good job showing up on a job-search or for someone they know to accidentially come across a decent job for them. One of the best peices of advice I received after having graduated from university and getting my first job was to create a job for yourself long before you graduate ...

Essentially, you try to find a couple of mentors in companies you're interested in working at to help you as you approach graduation. From what I am told, if they end up liking you and seeing potential in you they will probably help you find a job after graduation within their company and/or will give you access to their personal network of contacts.



Good to see others catching on.

University/Higher education in a decent portion of cases is a very poor decision. Not that all college is bad, but it's forced so much on people, it's 'expected' of many, which creates a horrible problem.

Ultimately, the most important question one can ask is 'what do I want to do the rest of my life?' and find out if a college education is needed to acquire the set of skills. In many cases, it's not.

Far too many people go to college for the 'experience' and not acquiring the skills needed for their profession. Sadly, many jobs require degrees not because they're needed, but just to show that you applied yourself to learning the profession. A friend of mine has a BA in IT. When he applied for the job he currently has, their exact words were 'we don't care if you have a college education. All that 4 year degree shows us is that you took the time to learn. That's it' - a $60,000+ piece of paper.

The vast majority of people I know that have college educations (especially females) aren't using their degree in any way, shape or form, and are working menial jobs.

That's why I think that technical schools are far more practical. Our local technical school churns out hundreds of students a year in good work fields for in-demand jobs at a fraction of college tuition prices.

As for myself? I didn't go to college...Used the saved money to start a business. My girlfriend did the same thing. We're far more successful than any other person we know. Everyone that went to college has just got out, and are trying (and some failing) to get in their career of choice. On the other hand, we both have good jobs, and own about $300,000 in rental properties with ~$100,000 in mortgage payments - far more equity than our comparable friends that are $50,000 in debt for college.

College is good for some, but not for others. The most important thing is the desire to work in a given profession, rather than making a $50,000 mistake for a degree you may never use.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

HappySqurriel said:
twesterm said:

You're only saying that because you got a business degree.  Anyone who goes to college and doesn't know what they want to do gets a business degree which means:

  1. You have a lot of people with business degrees
  2. You have a lot of really good people with business degrees taking the better entry jobs
  3. You have a lot of people that aren't really good getting frustrated they can't find a job because everyone else who went to college and didn't know what they wanted to do did the same thing and aren't interested in what they're doing

Getting an education is not overrated.  Don't blame other people because you or your friends are not good enough to get hired.  Just because you have a degree in something does not mean that someoe has to hire you.  Someone once told me that looking for a job is like a full time job and they're right. 

Getting a job is tough and you have to do everything you can possibly do to make yourself stand out.  That means you have to get up every morning, respond to emails, look for new job postings, revise your resume to fit whatever new posting you found, write a new cover letter for each job, schedule interviews, send follow up emails, make thank you calls or thank you emails, ect. 

I'm sorry to sound cynical but most people that get a degree and complain about not being able to find job simply aren't working hard to find a job or they aren't good at what they're doing.  They will stay up until 3AM watching TV or play games or whatever, get up when the sun is nice and warm, and then do nothing all day expecting employers to come to them.  Meanwhile, the people that actually care are actually trying to get a job and beating the lazy people.

I should know, after graduating with a CS degree I thought the same thing until I realized I had barely done any work to find a job (I expected them to come to me) and I wasn't that great of a programmer (I already knew this).  I was pretty much that above person and eventually settled onto a job at working the Geek Squad because I couldn't get anything as a programmer.

Even after later graduating from the Guildhall I almost fell into the same trap again.  Luckily someone kicked me in the butt and got me going.  I had a late start at really looking for a job and had the additional trouble of wanting to stay in the Dallas area, but after 3 months of being unemployed, out of school, and a lot of hard work I finally landed a really good job.

 

Even working amazingly hard, it can still be really tough to find that first job ...

Most jobs are gained through networking and very few students actively build a decent network of contacts while they're in school. What this means is they depend heavily on luck of a good job showing up on a job-search or for someone they know to accidentially come across a decent job for them. One of the best peices of advice I received after having graduated from university and getting my first job was to create a job for yourself long before you graduate ...

Essentially, you try to find a couple of mentors in companies you're interested in working at to help you as you approach graduation. From what I am told, if they end up liking you and seeing potential in you they will probably help you find a job after graduation within their company and/or will give you access to their personal network of contacts.

 

Whoops, forgot mention networking-- without a doubt important.  Most colleges hold career fairs that only students can enter and that's a great chance to network.  Also, most schools (not meaning college, meaning your colleges school of business or whatever) have some sort of frat or orginization that sole purpose is for networking. 

If you sit in your dorm and do nothing you'll struggle, but if you go out to career fairs and join an orginization or two you can do well.  I was in engineering frat (Theta Tau) and they did lots to help members build resumes and contacts.  I just had trouble because I didn't take advantage of those.

And MrStickBall is right, college is only as good as the effort you put in it and only if you have some sort of plan.  Just going for the sake of going isn't going to do much for you and you're only going to waste your time and money.  You'll still get life experience out of it which is nice, but life experience alone isn't going to get you a job.

Also he's right that most people don't actually use their actual degree titles, but they still come in handy.  My wife triple majored in Computer Science, Math, and English and she isn't a programmer, mathmatician, or...whatever an English major would use, she's a project manager at a web development company.  While she doesn't directly use any of her degrees, the CS and English degrees still very much contribute to her job and make her a better project manager.

-edit-

And not trying say anyone is wrong here, just bothers me to see people graduate and then expect employers to bend over backwards for them because they have a degree mainly because I use to think like that.  I thought jobs would come to me and I could not have been more wrong and just trying to inform people. 



Mmm strange, even in this day and age I can hardly relate to any of the horror-stories here.

I'm currently busy with my masters degree in management-consultancy (university level.) Even before my bachelorsdegree I was hired by a consultancyfirm to do a project for them. After that during graduation I was employed by Heineken as a sales-analyst and I'm currently working as a bookkeeper. A day after I was hired, I got a call if I was interested in doing a project at a hospital to smoothen the work for staff with their new ICT system...

I'm a bit sceptical for finding a job in consultancy in +6 months or so but looking at the firm that got me hired for Heineken, they still post very interesting jobs. Consultancyjobs aswell.
I'd say networking is a major contributor to your future job but... really, an impressive pre-working resumé is so aswell.

(Now to sign up myself for a coaching traject)



The Doctor will see you now  Promoting Lesbianism -->

                              

Advertising FTW.

We're the rockstars of the business world.

Booze, sex, drugs and creativity.

ha