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Forums - Sales Discussion - The Xbox 360 has overtaken the PS3 in Europe!!

Staude said:
Cypher1980 said:
selnor said:
tombi123 said:
selnor said:
tombi123 said:
The year and a half head start sure made a difference :)

PS3 will be back on top with a price cut.

Of course it will...........Of course it will, won't it?

De Ja Vu is the craziest thing.

 

 

 The last time the PS3 had a price cut in Europe, it caught up and passed the 360 pretty quickly. Then the 360 has (2) price cuts in Europe and passes the PS3 fairly quickly. So when the PS3 next gets a price cut in Europe, it should pass the 360 fairly quickly, no?

If my local shops in UK are anything to go buy, it's gonna be much tougher. As I said before they only have 2 bays for PS3, 8 for 360 and 12 for wii. They cut PS3 from 4 to 2 last week. UK PS3 is certainly not really looked at much. This is in Game the biggest highstreet shop for Games consoles.

 

 

At my local Game shop the PS3 still has 3 bays but it has been pushed to the very back of the shop behind all the Pre owned games.

 

Not great product placement !

This is a pretty big gamestore near where i live (they deal in electronics too, and film and music.)

Now, the 360 and the wii (and EA XD) all have their own .. spots like it. The difference being that the Wii and the 360 ones aren't as obvious and are smaller. They both have 1 or 2 set ups instead of the 4 seen here.

Going from that the ps3 should be doing great. (btw i'll note that all 4 systems were set up with little big planet. Another note is that when i was leaving a few mins later, the area was pretty tightly packed with people)

Now i know my sample is from 1 store, but so is yours. (if we go by both yours, that's 2 stores, but i can count that, i have another picture from another store, but instead of showing it i'll just explain (since it really only shows off some little big planet advertisement)

 

In most stores where i live, right when you get in the door there are New Releases, and then there are Playstation 3. It's often followed by Wii or Playstation 2 and the psp is located somewhere but not as obvious (often in a corner :( )

The 360 is often placed rather bad, with a little of the other wall (PC) dedicated too it. It's often more hidden away etc....

 

My point is (i don't want to start riots) That it's fairly obvious that it depends on where you live, which console has the most shelf space and where it's located. While you may be right, you might also be wrong. Only time will tell.

 

 

retailers aint stupid, they know once the ps3 goes to a more affordable price, it will be BIG! just look at how it sells now with the current price, it aint rocket science to see that if it was even £50 cheaper in the UK, sales would go up the roof!



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selnor said:
Staude said:
FishyJoe said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

On the flip side, MS has a tendency to not do well in early product generations, yet take over the market in successive generations. Anyone remember Windows 1 or 2? How about IE 1 or 2? Those were commercial failures. It wasn't until a few generations passed that MS wound up being on top. I'm not saying it's always worked out that way, but there is no denying that MS has a history succeeding after a few product iterations.

yes but there is a rapid difference here. These previous markets were the OS market where the sole reason for microsofts dominence was their contract with ibm.

IE have never been a commercial success. They contracted and cheated the developers out of their money (by bundling it for free) whereafter they were sued (and lost i think?) and to this day they haven't made money directly off IE. :p (which has lost a lot of it's dominence too)

 

@JHawkNH

Actually my point is that microsoft haven't really made any money of any of their xbox'es yet. With profit from their entertainment devision most likely coming from zune and other products.

 

You seem very narrow minded for business. This gen is completely different. For M$ at least. Sony have been very silly indeed making online free. It isnt helping sell the console at all.

M$ have 14+mill gold subscribers now. (you do the math each month that they make). On top of that they sell shitloads more software than PS3 and in many cases the wii. So it's not just about the HW sale itself. If I'm wrong tell me, but dont you have to have a 360 for Xbox Live? That means their Xbox's are making money. Heres Bach from M$ in late November interview.

“Sometimes we make some money on the hardware, sometimes we lose money,” Bach said.

“The business is neutral for us. We earn money from the games or from our online service Xbox Live, which is going very well.

http://www.gamer.tm/news.php?id=3245

M$ make 70 mill just on Live Gold accounts in 1 month. Based on $5/month of 14 mill Subscriptions (likely more now). Thats 840 mill in 12 months through Live. Add to that the downloads and your probably looking currently at 1bill+ just from Live each year.

 

 

stop saying hes narrow minded when its you with the problems! i will give you one thing, atleast you dont hide the fact that you are a hardcore xbox fanboy!



SOLIDSNAKE08 said:
selnor said:
Staude said:
FishyJoe said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

On the flip side, MS has a tendency to not do well in early product generations, yet take over the market in successive generations. Anyone remember Windows 1 or 2? How about IE 1 or 2? Those were commercial failures. It wasn't until a few generations passed that MS wound up being on top. I'm not saying it's always worked out that way, but there is no denying that MS has a history succeeding after a few product iterations.

yes but there is a rapid difference here. These previous markets were the OS market where the sole reason for microsofts dominence was their contract with ibm.

IE have never been a commercial success. They contracted and cheated the developers out of their money (by bundling it for free) whereafter they were sued (and lost i think?) and to this day they haven't made money directly off IE. :p (which has lost a lot of it's dominence too)

 

@JHawkNH

Actually my point is that microsoft haven't really made any money of any of their xbox'es yet. With profit from their entertainment devision most likely coming from zune and other products.

 

You seem very narrow minded for business. This gen is completely different. For M$ at least. Sony have been very silly indeed making online free. It isnt helping sell the console at all.

M$ have 14+mill gold subscribers now. (you do the math each month that they make). On top of that they sell shitloads more software than PS3 and in many cases the wii. So it's not just about the HW sale itself. If I'm wrong tell me, but dont you have to have a 360 for Xbox Live? That means their Xbox's are making money. Heres Bach from M$ in late November interview.

“Sometimes we make some money on the hardware, sometimes we lose money,” Bach said.

“The business is neutral for us. We earn money from the games or from our online service Xbox Live, which is going very well.

http://www.gamer.tm/news.php?id=3245

M$ make 70 mill just on Live Gold accounts in 1 month. Based on $5/month of 14 mill Subscriptions (likely more now). Thats 840 mill in 12 months through Live. Add to that the downloads and your probably looking currently at 1bill+ just from Live each year.

 

 

stop saying hes narrow minded when its you with the problems! i will give you one thing, atleast you dont hide the fact that you are a hardcore xbox fanboy!

 

 Wait so you argue against what Ive said. This gen is different. If you cant see that. Then we may as well finish here and say that Live does not make M$ money. Happy?



Staude said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

 http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2008/04/25/microsofts-xbox-division-turns-a-profit-again/

Correct me if I'm wrong--and I well might be-- but this shows Microsoft is turning a profit on the 360s instead of losing money per console sold....I think, right? Hm.

 

No. Notice the name of the division.

 

Microsoft's Entertainment and Devices Division.

 

Like i said, this division includes zune and other profitable products, possibly to cover up for loss on xbox hardware.

 

 Zune? Profitable? 


Wow. I want some of what your smoking. Without the Sony additives. Fact is (or seems) 360 is making Microsoft a profit, no matter how much you want to spin the fact or argue semantics. Doesn't mean they are out of the red because of the Xbox original, but it means that if they stay the course, they are heading to the black.



GOTY Contestants this year: Dead Space 2, Dark Souls, Tales of Graces f. Everything else can suck it.

FishyJoe said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

On the flip side, MS has a tendency to not do well in early product generations, yet take over the market in successive generations. Anyone remember Windows 1 or 2? How about IE 1 or 2? Those were commercial failures. It wasn't until a few generations passed that MS wound up being on top. I'm not saying it's always worked out that way, but there is no denying that MS has a history succeeding after a few product iterations.

 

 

They have a history of this when it comes to operating systems and office tools.

Other markets are a different story.



 

Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3

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damn double post



 

Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3

Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

 http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2008/04/25/microsofts-xbox-division-turns-a-profit-again/

Correct me if I'm wrong--and I well might be-- but this shows Microsoft is turning a profit on the 360s instead of losing money per console sold....I think, right? Hm.

 

No. Notice the name of the division.

 

Microsoft's Entertainment and Devices Division.

 

Like i said, this division includes zune and other profitable products, possibly to cover up for loss on xbox hardware.

 

 Zune? Profitable? 


Wow. I want some of what your smoking. Without the Sony additives. Fact is (or seems) 360 is making Microsoft a profit, no matter how much you want to spin the fact or argue semantics. Doesn't mean they are out of the red because of the Xbox original, but it means that if they stay the course, they are heading to the black.

 

Microsoft's E&D division also includes the Zune, Zune marketplace, games for windows, keyboards, mice, game controllers, and other peripherals as well as mobile software. Considering their last few quarterly financial reports, it doesn't look to me like the 360 is really making them any money.



 

Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3

Lord N said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

 http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2008/04/25/microsofts-xbox-division-turns-a-profit-again/

Correct me if I'm wrong--and I well might be-- but this shows Microsoft is turning a profit on the 360s instead of losing money per console sold....I think, right? Hm.

 

No. Notice the name of the division.

 

Microsoft's Entertainment and Devices Division.

 

Like i said, this division includes zune and other profitable products, possibly to cover up for loss on xbox hardware.

 

 Zune? Profitable? 


Wow. I want some of what your smoking. Without the Sony additives. Fact is (or seems) 360 is making Microsoft a profit, no matter how much you want to spin the fact or argue semantics. Doesn't mean they are out of the red because of the Xbox original, but it means that if they stay the course, they are heading to the black.

 

Microsoft's E&D division also includes the Zune, Zune marketplace, games for windows, keyboards, mice, game controllers, and other peripherals as well as mobile software. Considering their last few quarterly financial reports, it doesn't look to me like the 360 is really making them any money.

 

 And why is that?



GOTY Contestants this year: Dead Space 2, Dark Souls, Tales of Graces f. Everything else can suck it.

Yeah it does for now. But we all know that when a PS3 price cut happens sony will again take the lead in Europe.

But a congratulations is in order for microsoft theyve played this gen very well and have managed to atleast keep sales close to or above the PS3 an most areas



Long Live SHIO!

Shadowblind said:
Lord N said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
Shadowblind said:
Staude said:
^you can never know for sure. The point is that sony has a record for actually making their money back and microsoft doesn't However, that is completely besides the point if you read my original post which was only geared towards microsoft

 

 http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2008/04/25/microsofts-xbox-division-turns-a-profit-again/

Correct me if I'm wrong--and I well might be-- but this shows Microsoft is turning a profit on the 360s instead of losing money per console sold....I think, right? Hm.

 

No. Notice the name of the division.

 

Microsoft's Entertainment and Devices Division.

 

Like i said, this division includes zune and other profitable products, possibly to cover up for loss on xbox hardware.

 

 Zune? Profitable? 


Wow. I want some of what your smoking. Without the Sony additives. Fact is (or seems) 360 is making Microsoft a profit, no matter how much you want to spin the fact or argue semantics. Doesn't mean they are out of the red because of the Xbox original, but it means that if they stay the course, they are heading to the black.

 

Microsoft's E&D division also includes the Zune, Zune marketplace, games for windows, keyboards, mice, game controllers, and other peripherals as well as mobile software. Considering their last few quarterly financial reports, it doesn't look to me like the 360 is really making them any money.

 

 And why is that?

 

They've had a profit of $89 million, $114 million(give or take, I'm not quite clear), and a $200 million loss. That wouldn't be the case if the 360 were profitable.

You also have to take into account the price cuts, especially in Europe, where the 360 is just a step away from being cheaper than the PS2. Even if you want to look at hardware only, the arcade is probably being sold at a loss. Beyond that, you have to look at all of the money MS spends on advertising(which is far more than Nintendo and Sony), all of the money that it spends trying to secure third-party support, and the fact that besides Halo, its first party titles don't do so hot.

In order for Microsoft to turn a consistent profit, they would need the market share or the PS1/PS2, which they are nowhere near achieving.

 

 



 

Consoles owned: Saturn, Dreamcast, PS1, PS2, PSP, DS, PS3