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Forums - Sony Discussion - HOW PS3 process more than 256MB?? I don´t understand.

sieanr said:
fjburgos said:

Man people will never understand how the cell and the ps3 work, i really explain this over dozen times here on VGCHARTZ, and a few dozen more in other sites, and I'm not going to explain again I only wil say that the ps3 work very diferently than a PC or a 360 thats all tha you ned to know, and thats why is dificult to program for, the cell is a new technology that can procces grafis like a vieo card thats the only thing i will say.

How does a processor thats over 2 years old qualify as new technology?

In the same way that Real Soon Now the PS3 will have better graphics than modern PCs.

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957

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kibebr said:
But after all that... seems that there´s de 256MB data limit, right? (a)

The truth is that in graphical terms, those triangles doesn't even take up 32 bytes of transfer (which the GDDR3 comonly uses in each of its pre-fetch), the XDR allows more and lower latency transfer which delivers more precise models.

The 256MB comes into play when you have huge texture that needs to be dumped into the memory for future quick access; as i've already mentioned, that's the usual method how graphic rendering works at the moment, putting pre-rendered and often access textures in memory, which is why you often see games not utilize the PS3 might have degrades compare to X360. (One of the often quoted issue is Framerate problem, which could point to the PS3 CPU trying to access the texture from another place instead of the memory where it can be accessed faster).

The PS3's main focus is the render many stuff in real time through parallel processing. If you see the Sony ads about "each rain drop being different" that's what they are talking about. Currently, most of these rain drop affects are like "pre-made" and stored in memory, so CPU can just pull it up for rendering. What PS3 is trying to do is rendering individual raindrops in real time using logarithms which give each raindrop their own unique physics.

Again I have to mention, how much of that can be realized is up to the developer... I'd imagine there is a lot of work to make something like that work in a real game.



I love these explanations... They are so hilarious. :D

 

*with very informative sound tone*

"PS3 doesn't have to use memory to store information. It can do it real time."

*with very informative sound tone*

 

That one made me break... Yes, please make new thread. :D

 

Btw, engines today use triangle strips & triangle fans to move even more stuff(Not to mention display lists, which give nice boost too.).

One triangle has 3 angles, which are the three vertexes. Every vertex have 3 floats(XYZ-coordinates) each so its 3*3 floats, which means 3*3*4=36 bytes as floats are 4 bytes... etc. etc. etc.

(For example GT5 cars are 200000 polygons/triangles, which means 200000*36 bytes(~7MB) for each, if you store those as triangles. Its a whole lotta more than 32 bytes, don't you think? :) )

Maybe I don't know anything, maybe I do.

(Anyway, if youre in doubt check the 3D engine I am working on + my other projects(My signature). ;) )



NOW I DON´T UNDERSTAND NOTHING.... HEEELP



PSN: franco-br
MGS4, GH, MW2, GT5p, WipeoutHD, etc..etc..

@ errorrr, thx you are hilarious!

After reading your posts i actually feel smart now............. in comparison to you :)



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Ohhh f$#@ , no one will try to end this thread??? OH H OHHH



PSN: franco-br
MGS4, GH, MW2, GT5p, WipeoutHD, etc..etc..

SOOO, concluding: PS3 memory architecture is faster and holds more data than GDDR3... is that right?



PSN: franco-br
MGS4, GH, MW2, GT5p, WipeoutHD, etc..etc..

kibebr said:
NOW I DON´T UNDERSTAND NOTHING.... HEEELP

The thing is PS3 can't process more than 256MB. Think memory as your hands and harddrive & Blu-ray as outside world. You can easily use(process) stuff in your hands, but you cannot carry more than 2 objects if you wish to be able to use them. Whenever you need something from outside world it takes some time to put thing(s) away from your hand(s) and maybe finding stuff from outside world will take some time too. On the otherhand if you have those things already in your hands you can start doing whatever you were going to do instantly. Also two hands is always two hands no matter how fast your hands are(So 256MB in anykind of memory is still 256MB).

(Hopefully this isn't too hard to understand...)



Jo21 said:
errorrrr said:

i think the basic thing you are misunderstanding that RAM =/= speed, CPU's process power = speed. In a traditional computer, having more RAM will "help" speed is because instead of using your Hard Drive as "RAM" (which you probably dont' notice, but it's there as Virtual Memory), you have RAM that are specifically designed to store randomly accessed piece of information. Those information are dumped once your computer shuts off.

RAM works similar to HDD in terms of memory, but the difference is, that stuff in your RAM sticks are much easier and A LOT faster to be accessed, while HDD have a mechanical bottleneck to it (Spinning of the actual disk) as well as an interface bottleneck. The bigger the RAM, the more information that can be stored in location that can be accessed quickly.

Now, with the cell structure, it doesn't work like that, as of the details I am not sure. But I am guessing that instead of having to store those bits and pieces in RAM like traditional computer, the cell's 6 SPE (available to game developers) can processed the information real time instead of having the stuff store in a certain location and they chose to use 256mb of XDR type ram instead of GDDR3 type rams which are found on X360 and Wiis

If you know the XDR and GDDR3, you'll first notice that XDR's focus on speed, and I think that's what the PS3's main focus when building the machine... It's to process information quickly, and not relying on the old formula of dumping pre-rendered textures into ram... this obviously help with FREQUENT and RAPID rendering as opposed to statics.

 

thank you! =D

posts like these are why the internet was made.

 



FelmanX said:
Jo21 said:
errorrrr said:

i think the basic thing you are misunderstanding that RAM =/= speed, CPU's process power = speed. In a traditional computer, having more RAM will "help" speed is because instead of using your Hard Drive as "RAM" (which you probably dont' notice, but it's there as Virtual Memory), you have RAM that are specifically designed to store randomly accessed piece of information. Those information are dumped once your computer shuts off.

RAM works similar to HDD in terms of memory, but the difference is, that stuff in your RAM sticks are much easier and A LOT faster to be accessed, while HDD have a mechanical bottleneck to it (Spinning of the actual disk) as well as an interface bottleneck. The bigger the RAM, the more information that can be stored in location that can be accessed quickly.

Now, with the cell structure, it doesn't work like that, as of the details I am not sure. But I am guessing that instead of having to store those bits and pieces in RAM like traditional computer, the cell's 6 SPE (available to game developers) can processed the information real time instead of having the stuff store in a certain location and they chose to use 256mb of XDR type ram instead of GDDR3 type rams which are found on X360 and Wiis

If you know the XDR and GDDR3, you'll first notice that XDR's focus on speed, and I think that's what the PS3's main focus when building the machine... It's to process information quickly, and not relying on the old formula of dumping pre-rendered textures into ram... this obviously help with FREQUENT and RAPID rendering as opposed to statics.

 

thank you! =D

posts like these are why the internet was made.

 

the third paragraph was full of fail, but i don't have time to explain.  maybe tomorrow.

 



my pillars of gaming: kh, naughty dog, insomniac, ssb, gow, ff

i officially boycott boycotts.  crap.