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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Reggie: Third parties don't "get" the Wii, more

Everyone have to take the consequences of their acts,if somebody choose a HD system this could be because the games for that one,if others choose a Wii,then you know what to expect based on the last generations experiences (a strong Nintendo first party line-up).

Third party developers have to face if the choices already made are the good ones.
If they feel like they could change the tide for the Wii,they would let this happen,otherwise they will continue just like now.

The "casual" spell don't make things easier for the Wii(even if some third party games had solid sales).

What's happen today at gaming industry is just unexpected.We have a king without the major third party support,and we have two racing knights for the second and third place with the most,this trend would change in a future,but how long until then?Wii's owners could wait for so long?Well,Nintendo is not alone, after all they have one of the most loyalty support base among the gaming community.But yeah,it's time for more plurality...



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c0rd said:
Squilliam said:

So... One of the highest selling franchises which has been made with a pretty good effort on the Wii bombs. What does that do? It means that shooters are going to be fewer and further between on the Wii. The Wii proved it can sell music games, and it gets Guitar Hero like everyone else. If the Wii proves is struggles to sell core games then I guess its more cooking mama and petz in the future since they have proved themselves to be profitable ventures.

You know the one thing which breaks the rule on metacritic for higher rated games vs sales are the innovative games. They are rated highly but they never sell as well as titles which aren't innovative, but have a similar or lower rating. Also I never said that COD was innovative, I just said that innovation hardly ever pays off.

And no, COD WAW Wii was not half hearted.

Well, it's nice you acknowledge that high metacritic scores don't just translate to high sales.

Regardless of how bad CoD:WaW opened, I think the game will still sell enough for a profit. It certainly won't do enough to force IW to port their CoD's on the Wii, though. I honestly wouldn't care for one anyways, they're better off sticking to what they're good at. I'll consider an FPS for the Wii when it's built specifically with it in mind and offers something unique - I have a PS3 for my CoD needs.

It's true that testing the waters of the Wii come with a certain risk, but it still doesn't make sense how few are really putting in an effort. I don't think making a unique HD game like Mirror's Edge is all that conservative...


@ameratsu: Generally when talking about exclusives, we don't include PC. Otherwise, the 360 exclusive library looks... awfully small.

There are two major questions though, would it sell enough for a standalone version to make a profit? And will it make enough profit for Activision to not think the time/resources weren't better spent on the PS/360/PC versions?

I don't really know whats going on with regards to the Wii and Publishers. Publishers can't force people to buy the games they want them to and people can't force Publishers to make games to their standards of quality for the most part, well at least not immediately.

 



Tease.

It seems like a lot of times, when a publisher releases a game on Wii and it fails to sell like we'd hoped, we blame the Wii's userbase for failing to buy.

That's not how it works. These companies, it's their job to figure out what the Wii's market wants, and then to provide it to them. There's money to be made there -- the most popular Wii titles are going gangbusters, and the Wii's marketshare continues to increase. Wii owners have proven that they're willing to buy certain titles... but not others, and it might not work in the exact same way as it does on the PS3 or 360. It would be a good idea for any third party to do some sincere and thorough reflection about what it is that makes a Wii game a success.

I believe that, when Reggie speaks about third parties putting their best content onto the Wii, he's not talking necessarily about FFXIII or RE5. Instead, he's talking about devoting their best market researchers and game designers to create products specifically geared to the goal of pleasing Wii's audience, wherever that might lead them. Now, that might well include FFXIII or RE5, but right now it isn't even a calculation. Most third parties are tied into making sequels to the franchises that have historically succeeded, or games that mirror the successes of others. They're not really trying to engage the expanded market, except a sop or two in terms of control, or simplified design. But the proof is in the sales numbers. If the new CoD fails on the Wii, the lesson isn't "well, Wii owners have to eat their veggies to get dessert," i.e. the Wii might not get CoD 18... the lesson ought to be questioning whether CoD 18 is the best use of their A-squad or not.

In the market, the customer is king. If CoD, or whatever else, fails to please, then change the damn design.



ItsaMii said:

Summing up. We get less games, they sell less, they cost more, they take a lot more time to be released and their quality is lower than in the PS2 era. If you think the 3 games you mentioned are worth that loss, then I have nothing else to say.

Wanna know what's wrong with what you're saying? You're comparing 9 years of the sixth generation to 2 years of this generation.
And I'd like to know how exactly the quality is lower. Maybe you're just bitter about having nothing to play since Mario Kart in April.



OT7 said:
Everyone have to take the consequences of their acts,if somebody choose a HD system this could be because the games for that one,if others choose a Wii,then you know what to expect based on the last generations experiences (a strong Nintendo first party line-up).

Third party developers have to face if the choices already made are the good ones.
If they feel like they could change the tide for the Wii,they would let this happen,otherwise they will continue just like now.

The "casual" spell don't make things easier for the Wii(even if some third party games had solid sales).

What's happen today at gaming industry is just unexpected.We have a king without the major third party support,and we have two racing knights for the second and third place with the most,this trend would change in a future,but how long until then?Wii's owners could wait for so long?Well,Nintendo is not alone, after all they have one of the most loyalty support base among the gaming community.But yeah,it's time for more plurality...

OK Sorry but what?!! No major third party support? REALLY? Then what are these "exclusive core game titles" in this 8 minute video alone?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYfEWUTNNxI

I still dont get it why in all of the upcoming games on the system they just dont get it. Seem most of you just want a online shoooter games and ignore the other genres thats why you all feel that way. And yeah, I include RE5 here because it is a online co-op shooter game IS IT NOT?

And yeah, these are all the upcoming Wii games including the last October conference. OH WAIT!

 

 



end of core gaming days prediction:

 

E3 2006-The beginning of the end. Wii introduced

 

E3 2008- Armageddon. Wii motion plus introduced. Wii Music. Reggie says Animal crossing was a core game. Massive disappointment. many Wii core gamers selling their Wii.

 

E3 2010- Tape runs out

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/march2009/ICG_Tape_runs_out.jpg

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donathos said:

It seems like a lot of times, when a publisher releases a game on Wii and it fails to sell like we'd hoped, we blame the Wii's userbase for failing to buy.

That's not how it works. These companies, it's their job to figure out what the Wii's market wants, and then to provide it to them. There's money to be made there -- the most popular Wii titles are going gangbusters, and the Wii's marketshare continues to increase. Wii owners have proven that they're willing to buy certain titles... but not others, and it might not work in the exact same way as it does on the PS3 or 360. It would be a good idea for any third party to do some sincere and thorough reflection about what it is that makes a Wii game a success.

I believe that, when Reggie speaks about third parties putting their best content onto the Wii, he's not talking necessarily about FFXIII or RE5. Instead, he's talking about devoting their best market researchers and game designers to create products specifically geared to the goal of pleasing Wii's audience, wherever that might lead them. Now, that might well include FFXIII or RE5, but right now it isn't even a calculation. Most third parties are tied into making sequels to the franchises that have historically succeeded, or games that mirror the successes of others. They're not really trying to engage the expanded market, except a sop or two in terms of control, or simplified design. But the proof is in the sales numbers. If the new CoD fails on the Wii, the lesson isn't "well, Wii owners have to eat their veggies to get dessert," i.e. the Wii might not get CoD 18... the lesson ought to be questioning whether CoD 18 is the best use of their A-squad or not.

In the market, the customer is king. If CoD, or whatever else, fails to please, then change the damn design.

QFT I Think the problem was not if Wii have 3rd party support or not, its how third parties cater to the Wii crowd. If third parties cant sell PS360 titles on the Wii, then 3rd parties should develop a game only for the Wii and not just port PS360 games. I still want to buy COD WAW though, and I think Activision can make a COD 4 port if the wii version sells well.

 



end of core gaming days prediction:

 

E3 2006-The beginning of the end. Wii introduced

 

E3 2008- Armageddon. Wii motion plus introduced. Wii Music. Reggie says Animal crossing was a core game. Massive disappointment. many Wii core gamers selling their Wii.

 

E3 2010- Tape runs out

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/march2009/ICG_Tape_runs_out.jpg

yushire said:
OT7 said:
Everyone have to take the consequences of their acts,if somebody choose a HD system this could be because the games for that one,if others choose a Wii,then you know what to expect based on the last generations experiences (a strong Nintendo first party line-up).

Third party developers have to face if the choices already made are the good ones.
If they feel like they could change the tide for the Wii,they would let this happen,otherwise they will continue just like now.

The "casual" spell don't make things easier for the Wii(even if some third party games had solid sales).

What's happen today at gaming industry is just unexpected.We have a king without the major third party support,and we have two racing knights for the second and third place with the most,this trend would change in a future,but how long until then?Wii's owners could wait for so long?Well,Nintendo is not alone, after all they have one of the most loyalty support base among the gaming community.But yeah,it's time for more plurality...

OK Sorry but what?!! No major third party support? REALLY? Then what are these "exclusive core game titles" in this 8 minute video alone?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYfEWUTNNxI

I still dont get it why in all of the upcoming games on the system they just dont get it. Seem most of you just want a online shoooter games and ignore the other genres thats why you all feel that way. And yeah, I include RE5 here because it is a online co-op shooter game IS IT NOT?

And yeah, these are all the upcoming Wii games including the last October conference. OH WAIT!

 

 

Nice gaming compilation(from the link)and perhaps you misunderstood my point,even with all that games that you point,major developers don't release the quantity and quality games that Wii deserves.

And I agree with @donathos,the Wii's crowd needs specific gaming experiences,that get advantage from the strong points of the system:the motion controls,and having a real Wii's owners profile,what kind of games would sell well on the Wii apart of Nintendo's first party ones,without ignoring the hardcore Wii's base.

 



OT7 said:

Nice gaming compilation(from the link)and perhaps you misunderstood my point,even with all that games that you point,major developers don't release the quantity and quality games that Wii deserves.

And I agree with @donathos,the Wii's crowd needs specific gaming experiences,that get advantage from the strong points of the system:the motion controls,and having a real Wii's owners profile,what kind of games would sell well on the Wii apart of Nintendo's first party ones,without ignoring the hardcore Wii's base.

 

 

 And whats quantity you're talking of? More shooters? More FPS? More online games? More action games? More RPGs? We core gamers are in minority right now, even the HD console ones. If you really want a solid core game experience then why buy a PC? Just to let you know, even Activision intended the Wii version of COD WAW to be low sales doesnt mean it is not a solid title. IT IS a solid title, even the online modes and the number of players are taken doesnt mean its not a solid title.  Then why it sold as it is now? Are word of mouth alone could sell this title on the Wii especially the ones that have no HD consoles like me? Is it because Wii owners demand games that isnt traditional and already seen in other consoles like FPS and shooters and RPGS?

SERIOUSLY, we're demanding the impossible here, we demand a mature traditional gameplay a shooter with very very good graphics even its not the Wii's main games. If shooters are niche on the Wii, then its niche on the Wii. Thats why The Conduit will not be in everyone's expectations especially on sales, Wii is not like PS360 please dont compare.  

 



end of core gaming days prediction:

 

E3 2006-The beginning of the end. Wii introduced

 

E3 2008- Armageddon. Wii motion plus introduced. Wii Music. Reggie says Animal crossing was a core game. Massive disappointment. many Wii core gamers selling their Wii.

 

E3 2010- Tape runs out

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/march2009/ICG_Tape_runs_out.jpg

Khuutra said:
RolStoppable said:
Reggie speaks the truth. Third parties, put your best games on the best selling console.

 

Yeah, this comes close enough to my own opinion.

 

 Activision gave the Wii it's bestselling franchise CoD. Check the result for Week 1 Others....

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Falcon095 said:
The Ghost of RubangB said:
NYANKS said:
Not meaning to be inflammatory, but I can understand third parties getting a mixed message when games like Carnival Games and Wii Sports/Play/Fit are among the best games on the console and games that are more "serious" seem to be missed, NMH, Okami, apparently COD: World at war.....

If Ninty changes their marketing a little, they could do a lot to dispel this, but they don't. And quite frankly, the only visibly hurt by this are some of the Wii consumers, so I can't fault them for continuing to push stuff like their Wii Series, Animal Crossing, and even Flash focus and brain Training for the DS.

Carnival Games is one of the best games on the console?

Also, the most "serious" game in the world is Brain Training, and it sells better than all your favorite games.

There are 3rd parties making amazing games for the Wii, and they are being rewarded with good sales, good reviews, and artistic credibility.  Anybody who disagrees has bad taste in games.

You forgot the most important thing from a business view profit those developers don't have to pray everynight because their games ain't need to sell at least 1m in order to make a profit, with 300-500k they are more than happy (ex, NMH)

 

The big gaming companies can't live on these kind of games...

That's like saying Big movies studio should cater to 2 million$ movies on which they make 100k$ profit...

Companies like EA, Activision need to generate a lot of revenue and profit to sustain their size, if they had to cater only to very small budget games they would need to produces hundreds of them and the market woudn't absorb them and all those games would end up being very similar ( because they don't have hundreds of new games ideas..)

Like it or not the HD consoles are bringing games to be like movies and every year we will have a few very high budget games that are destined to be blockbusters, the same way we do with movies...

You make a few very high budget games, you market the shit out of them, and they sell very well. That's the business model of the book industry, the movie industry and the music industry and it's proven to work...

The more I read the arguments of some of the Wii boys the more it feels like reading the latest critic of an art movie, destined for a much smaller audience, that may very well be very good, but just doesn't have that mass market appeal.

I mean Okami, De Blob and others might kick ass but it's like saying only movies like 'My big fat greek wedding' should be made ( which by the way is a kick ass movie) and movies like Batman, LOTR, Harry Potter and co should no longer be made... 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !