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Forums - General Discussion - Iraq Cabinet Ok's Date for U.S. Withdrawal.

akuma587 on 16 November 2008

Still has to go through Parliament, but this has actually taken place sooner than many people expected it to.  Most people thought we wouldn't see a final agreement until Obama took office.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/meast/11/16/security.pact.vote/index.html

Iraq's Cabinet approves U.S. security pact

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- The Iraqi Cabinet on Sunday approved a security pact that would set the terms for U.S. troops in Iraq.

The agreement sets June 30, 2009, as the deadline for U.S. troops to withdraw from all Iraqi cities and towns, Iraqi government spokesman Ali al-Dabbagh said.

The date for all troops to leave Iraq will be December 31, 2011, he said.

These dates are "set and fixed" and are "not subject to the circumstances on the ground," he said.

Twenty-seven of the 40 Cabinet members in attendance voted in favor of the agreement, said Iraqi Foreign Minister Hoshyar Zebari. One minister abstained.

The Cabinet consists of the prime minister, two deputy prime ministers, and 37 other ministers.

The approved draft will be sent to the Council of Representatives, Iraq's 275-seat parliament, later Sunday, where it will be put to another vote. "There is great optimism that they will pass it," said Industry Minister Fawzi Hariri.

Al-Dabbagh said the parliament speaker and his deputies will decide when the parliament will vote on the agreement. He said there were "positive attitudes" when the major political blocs met to discuss the draft plan on Saturday.

Zebari said the parliament will reach a decision before it takes a 15-day recess on November 25.

In Washington, a spokesman for the National Security Council described the agreement as "an important and positive step."

"While the process is not yet complete, we remain hopeful and confident we'll soon have an agreement that serves both the people of Iraq and the United States well, and sends a signal to the region and the world that both our governments are committed to a stable, secure and democratic Iraq," said Gordon Johndroe.

"While there is still much work to be done, U.S. forces continue to return home and there will be 14 Brigade Combat Teams at the end of this year, down from 20 at the height of the surge," he added.

Earlier, Sami al-Askari, an adviser to the Iraqi prime minister, said the draft included changes that made it "satisfactory" for the Iraqis.

For months, the United States and Iraq have been negotiating a proposed status of forces agreement. It would set the terms for U.S. troops in Iraq after the U.N. mandate on their presence expires at the end of this year.

Many Iraqi officials say they will oppose any deal that hints at compromising the country's sovereignty.

Iraqi cleric Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani said in a statement on his official Web site last week that he will "forbid any stance that targets the sovereignty of Iraq no matter how small it is."

In late October, Iraqi officials submitted several amendments to the draft plan to U.S. negotiators in Baghdad.

Zebari said at the time that the proposed changes called for a fixed timetable for U.S. troop withdrawal; a specific number of sites and locations that would be used by the U.S. military; and Iraqi jurisdiction over U.S. forces who commit certain crimes in Iraq.

Al-Dabbagh said the Cabinet on Sunday also approved a "draft framework" agreement between the U.S. and Iraq.

This agreement "establishes the principles of cooperation and friendship in the political, diplomatic, educational, health and environmental fields in addition to economic, energy, information technology, communication fields," al-Dabbagh said.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

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makingmusic476 on 16 November 2008

Good to see a democratic Iraq finally getting onto its own feet. :)

I just hope things don't go to hell when we leave. :/

Go Iraq go!



Jackson50 on 16 November 2008

If it has obtained the approval of the cabinet, which consists of the key coalitions, it will obtain the approval of the Parliament.



akuma587 on 16 November 2008

Looks like no one can blame Obama for it either, as this is what Iraq wants. Its definitely best for our country financially if we start withdrawing from Iraq relatively soon.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

Jackson50 on 16 November 2008

Well, we do not have to withdraw entirely from Iraq in June. We simply have to retreat to our bases. There will still be forces in Iraq to support in counterterrorism strikes, and Obama will also redeploy a number of troops to Afghanistan in the erroneous belief that additional troops will win the war. Yes, we will decrease spending some, but we are not going to decrease spending by as much as some people assume.



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akuma587 on 16 November 2008

I agree with everything you said, Jackson, but I am fairly sure that Obama will take advantage of the situation in 2009 and send some troops home if only for the headlines. Some will probably be transferred to Afghanistan, or sent home, retrained, and then transferred.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

Jackson50 on 16 November 2008

Yes, he will end some deployments and that will be beneficial; however, it seems as if some people are under the erroneous belief that he is going to end the war immediately. I am not saying you believe that, but I am aware of many who do believe that.



Kasz216 on 16 November 2008
akuma587 said:
Looks like no one can blame Obama for it either, as this is what Iraq wants. Its definitely best for our country financially if we start withdrawing from Iraq relatively soon.

That was the Bush plan... so no.  I don't see how you could blame Obama for it.

It's not surprising.

The negotiations and plans were basically decided back when Obama and McCain were neck and neck. 

They were just argueing about US immunity and how much immunity troops would have for crimes they comit.

I mentioned it like months ago. 

Honestly i expected Bush to push it through before the election to take the wind out of Obama's sails.  Then again the media might of took it as a bad thing.

The only difference really is that the dates are "set in" rather then scalable. Which was kind of a silly argument anyway... since "set" dates can be changed.  Though having to change "set" dates does make you look a little worse.

The dates remain uncharnged though.  Pullout in 2011.

 



akuma587 on 16 November 2008
Kasz216 said:
akuma587 said:
Looks like no one can blame Obama for it either, as this is what Iraq wants. Its definitely best for our country financially if we start withdrawing from Iraq relatively soon.

That was the Bush plan... so no.  I don't see how you could blame Obama for it.

It's not surprising.

The negotiations and plans were basically decided back when Obama and McCain were neck and neck. 

They were just argueing about US immunity and how much immunity troops would have for crimes they comit.

I mentioned it like months ago. 

Honestly i expected Bush to push it through before the election to take the wind out of Obama's sails.  Then again the media might of took it as a bad thing.

The only difference really is that the dates are "set in" rather then scalable. Which was kind of a silly argument anyway... since "set" dates can be changed.  Though having to change "set" dates does make you look a little worse.

The dates remain uncharnged though.  Pullout in 2011.

 

Yeah, I have been following this for months as well.  Its been a pretty interesting back and forth.  I never thought about whether or not Bush would try to push it through to hurt Obama, but that is a pretty good observation.

There was a lot of debate during the summer about this especially about the legal immunity of the U.S. army and when exactly transfers of power would take place.  The negotiations led me to criticize those who were strongly against a timetable (like McCain) when the Iraqi government were the ones who were pushing a timetable harder than anyone else.

 



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

Jackson50 on 17 November 2008
akuma587 said:Yeah, I have been following this for months as well.  Its been a pretty interesting back and forth.  I never thought about whether or not Bush would try to push it through to hurt Obama, but that is a pretty good observation.

There was a lot of debate during the summer about this especially about the legal immunity of the U.S. army and when exactly transfers of power would take place.  The negotiations led me to criticize those who were strongly against a timetable (like McCain) when the Iraqi government were the ones who were pushing a timetable harder than anyone else.

 

I am uncertain if Bush desired to hamper Obama's presidential prospect-especially after the raid into Syria. Forbidding the use of Iraqi territory to launch strikes against other nations was one of the four concessions the Iraqis sought in the amended pact.