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Forums - Sales Discussion - Japan First Day Sales (10/23)

@mrstickball: Lol WHAT GOOD GAMES were released there? WHAT big games? NONE.

MGS4, Yakuza Kenzan, Gundam Musou, Mosou Orochi, Dinasty Warriors 6, Devil May Cry 4, Ace Combat 6, Eternal Sonata, Ridge Racer 6 & 7, Valkyre Chronicles, Soul Calibur 4, Blade Storm, Disgaea, Armored Core 4, Armored Core 4 answer, Infinite Undiscovery, Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Ninja Gaiden 2, Virtua Fighter 5, Lost Planet, Tales of Vesperia, Dead or Alive 4, Dead Rising, Dragon Ball Z Burst Limit, Gundam Operation Troy, Kidou Senshi Gundam, PES 08 (Released half a year before the Wii version) etc were all released on the HD consoles.

And how does that factor into Wii sales, again?

Which big games were released on the Wii??
Tales of Symphonia (Spin off), Dragon Quest Swords (spin off), Chocobo's Dungeon (smaller than any other HD game SE has planned), RE:UC (spin-off), RE4 (port), Dragon Ball z Budokai Tenkaichi 3, Shiren the Wanderer 3, Kidou Senshi Gundam, Tenchu 4 are the biggest core games that 3rd parties gave the Wii. And as you can see most of them are spin-offs.

Why is it, then, that a port such as Resident Evil manages about 10x the sales in the USA then? It's not like anywhere else is having the same problem with the same games. Spinoff or not, the same titles are doing better everywhere else.

Comparing the HD libraries to the Wii one is just laughable. The Wii has gotten no main game from any big franchise so far, while the HD consoles are being flooded.
How do you expect big 3rd party sales on the Wii when the biggest games are on the HD's?

Yet no major HD releases (as your definition) has failed to hurt one iota of sales in the West. I expect 'big' 3rd party sales because the Wii has sold well over 30 million hardware units, regardless of how good the games are. Western sales of Wii games has proven this.

Dont be a joke, accept that Wii 3rd party game sales aren't good because games aren't good. If not, tell me why couldnt any HD game sell as well as the Nintendo made ones? Because Nintendo makes games that are huge there, and gave people something worth playing. 3rd parties almost completely ignored the Wii or gave it the afterthoughts. But as of late, Japanese 3rd parties have made far more announcements for the Wii and almost completely ignored the HD consoles. Wii without good 3rd party support trounced the competition, now just imagine next year when games start to arrive.

I'd gladly accept poor 3rd party sales if it wasn't for the fact that every other market is in exact opposition to what Japan is.

I want to end with a history lesson:

Zack & Wiki bombed in Japan. Under 10,000 o/w. 30,000 LTD in Japan. Opens in the US, and sells more in 2 weeks than it did in it's entire lifespan in Japan. PAL was even bigger of an opening, and almost did Z&W LTD in 1 week.

Dewy's Adventure bombed in Japan. 1.3k in it's first week in Japan. Comes to the US and sells more copies in 2 weeks than it does it's entire lifespan in Japan. No PAL data.

Resident Evil 4 launches in Japan. Does very well. US outsells RE4Wii Japan's LTD number in (you guessed it) 2 weeks.

All were/are highly rated games. Each came out in Japan first (showing which market had priority), Z&W and Dewy's sold atrociously in Japan. All sold far better in the West. That's not a console problem in terms of not having the titles to bolster a fanbase. That's a problem of the fanbase, period.

Argue what you will using the "'b-b-ut there aren't any good 3rd party games in Japan! It needs Metal Gear Solidz to survive!", but that argument doesn't hold up - Why have US sales done so well without insane 3rd party support? I'd fully agree with you and shut up if it wasn't for the fact that US/PAL sales for these so-called "bad 3rd party games" are incredibly good, and very telling of where a market leader should be. Not only this, with such tepid 3rd party support on a high-level, you'd think that the 3rd party games that DO make it to Japan would do gangbusters at a level unheard of by any console.

But you should face facts: The Wii is the fastest-selling console in Japan ever. Yet has had abysmal 3rd party sales. Even if the games aren't that great (and most aren't, I agree), they SHOULD be selling because the Wii has a 4.5m+ lead over the next best selling console. And in the case of Powerful Pro series, a 8 year old console is selling more copies of the same game by wide margins. How can you spin that? I can't.

To say it again, and again, and again: Why do you need these "lol WHAT GOOD GAMES" to make a valid argument? It's not like you absolutely need top-tier AAA games to bolster a lineup and sell well. The Playstation 2, X360, and every system before have made million sellers of crap games, yet in Japan, every game struggles to hit 100,000 units that's 3rd party.

 

 

 



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

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Yea actually in Japan you DO need big names to sell in Japan. Did you not notice how PS3 continues to fall when there are no big releases and that the 360 has been selling better than it because of GAMES? It's not constant like in the US and Europe, the wii can sell for years in the US and europe without releasing another game, but it doesn't work that way in Japan. The wii is selling because of 1st party software.

Tenchu was an OK selling game 10 years ago, RE4 never sold well in Japan it always sold way better in the west (yea, not far from 10x). Z&W and dewy's adventure are a joke, games like that bomb in Japan every week no matter what system you put it on. These are obviously the best examples you can come up with because there are no good examples Powerful Pro is a game that probably should sell well on wii, but it doesn't offer anything over the PS2 version. I would like to see if it would sell well if it was only released on the wii because i'm sure everyone still has their PS2.

When monster hunter or samurai warriors bomb then you can start talking about how 3rd party games will not sell on wii. Z&W and Dewy is just not enough evidence.



currently playing: Skyward Sword, Mario Sunshine, Xenoblade Chronicles X

I guess, by your argument, we'll have to wait then :)



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

I'd also say that cherry picking is saying that Carnival Games' buyers aren't in the majority when CG has sold more copies than every other 3rd party game outside of Guitar Hero 3 and Sonic & Mario at the Olympic games.

"Carnival Games buyers" can't be in the majority unless it outsells all the other 3rd party games combined. Guess what? It didn't.

Those are a few 3rd party games I looked at. In almost every example, US and PAL sales vastly outstripped Japanese sales.

...are you serious? We Ski? Nights Wii? Soulcalibur Legends? You can't be serious? No, you can't be, this is clearly a joke argument. Are you trying to tell me that these games which are infamous on the internet, coupled with a few ports, were supposed to sell well? These are your definition of "good games"? You can't mean it, because you'd be admitting that you have no idea what you're talking about. And Red Steel ROFFLE! It's nice to know that you consider it in the same league as Resistance, even though that game isn't 3rd party.

And I'd love to go back to see how you'd like to argue Zack & Wiki's sales on the Wii. Last I checked, it was a phenominal game that was supposed to do real well in Japan, and managed decent numbers in the US.

Trestes - I'd love to know how I'm being biased when I'm still proving a point I see as being valid.

The Wii is doing phenomenally. Just not with 3rd party sales. That's what I see. Attack me all you want, but that's what I see.

I guess we *can* wait another year or two to see how 3rd parties do, but we've been playing that "wait for a good 3rd party game" for 2 years now. How much longer do we need to wait? We've already seen critical success with Guitar Hero 3, Carnival Games, and the Resident Evil series - but all thanks to Western sales, which is my point. Japan has been non-existent in terms of moving 3rd party games. The West has been entirely different, where we've seen multiple million sellers. How can you debate that point? GH3 has sold 3m+ copies in the US for the Wii, yet in Japan nothing is even at 500k yet. Shouldn't that speak volumes as to how the market is for the Wii in Japan?

And these are the best signs that your argument is falling apart.

You're only proving a point that's valid in your own mind. I've noticed that. You have no concept of reality. Or rather, you have no concept of actuality, and take pieces and details from reality and combine them with your owns ideas to reach conclusions that, since they are not conceived in reality, have no impact on anything and are utlimately flawed.

The perfect example is using Guitar Hero sales in the west to make a statement about the east. There is no Guitar Hero equivalent in sales on the Wii in Japan. I cannot think of a single multiplatform franchise that could be released in Japan and sell over a million on each platform. The only conclusion you can make with such a 'comparison' is that a game like that simply doesn't exist in Japan. Now, a normal person would realize that and not make the statement because it is flawed and is superfluous because it reflects no form of reality regarding that situation. Instead, you use absence the of evidence to try to make a point that isn't true: because there is no game on the Wii selling like Guitar Hero, Wii 3rd party sales are struggling. In reality, there is no Guitar Hero equivalent seller on the Wii in Japan because a game with that history of sales has yet to be released on the Wii. That is a truth. That is the truth.

Another example of this little mind game you play is Soulcalibur Legends. Soulcalibur IV struggled to crack 100k on the PS3, which has nearly 3 million users. Soulcalibur Legends was a critical failure and is a spinoff. The main title is having trouble, so how much was anyone really expecting SCL to sell? Then you omitted little details of reality - there are no JPN sales in the database for SCL, the game wasn't well received, etc. Normal people wouldn't expect much from a title like this, but you go as far as to suggest that it should have been a sales pillar for the Wii. Really? Are you sure about that?

Then we get to Zack & Wiki. First of all, no ever said that it was suppsoed to do really well in Japan. I cannot think of a single point and click adventure game for a console in Japan that sold "really well." Zack & Wiki walked into a dead genre and came out pretty well for itself. Once again, you're making things up in your head to paint a conclusive picture of reality that's simply not true. Using franchises, spinoffs and genres that have no history of phenomenal sales is quite frankly misguided and juvenile. When your best examples of 3rd party support are Wii Ski and a critical failure of a Soulcalibur spinoff, you're reaching too hard and don't have enough to work with. 

 

My take on Wii 3rd party sales? They sell accordingly. There have only been two major releases on the Wii to date: Dragon Quest Swords and, to a lesser extent, Tales of Symphonia. The next big release is Samurai Warriors 3, and then Monster Hunter 3. Not Tenchu 4. Not Fragile. Samurai Warriors has a history of phenomenal sales, therefore, I expect high sales for it. Similarly, so does Monster Hunter. Tenchu does not have a history of phenomenal sales. Fragile is a new IP. No one in their right mind are expecting FF level sales from them, but I doubt it's going to stop people from pretending that their sales are bad and that the Wii can't push so-and-so 3rd party games despite the fact that it already has.



Tag - "No trolling on my watch!"