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Forums - PC Discussion - Intel's Nehalem offers no improvement in games

http://www.techpowerup.com/73680/Core_i7_940_Review_Shows_SMT_and_Tri-Channel_Memory_Let-down.html

...and their new SMT (Hyperthreading) and tri-channel memory show no benefit on desktop applications. A Chinese site tested Intel's upcoming Nehalem CPUs on games and found most games showed no performance improvement over their current CPUs. The 2.93GHz Nehalem (Core i7 940), which will be the highest grade of CPU on the desktop in Q1 2009, is about equal to the current top-of-the-line 3.2GHz Penryn (Core 2 Extreme QX9770).

Also, Nehalem will not be availible for the average desktop (sub-$200 prices) until at least 2010 according to this and this. Intel won't have a desktop part in the mainstream price range that's better than now until that time.

This means that AMD has a chance. Their Shanghai chips promise 20% Clock-for-clock improvement and clockspeeds of up to 3.0GHz at launch, which should be able to compete in the mainstream market against Penryn and some low-clocked Nehalems. AMD's Fusion (CPU+GPU in one package) is coming in 2010, and according to this Intel's solution is coming in 2010 too - except that AMD's 3D performance is far superior and will only be better by that time. I thought AMD was doomed and we would have an Intel monopoly, but with the fab spin-off news, and these results, AMD could even be competitive through 2010 which gives them time to launch a new architecture if they can (Bulldozer?)

The main result for PC gamers in the short term is that new Intel CPUs will not offer much better game performance.

 



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AMD and ATI back on top again? I'm for it, but I don't buy that site... I'll wait for arstech or Tom's Hardware



Cueil said:
AMD and ATI back on top again? I'm for it, but I don't buy that site... I'll wait for arstech or Tom's Hardware

Yes, I agree. I'm just wishing it to be true...

ATI is back on top right now though  - all websites say so.

 



Soleron said:
Cueil said:
AMD and ATI back on top again? I'm for it, but I don't buy that site... I'll wait for arstech or Tom's Hardware

Yes, I agree. I'm just wishing it to be true...

ATI is back on top right now though  - all websites say so.

 

 

To be fair the nVidia GTX 280 is the best standalone graphics card on the market but ATI's crossfire capabilities give its slightly weaker cards the ability to edge above it.



Words Of Wisdom said:
Soleron said:

ATI is back on top right now though  - all websites say so.

 

To be fair the nVidia GTX 280 is the best standalone graphics card on the market but ATI's crossfire capabilities give its slightly weaker cards the ability to edge above it.

Who cares about the underlying technology if it doesn't play games as good? We buy one card in the shops, whatever it is labelled, and ATI's cards provide the best value for money and best performance per watt for every price range from top to bottom. Splitting one GPU into two isn't usually visible at the consumer level due to good drivers, and ATI makes more money per chip due to higher yields and smaller die sizes than Nvidia.

 



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Soleron said:

Who cares about the underlying technology if it doesn't play games as good

It might surprise you to know that large-scale video editting is often even more demanding on system resources than most of the PC games out there.  In fact, a good friend of mine upgraded her video card to help her in this area and she hardly plays any games on her computer at all.

Soleron said:

We buy one card in the shops, whatever it is labelled, and ATI's cards provide the best value for money and best performance per watt for every price range from top to bottom.

I wouldn't presume to speak for a majority of people out there as that would be incredibly arrogant of me however I can say that neither I nor even my avid PC gaming friends have ever really stopped to seriously care about "performance per watt."  Power usage is important as far as knowing if a PSU can run it but that's about it really.  "Performance per watt" sounds more like a fun buzz phrase used by a salesman pushing a product.

Soleron said:

Splitting one GPU into two isn't usually visible at the consumer level due to good drivers, and ATI makes more money per chip due to higher yields and smaller die sizes than Nvidia.

Now why do you go from talking about what the consumer is thinking to something that seemingly no consumer would care about?  Do you care about the profit margin of the company when you buy a new kettle or vacuum cleaner?



Words Of Wisdom said:

It might surprise you to know that large-scale video editting is often even more demanding on system resources than most of the PC games out there.  In fact, a good friend of mine upgraded her video card to help her in this area and she hardly plays any games on her computer at all.

I know. By 'games', I meant 'user applications'. My intention was to say that the one/two GPU distimction is irrelevant to computer users - they see one card at one price. I invite you to look at 3dprofessor.org, a non-game GPU review site, which says in every review that ATI offers much better value than Nvidia.

I wouldn't presume to speak for a majority of people out there as that would be incredibly arrogant of me however I can say that neither I nor even my avid PC gaming friends have ever really stopped to seriously care about "performance per watt."  Power usage is important as far as knowing if a PSU can run it but that's about it really.  "Performance per watt" sounds more like a fun buzz phrase used by a salesman pushing a product.

OK, ignore the performance per watt. ATI's cards are still the fastest in the majority of applications at most price points. This is agreed upon by most respected hardware review sites. I would say that counts as 'on top'.

As for "fun buzz phrases", where do you think "single fastest GPU" came from? Nvidia PR. It spins ATI's victory into an apparent Nvidia one.

Soleron said:

Splitting one GPU into two isn't usually visible at the consumer level due to good drivers, and ATI makes more money per chip due to higher yields and smaller die sizes than Nvidia.

Now why do you go from talking about what the consumer is thinking to something that seemingly no consumer would care about?  Do you care about the profit margin of the company when you buy a new kettle or vacuum cleaner?

You were the one who brought up one GPU vs two when it makes no difference to the consumer. I'm saying it was a technology decision - ATI could have created a single fast GPU better than the GTX280 but didn't, not because they were inferior but because it was a better business decision. 

 

 



Until ATI drivers are at least on par with the Nvidia offerings for Linux, ATI is garbage. Sure they have improved, but not enough for me to care.



the article is complete crap.. I have seen more reports saying 50% increases across the board.

 

edit: even the rumors that Nahalem wont overclock for crap is crap.

http://www.nordichardware.com/news,8224.html



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rendo said:
Until ATI drivers are at least on par with the Nvidia offerings for Linux, ATI is garbage. Sure they have improved, but not enough for me to care.

WTF? They are. I'm currently using the open-source radeon driver, ATI funded, to run Compiz and 3D applications on an R600 (HD3xxx) card. radeon supports everything from R100 to the latest RV770. In the proprietary driver, ATI have just added power management, software overclocking, multi-monitor support and will soon add Crossfire. 3D performance in the proprietary driver is level with Nvidia and the the OSS driver is heading that way. What more do you want?