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Forums - General - We live in a bubble. Seriously.

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/science/space/2008-09-30-cosmic-bubble_N.htm

If the notion of dark energy sounds improbable, get ready for an even more outlandish suggestion.

Earth may be trapped in an abnormal bubble of space-time that is particularly void of matter. Scientists say this condition could account for the apparent acceleration of the universe's expansion, for which dark energy currently is the leading explanation.

Dark energy is the name given to the hypothetical force that could be drawing all the stuff in the universe outward at an ever-increasing rate. Current thinking is that 74% of the universe could be made up of this exotic dark energy, with another 21% being dark matter, and normal matter comprising the remaining 5%.

Until now, there has been no good way to choose between dark energy or the void explanation, but a new study outlines a potential test of the bubble scenario.

If we were in an unusually sparse area of the universe, then things could look farther away than they really are and there would be no need to rely on dark energy as an explanation for certain astronomical observations.

"If we lived in a very large under-density, then the space-time itself wouldn't be accelerating," said researcher Timothy Clifton of Oxford University in England. "It would just be that the observations, if interpreted in the usual way, would look like they were."

Scientists first detected the acceleration by noting that distant supernovae seemed to be moving away from us faster than they should be. One type of supernova (called Type Ia) is a useful distance indicator, because the explosions always have the same intrinsic brightness. Since light gets dimmer the farther it travels, that means that when the supernovae appear faint to us, they are far away, and when they appear bright, they are closer in.

But if we happened to be in a portion of the universe with less matter in it than normal, then the space-time around us would be different than it is outside, because matter warps space-time. Light travelling from supernovae outside our bubble would appear dimmer, because the light would diverge more than we would expect once it got inside our void.

One problem with the void idea, though, is that it negates a principle that has reigned in astronomy for more than 450 years: namely, that our place in the universe isn't special. When Nicholas Copernicus argued that it made much more sense for the Earth to be revolving around the sun than vice versa, it revolutionized science. Since then, most theories have to pass the Copernican test. If they require our planet to be unique, or our position to be exalted, the ideas often seem unlikely.

"This idea that we live in a void would really be a statement that we live in a special place," Clifton told SPACE.com. "The regular cosmological model is based on the idea that where we live is a typical place in the universe. This would be a contradiction to the Copernican principle."

Clifton, along with Oxford researchers Pedro G. Ferreira and Kate Land, say that in coming years we may be able to distinguish between dark energy and the void. They point to the upcoming Joint Dark Energy Mission, planned by NASA and the U.S. Department of Energy to launch in 2014 or 2015. The satellite aims to measure the expansion of the universe precisely by observing about 2,300 supernovae.

The scientists suggest that by looking at a large number of supernovae in a certain region of the universe, they should be able to tell whether the objects are really accelerating away, or if their light is merely being distorted in a void.

The new study will be detailed in an upcoming issue of the journal Physical Review Letters.



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Hmm.
So how close would everything really be?



Okami

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This sounds just like Star Trek. I approve. :)



wow....the universe is so complicated.



My theory:

All forces (weak, strong, electomagnetism) except gravity have a attractive and repulsive force based on distance. Its hard to push two atomic nuclei together, but get them close enough and all the sudden they are very hard to pull apart.

What if gravity is a repulsive force at a certain distance? Makes sense considering that all other forces do, and it certainly makes more sense than dark energy and living in a bubble.



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This was interesting thx.

BTW, Yesterday I was introduced to Gamma Rays and how it can destroy earth in one second....Their are things you better don't know.






Am I going to be the only one to own up to the fact that the void thing went WAY over my head. I'm in AP Physics C, and I'm dumbfounded. I don't see how a void would make the distance increase over time. I'm not saying they're wrong; I just don't get it.



That is, how much closer could 10 sextillion stars possibly be?



Okami

To lavish praise upon this title, the assumption of a common plateau between player and game must be made.  I won't open my unworthy mouth.

Christian (+50).  Arminian(+20). AG adherent(+20). YEC(+20). Pre-tribulation Pre-milleniumist (+10).  Republican (+15) Capitalist (+15).  Pro-Nintendo (+5).  Misc. stances (+30).  TOTAL SCORE: 195
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tarheel91 said:
Am I going to be the only one to own up to the fact that the void thing went WAY over my head. I'm in AP Physics C, and I'm dumbfounded. I don't see how a void would make the distance increase over time. I'm not saying they're wrong; I just don't get it.

 

It's not so much a void of matter, as it is a less dense area of the universe.  If we do live in a less dense area of the universe, then all of our calculations that show that the universe is accelerating could be wrong.

Under the current assumptions, the matter in the universe is distributed fairly evenly.  Therefore,  there is very little difference in space-time as you travel across.  We compare distant object with nearby objects in order to learn about them.  However, as matter warps space-time, if we do live in a bubble of less density, then we would have to take into account the variation in space-time.

So, if distant objects are indeed in higher density parts of the universe, then our comparisons of those objects to nearby objects are flawed.  Light is affected by space time, as I'm sure you know. Since the light would have to travel through higher density matter, it would be more affected by space-time, and it would appear that things are moving faster than they really are.  Everything would be distorted as it moved further away, appearing to speed up even if it really isn't.

We measure the universe in large part by studying type Ia supernovae.  As mentioned in the article, they are always approximately the same brightness, they would all be the same if you saw them all from the same distance.  We measure distance of a type Ia supernova by measuring the amount of light that reaches earth.  We measure the speed at which something is moving by measuring redshift or blue shift.  As an object moves closer to us, the light appears more blue, if it is moving away, it grows more red. It's the doppler effect with light.  However, if the light travels through a different density of space-time, then our measurements are off.

I really hope I'm making sense here.  Just ask me if something doesn't make sense, I'll try again.



tarheel91 said:
Am I going to be the only one to own up to the fact that the void thing went WAY over my head. I'm in AP Physics C, and I'm dumbfounded. I don't see how a void would make the distance increase over time. I'm not saying they're wrong; I just don't get it.

 

AP Physics C wass an easy as hell course and of course it would go over your head because that's jus mechanics and E&M. Though I can tell you right now the E&M AP test will be your worst nightmare, even when you get to college.

Just to draw a picture of what Fayceless said. You know the general representation of the space-time continum being a streteched rubber sheet? With massive things pushing "down" on the surface more than less massive. When it stretches light takes longer to travel through the gravitational field of an object than if there was no object. Now if the universe is not uniform and we live in a bubble imagine what Fayceless said in terms of the rubber analogy.

 

OT: The problem given in the article is the very first thing that popped into my head before I even reached it. It is possible that there are other such voids though, not just ours.



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