I did not mean that. What I said was that ignorance misleads people into thinking what could be wrong is right.

In this case, can a gamer really say MGS4 has a great story, if he himself barely played any story-centric game at all? Planescape Torment was even compared to literature due to it's rich, detailed and deep story, and beautiful writing.

@ el_rika

I do love manga/anime and I've seen dozens, if not hundreds of them. That's why I know the inferior quality that the Japanese have when it comes to writing stories and storytelling. They usually get hung up of high morals and clichés, and they almost never do it with sublety or nuance.

NO MARRY ME

Seriously, MSG4 was so horribly cheesy and poorly written a 14 year old closet slash fic writer could have probably pulled something better out of his ass.

Some of the characters were interesting, most definitely, but my god.

If you seriously think it's that great of a story sit down a piece of paper and write down all of the key plot points for MGS1-4. Now read them out loud to yourself. If it still doesn't sound incredibly contrived and stupid, read it in front of a neutral audience.

And yes Planescape: Torment was some good story telling. Not high brow art, but definitely compelling.

I generally try to avoid anime and all its forms and definitely the nerd arguments,  but this comment was just too much.

I'll just leave it at that, I don't want to make it personal.

I do have to ask, though, honestly: Have you ever actually read a book that didn't have pictures in it?

I often play games because of their story. For instance, even though i know it's rubbish i intend to buy killzone 1 to play through it so i know the backstory when killzone 2 comes out. While i have no doubt you won't nessesarily need it (since the difference between them are so big) i still want to try it out. (for atleast gaining some backstory information)

I also really liked uncharted's story because it's so ... immersive.. and that's the whole key i think. Immersion.

Personality is also a huge thing... and the chars really have more personality than ... well almost any other game in metal gear solid 4....

Er.. it may sound rubbish but i'm having difficulty explaining myself here, hopefully you understand.

Excellent counter argument! You've completely changed my perception of the topic at hand!

Sorry, but the el_rika post was flame bait and needed a response. It is a horribly written game.  Shio being a PC fanboy has no bearing on the quality of MGS4's writing, I don't even know why you brought that up unless you actually think it's an argument point. 

Challenge still stands, if you think it's such an awesome story, go write out the plot points and read them aloud to a neutral audience of at least 5 people.  Parents, people at the local pub, whoever. 

I think Yahtzee was pretty much spot on in his review in this case.

Sorry, but the writing is gorgeous - it is inspired, it is humorous and it is dramatic. The Debriefing [for example] is easily among the best pieces of literature in the past decade.  The game succedes in connecting the fantasy universe of MGS with today's real world problems, with emphasys on war and its attrocities, like no other game or even movie or TV series. It raises questions few mediums [if any] dare to raise nowadays and it does it with style, intelligence and emotion. Maybe the Sci Fi show Farscape was on the same level of depth and awareness, but other than that, possibly none.

And just for the record, the moment someone is criticising manga writing and praises western writing, is the moment i stop taking that person seriously, so, have fun with your western writing, i'll have fun with my eastern one. I'm telling you this - do yourself a favour and read/watch some Miyazaki or Miura works and you might just reach the shore of that immense ocean of ignorance you are swiming in.

Cheers