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Forums - Microsoft - Halo 3 Scoops Edge Award for Interactive Innovation

reask said:
crumas2 said:

@reask... I assumed this would get a strong reaction from those who just aren't into Halo 3. And I was right.

So a game that has sold millions gets an award and thats flamebaiting?

If it was mgs4 or uncharted would you not post it?

After all it is an award.

 

Sorry crumas2  I took your post up the wrong way. 

 



 

 

 

 

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I've been waiting a long time to decide if I want to buy this game maybe this will help with the decision. At the local Hastings they have a $40.00 used version of one of the special editions.



My most anticipated games:  Whatever Hideo Kojima is going to do next, Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy Versus XIII, Gran Turismo 5, Alan Wake, Wii Sports Resort.  Cave Story Wiiware.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqqLMgbtrB8

Paul_Warren said:
I've been waiting a long time to decide if I want to buy this game maybe this will help with the decision. At the local Hastings they have a $40.00 used version of one of the special editions.

 

 It's worth a buy imo.



 

 

 

 

We hand out this accolade to the title released in the last 12 months that does most to further the creative culture of gaming – in other words, to mark out new directions for the form.

Above is the criteria for the award, according to the article.

If that is the case, this is not about who has the best on-line experience. I think that if that were the criteria, certainly Halo 3 would be the winner.

The question is -- or at least should be, if the stated criteria was actually used -- whether or not Halo 3 moved "new directions for the form" of video games. That is a very different question and is open to debate, especially given what the other games mentioned in the article bring to the table.

Mike from Morgantown



      


I am Mario.


I like to jump around, and would lead a fairly serene and aimless existence if it weren't for my friends always getting into trouble. I love to help out, even when it puts me at risk. I seem to make friends with people who just can't stay out of trouble.

Wii Friend Code: 1624 6601 1126 1492

NNID: Mike_INTV

... Well it is fun messing with the map. Placing a sh*tload of weapons and makes the map too saturated. It's fun yeah... Innovation.. ~_~



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Too bad that Rubang hasn't played Halo 3 so everyone doesn't think he's credible, but I think he's kind of right.
I HAVE played Halo 3, and I must say, I was not impressed by it's online.
The first problem is that you enter the singleplayer campaign like it's a multiplayer game. Of course, this is nice and all for online-coop, but before you can actually start the campaign, you've been loading for minutes, most of the time.
Then there is the Lobby system. Well, I'll be honest: I think it's shit. You have to wait for minutes before you can play, and you can't have any clue at all of who your opponents/allies are. Any game with a decent server-pick list(like almost every multiplayer Steam-game) has a better game-establishment system. Halo 3's Lobbies are essentially like random player select screens, like in Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Mariokart Wii, every other online Nintendo game. The only difference is that you can't speak to the other people in your lobby before the match starts, and I must say, that option is pretty funny. All those twelve year-olds swearing at you...

And don't get me started about the Forge and the Theater. The Forge is, yo my knowledge, the first time that a decent map-editor is in a console online game, making it essentially the only thing in Halo 3's online that's remotely innovative. Fair enough, but that doesn't make the game more innovative than, for example, Wii Fit, which is something that has never been done before.
The Theater is in theory a great function, but I couldn't get it working. From what I've seen: it's a neat capture tool, and unique on consoles. I quess I was wrong: Halo 3's theater is kind of innovative as well, so that makes two minor functions on a giant pie of decent ''been there, done that''.
To conclude: Halo 3's online is nothing THAT special, it's decent, but far from innovative. If this was all about innovations on online-gameplay, I would rather hand the award to Mariokart Wii, because it's actually the first Wii-game to have Xbox-like online capabilities. Unique.
But as it's about innovation in general, I think Wii Fit should have the award, becaus it's unique, you can't even compare it to any other game, and it managed to draw in many people who don't regularly play games.

Don't get me wrong, Halo 3 is a great game, but it's not special or something. If this wasn't hyped like the Second Coming, it would've been an above-average fps, of say, 8/10 quality.

This is the last thing I've said about the whole award, as I'm dissappointed in the immatureness of the industry's press, and I don't want to give them any more attention.

Goodbye.



The Ghost of RubangB said:
reask said:
@ Rubang It is a very good game imo and deserves the award.
It was my first halo experience and imo lived up to the hype.
Obviously people more keyed in also thought the same.

 

Well that's why you think it's innovative.  It was your first Halo.  For millions of others it was their THIRD Halo, and thus, "more of the same," henceforth "not innovative."

 

Galaxy revolutionized and raised the bar for platforming.

Wii Fit revolutionized and raised the bar for exergaming, and added a great new input method for future control schemes.

Portal basically invented the First Person Puzzle genre, and added great new physics tricks, and is the only thing I've ever seen (including films) that effectively mixed horror and comedy without being stupid.

 

Halo 3 added some online stuff?  Lolwat?

 

I agree with everything this post by Rubang says, and I OWN halo 3. Seriously, the game was just hyped to hell and that's the only reason it got this award.

 




JaggedSac said:

If you are willing to dig deep into the Halo 3 experience, you will see some quite neat features that Bungie has implemented.

Theatre mode:

Forge:

Stats:

File Share:

Party System:


Balance:

 

 

 

Just to be fair, I'm going to compare this list of added "Features" from Halo 2 to Halo 3, with the new "Features" from Brawl to Melee

Theatre mode: Brawl also has replays, although with limits due to memory-limits

Forge: Stage Creator in Brawl, much less advanced, but much easier to use. I can't get anything I want to work the way I want it to in either, but Brawl's is slightly less frustrating.

Stats: OK, there are no stats for Brawl, but there are "Records", which while clearly less competitive, they are there.

File Share: In brawl, but you must send the file to a friend.

Party System: Not in Brawl, because The most people you will play with is 4.


Balance: Capping the sword did almost nothing, because you can still get 10 kills. Halo 3's Balance is completely laughable. Headshots are completely over-rewarded. Grav Hammers are still whored by noobs, and plasma pistol is now even more useless. Melee attacks, or "assasinations" when from behind, are too powerful and far too unrealistic (pistol whipping someone won't hurt them as much as a bullet will), People still shotgun camp like hell, and there are an assload of more problems with the the game's balance. Don't even try to joke about it by calling the game "balanced".

Arguably, Halo 3's theater is better, and you might be able to argue the same for forge and stats, but:

Brawl has more customizable controls.

Brawl added a storyline, a first in the series.

Brawl has more characters, while in halo you can only play as A spartan or an Elite, or an arbiter in the story mode, brawl has 35 characters.

Brawl added Co-Op, whereas Halo has had Co-op since the first game.

Brawl added online, which was not in either of the previous games at all.

Brawl has more unlockables

You can play with 5 different controller types in brawl, while in Halo 3, you are limited to wired or wireless.

and the list could go on...

 




mariozeldametroid said:

Too bad that Rubang hasn't played Halo 3 so everyone doesn't think he's credible, but I think he's kind of right.
I HAVE played Halo 3, and I must say, I was not impressed by it's online.
The first problem is that you enter the singleplayer campaign like it's a multiplayer game. Of course, this is nice and all for online-coop, but before you can actually start the campaign, you've been loading for minutes, most of the time.
Then there is the Lobby system. Well, I'll be honest: I think it's shit. You have to wait for minutes before you can play, and you can't have any clue at all of who your opponents/allies are. Any game with a decent server-pick list(like almost every multiplayer Steam-game) has a better game-establishment system. Halo 3's Lobbies are essentially like random player select screens, like in Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Mariokart Wii, every other online Nintendo game. The only difference is that you can't speak to the other people in your lobby before the match starts, and I must say, that option is pretty funny. All those twelve year-olds swearing at you...

And don't get me started about the Forge and the Theater. The Forge is, yo my knowledge, the first time that a decent map-editor is in a console online game, making it essentially the only thing in Halo 3's online that's remotely innovative. Fair enough, but that doesn't make the game more innovative than, for example, Wii Fit, which is something that has never been done before.
The Theater is in theory a great function, but I couldn't get it working. From what I've seen: it's a neat capture tool, and unique on consoles. I quess I was wrong: Halo 3's theater is kind of innovative as well, so that makes two minor functions on a giant pie of decent ''been there, done that''.
To conclude: Halo 3's online is nothing THAT special, it's decent, but far from innovative. If this was all about innovations on online-gameplay, I would rather hand the award to Mariokart Wii, because it's actually the first Wii-game to have Xbox-like online capabilities. Unique.
But as it's about innovation in general, I think Wii Fit should have the award, becaus it's unique, you can't even compare it to any other game, and it managed to draw in many people who don't regularly play games.

Don't get me wrong, Halo 3 is a great game, but it's not special or something. If this wasn't hyped like the Second Coming, it would've been an above-average fps, of say, 8/10 quality.

This is the last thing I've said about the whole award, as I'm dissappointed in the immatureness of the industry's press, and I don't want to give them any more attention.

Goodbye.

No offense but you claim you've played Halo 3 but from what it sounds like not very much.  Maybe you are having NAT problems or Xbox problems but I've never found any of the issues of "loading times" you speak about.  Just for fun I fired up Halo 3 to see how long it took to get it started.

Single player

The Arrival: 22 seconds
Sierra 117:  1 min 10 seconds
Crows Nest: 51 seconds
Tsalvo's Highway: 42 seconds
The Storm: 50 seconds
Floodgate: 45 seconds
The Ark: 1 min 2 seconds
The Covenant: 58 seconds
Cortana: 51 seconds
Halo: 49 seconds

Average load time: 50 seconds

These were all time from the single player lobby selecting levels and letting them load.  These levels can take anywhere from 15mins to 1hour to play.  A one time loading screen of less than a minute is pretty darn good if you ask me.

Multiplayer

I only played a round this morning (had stuff to do) but search time was 22 seconds.  I've had the occasional game for whatever reason take a while but I'd say on average 30 seconds or so sounds about right.  Tonight I might play some more matches to get a better average time but we'll see.  Maybe not being in the US has some bearing on your matchmaking problems but it's a pretty quick system IMO.  Also if you're router NAT is set to moderate or strict it'll take longer to find games.



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L.C.E.C. said:

Just to be fair, I'm going to compare this list of added "Features" from Halo 2 to Halo 3, with the new "Features" from Brawl to Melee

Theatre mode: Brawl also has replays, although with limits due to memory-limits

Is the theatre mode in Brawl closely attached to a website, like Halo 3 and Bungie.net? Can you take photos, clips, etc and have them uploaded to a website automatically? Can you watch it online in game with a group of people?

Forge: Stage Creator in Brawl, much less advanced, but much easier to use. I can't get anything I want to work the way I want it to in either, but Brawl's is slightly less frustrating.

Is the stage editor in Brawl closely attached to a website, like Halo 3 and Bungie.net? Is it easy for people's custom maps to be played during an online match?
 

Stats: OK, there are no stats for Brawl, but there are "Records", which while clearly less competitive, they are there.

Are the records in Brawl closely attached to a website, like Halo 3's stats and Bungie.net? Are the records in Brawl easily digestible by third parties, like Halo 3's stats that are hosted by Bungie.net?

File Share: In brawl, but you must send the file to a friend.


Is the file sharing in Brawl closely attached to a website, like Halo 3 and Bungie.net?


Party System: Not in Brawl, because The most people you will play with is 4.

I will reiterate that the party system is amazing and I cannot stand when games do not have one.

Does Nintendo provide for seamless integration of new map variants and game types on a weekly basis for use in multiplayer matches? Such as Bungie does.
 
Halo 3 obviously got the award for their innovations in providing interaction between game and internet hosted features. There might be something similar out there, but nothing to the degree and support that Bungie has done.
As for your balancing issues.


Balance: Capping the sword did almost nothing, because you can still get 10 kills. Halo 3's Balance is completely laughable. Headshots are completely over-rewarded. Grav Hammers are still whored by noobs, and plasma pistol is now even more useless. Melee attacks, or "assasinations" when from behind, are too powerful and far too unrealistic (pistol whipping someone won't hurt them as much as a bullet will), People still shotgun camp like hell, and there are an assload of more problems with the the game's balance. Don't even try to joke about it by calling the game "balanced".

Maybe you should change your strategies if you die so much by swords and hammers. They are quite easy to counter(especially the hammer, which is only useful in certain scenarios)...don't run up to them.
 
Head shots are rewarded in most FPS games, more so in others actually.
 
Assassinations are there to make sure you are aware of your surroundings and enemy positions. If you get assassinated a lot(which I am assuming you do since you are complaining about it), perhaps you should be more aware, especially considering a radar is provided in the majority of the matches. If you get assassinated while having a radar, it is laughable. You should not attempt to bring realism into the realm of gameplay, ie. anything in Brawl.
 
Shotgun camping? That seems like more problems with your strategy. I will concede that a guy camping with a shotgun will get me every now and then, but not more than once. In fact, I make it my mission once I respawn to take care of the camper. Once you know where a camper resides, it is quite simple to clean them out. After that point I make note to check that position for the rest of the game in case that person decides to try the tactic again. If someone is constanly being killed by a camper...they deserve it. Shotguns are not a very difficult weapon to overcome, it is a very, very close range weapon.  It performs very much like shotguns have in games for years, deadly at close range, pitiful at medium to long range.  Not sure how game balancing comes into play.
 
None of your problems with balance are actually problems. I am not that great of a player and none these things are a problem for me.

Arguably, Halo 3's theater is better, and you might be able to argue the same for forge and stats, but:

There is no argument.

Brawl has more customizable controls.

Brawl added a storyline, a first in the series.

Brawl has a storyline? Super Mario Bros. had a storyline too.

Brawl has more characters, while in halo you can only play as A spartan or an Elite, or an arbiter in the story mode, brawl has 35 characters.

It is a fighting game, it is based on different characters with different abilities, fighting each other.

Brawl added Co-Op, whereas Halo has had Co-op since the first game.

Halo 3 added 4 player online co-op, which is nothing new.

Brawl added online, which was not in either of the previous games at all.

Brawl has more unlockables

You can play with 5 different controller types in brawl, while in Halo 3, you are limited to wired or wireless.

Keeps things balanced by only having one type of input device. That way players do not have an advantage/disadvantage either way, everyone is on an even keel.

and the list could go on...

 

Once again, the award was given for their marriage of the game and Bungie.net. It opens a huge door for future usage and the amount of content uploaded to Bungie.net is staggering, so it is definitely being put to good use. It is about creating and fostering a community of gamers. Bungie is also hinted at something huge they were adding to Halo 3 in September. Probably another good example of there excellent grasp of software engineering and OO design.

Nothing against Brawl but this poster's points of comparison do not match up in any way.