Another thing is how many parents would entrust their kids with an iPhone? Especially an iPhone where you can buy stuff with the push of a button. The DS can take a lot of abuse that kids will throw at it, I don't think an iPhone is anywhere near as durable.

One word: battery.

It's the reason why I have an Ipod, DS and a cell phone. Last thing you want is to miss that important call because you played too much monkeyball. Videos are killing the battery quickly on the Ipod as well so I don't see much use to play video and video games on the same device. If they would give us a device that has 100 hours of battery life playing videos, it would be different.

Luckily, Apple isn't relying on software sales to make money with their iPhone.

I don't expect the iPhone to have a big impact on the handheld gaming market. All Apple's little foray into gaming requires to be a success is to recover the costs of offering games and sell a few more hardware units than it would if it wasn't a gaming device.

I doubt Apple has big plans to crack into the gaming market. They're just trying to add value to their portable device in a natural way. If Apple can carve out a tiny niche in handheld gaming, it may try to pry that crack open wider in the future, though.

Yeah, the iPhone apps will be cool for iPhone owners (I can't wait to be one!!), but PSP/DS have nothing to worry about.

Going back to the original post, I just want to say that while software is certainly essential to success, hardware is not without value. Hardware can determine software and turn something ordinary into something magical. Look at Wii Sports. If it was on a system with a more traditional control system, it becomes just another ordinary game. While the DS's excellent software selection is the main reason for its success, you can't simply disregard what the DS itself allowed that software to do. Anyone want to play Elite Beat Agents on the PSP? Didn't think so.

Naw the new apple logo and the third party support isn't what it's going to take.

There has to be a major shift in what people see value as within the gaming world for apple to make head-way here.

They can try to get into it through up market with the PSP but if their copying the PSP model, well... look where the PSP is to the DS, it may have a touch screen, but the goals are totally different.
((Edit: I'll explain different here: The point of the hardware is to appeal to a wide range of people through other industries, music, movies, phones, and even cameras.) Adding games to a device that is already combating and winning in a lot of different industries would be testing the endurance of that device, but aside from that - clearly the more functions the device has the more expensive it will be, the focus will then by nature shift to what can give the highest return - the current up market does that for Sony/Microsoft so that is where they will go.)

The hardware may sell but the software will suffer - right now if 3rd parties are signing up with Apple to develop for them, they are just fishing for an audience. (Trying to find a wave to ride.) I mean if you've been paying attention to Apple you know that they have been using microsoft like footing on the mountain of success. But they will only get as far as what is giving them footing.

So it depends on which market Apple goes into, if they go toward Nintendos or Sony/Microsoft. Given their history they will if they have any intention to enter the market; wait for Microsoft.

Nintendo is the current market leader so business wise, whatever they do if it's a megaton it could change the shape of all the other companies in the market.

I only know cliff's on Apple anyway so that's just my logical conclusion.

At least Apple knows that for now.

does iphone even have a significant impact on the cell phone market share????

I normally agree with you, FishyJoe, but I have to disagree this time. Yes, Apple has little game development resources that we know about... for now. Yes, the software is a keystone for acceptance, much less domination, in the handheld market.

But Apple doesn't appear to be ignorant of the software connection. Case in point: they created the iTunes store to go along with the iPod. They knew the iPod couldn't survive on it's own, so they had to conquer both simultaneously to be successful. And they were... the iPod now controls about 80 of the portable music player market, and the iTunes store is now the largest music seller, bar none, including Walmart and Target.

EDIT: I'm not saying they *will* beat the DS at its own game... I'm just saying they might, based on how well they've done with the iPod and iPhone, even being late to the party.

On the other hand, AppleTV hasn't exactly set the world on fire.

I think there's a thing that has been left out of the equation here, and that's the AppStore itself.

My understanding is that Apple is offering the devs an extraordinary amount of freedom: you get the SDK for free, you can decide your pricing as you see fit (you can even give your program away for free, great for demos and stuff), and you get 70% of the price yourself. Also, from what I've read, they don't want to control the contents, other than that there's nothing illegal in there. So, I see this as a huge step in Apple's part to get 3rd parties on board, even moreso than for example WiiWare. Remember, AppStore is THE way to get apps on your device, and it's going to be (at least I believe so) as easy as bying music. So, Apple might really revolutionize online game distribution, at least for handhelds.