azrm2k said: ChronotriggerJM said: This generation ESP the Wii is just pushing innovation, innovation, innovation and seemingly anything NOT innovative is instantly garbage xD. I'm just relieved that they're taking the things I loved and they're making them better ;) Hahahahaha this cracks me up. So the Wii is bad because it is trying to change everything up and doing the same old year after year is now garbage? Isn't the Wii bashing mantra usually that Nintendo just takes the previous game, add's a new title and ships it out year after year? Everybody rags on Mario, Zelda, Metroid, etc... for being retreads. People bash so many Wii games for being the same old graphics and gameplay with "waggle" thrown on. And yet you're upset that the Wii is abandoning the staples of gaming and focusing only on doing new stuff?

 Ahh quite the contrary, I LOVE what the Wii is doing :P I think it's a fantastic new direction, like most things I think I'm gonna have to wait until someone takes there idea and makes it better ^^; but I like the direction :P And no I would think bashing Mario Zelda etc etc. gets old because they (rehash the same character in about a million different games etc etc etc). The stories don't change much, the graphics don't change much, the premise and stories don't change much etc etc etc. I mean seriously How would you like to play 5 different final fantasy games each involving cloud trying to kill sephiroth :P but then on top of that, have both Cloud and Sephiroth in a racing, tennis, soccer, baseball, fighting, etc etc etc game together :P Most people just want Nintendo to "mix it up" with the character design xD. 

 Besides you'll find I'm not one of those people that's quick to bash Ninty for doing the same thing over and over, in fact, you'll find my distaste for Nintendo being that they COMPLETELY CHANGED THEY'RE BEST FRANCHISES. X.x; I refer to my original statement that I want something of fantastic quality, not just "different". 

ChronotriggerJM said: azrm2k said: ChronotriggerJM said:    Ahh quite the contrary, I LOVE what the Wii is doing :P I think it's a fantastic new direction, like most things I think I'm gonna have to wait until someone takes there idea and makes it better ^^; but I like the direction :P And no I would think bashing Mario Zelda etc etc. gets old because they (rehash the same character in about a million different games etc etc etc). The stories don't change much, the graphics don't change much, the premise and stories don't change much etc etc etc. I mean seriously How would you like to play 5 different final fantasy games each involving cloud trying to kill sephiroth :P but then on top of that, have both Cloud and Sephiroth in a racing, tennis, soccer, baseball, fighting, etc etc etc game together :P Most people just want Nintendo to "mix it up" with the character design xD.   Besides you'll find I'm not one of those people that's quick to bash Ninty for doing the same thing over and over, in fact, you'll find my distaste for Nintendo being that they COMPLETELY CHANGED THEY'RE BEST FRANCHISES. X.x; I refer to my original statement that I want something of fantastic quality, not just "different".

Hahaha, lightens up the mood a little

 

I meant that it was ironic that the people who do bash the Wii usually love to do so by proclaiming how its games are more of the same when he brings up the Wii by saying it's changing everything and making innovation the status quo.

I understand how you and even Chrono could make the argument about Wii pretty much demanding innovation it just seemed odd given the usual arguments against the Wii.

Now that you bring it up, yeah, that was my biggest complaint about Uncharted (other than the stupid zombie nazis). It was a mix of many other games and cinema. On the other hand, it was pretty well executed and a fun game.

...

But I don't see how that applies to Haze. You act as if everyone was thrilled at the idea of it six months ago when that just isn't the case. There were plenty of "mehs" going around after the initial screenshots released. I was one of those people going "meh". I might rent the game but unless people whose opinion I respect rave about the game, I won't be buying it.

rocketpig said: Well then I guess Uncharted was "generic" too, because all it was was a mix of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones, right? Now that you bring it up, yeah, that was my biggest complaint about Uncharted (other than the stupid zombie nazis). It was a mix of many other games and cinema. On the other hand, it was pretty well executed and a fun game. ... But I don't see how that applies to Haze. You act as if everyone was thrilled at the idea of it six months ago when that just isn't the case. There were plenty of "mehs" going around after the initial screenshots released. I was one of those people going "meh". I might rent the game but unless people whose opinion I respect rave about the game, I won't be buying it.

It applies to Haze if what twesterm says is true, and it's just taking what other games have done, and adds nothing new. Now, why can't this game be "well executed and fun"

I mean, I don't see to many "mehs" on that comment section. More like, "I will get a PS3 for this game"

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/24378.html

But that was back in August....which is the premise of my thread. Why is it that when it was first showed, it was "wow" and now, the same game, and it's gameplay is "meh"

 

BMaker11 said: twesterm said: BMaker11 said: twesterm said: BMaker11 said: twesterm said: BMaker11 said: Not every game has to be revolutionary (and there have been a lot this generation alone) but we do also want something different. Why do I want to pay $60 for a game I've already played over and over again? There's nothing that's wrong with an overly generic game that's cheap, but if you expect me to pay full price for a game give me a good reason to want to pay full price. Ah, but see Gears 2 has shown me things I like from something I already really liked. I loved the gameplay in Gears so I don't mind paying for it again. From what I've seen so far they've also improved the look of the game (hooray for color), there will be even more enemies during the combat, and some of the new mechanics like meat shields look pretty awesome. If the trailer had just been Gears with different levels then yes, you would be right. With something like Haze, it's copying other games and not giving me anything new that actually looks interesting. So, you're syaing that you WOULDN'T pay for something "you already played before", but since Gears 2 will have gameplay like Gears 1, you don't mind paying for it...as you so eloquently put it, AGAIN? Read the entire post. Gears = a game I know is good, a game I enjoyed, and adds more things that actually looks good. Haze = a game that feels only generic, tries to do what almost every other FPS has done, adds nothing that actually looks interesting. One of those two games is good and is alright to buy again until it actually becomes old (kind of like the single player in Halo 3), the other game is a copy of meh games that have been done a hundred times before. Well then I guess Uncharted was "generic" too, because all it was was a mix of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones, right?

 No, while the gameplay in Uncharted was nothing special the story and the delivery was fantastic (up until the Nazi zombies apparently) and it just did a great job of making you feel like you were playing one of those bad 80's movies like Romancing the Stone we all loved.

BMaker11 said: rocketpig said: Well then I guess Uncharted was "generic" too, because all it was was a mix of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones, right? Now that you bring it up, yeah, that was my biggest complaint about Uncharted (other than the stupid zombie nazis). It was a mix of many other games and cinema. On the other hand, it was pretty well executed and a fun game. ... But I don't see how that applies to Haze. You act as if everyone was thrilled at the idea of it six months ago when that just isn't the case. There were plenty of "mehs" going around after the initial screenshots released. I was one of those people going "meh". I might rent the game but unless people whose opinion I respect rave about the game, I won't be buying it. It applies to Haze if what twesterm says is true, and it's just taking what other games have done, and adds nothing new. Now, why can't this game be "well executed and fun" I mean, I don't see to many "mehs" on that comment section. More like, "I will get a PS3 for this game" http://www.gametrailers.com/player/24378.html But that was back in August....which is the premise of my thread. Why is it that when it was first showed, it was "wow" and now, the same game, and it's gameplay is "meh"

Well, the genre Uncharted is in hasn't been overdone the past five years. That goes a long way.

After we've received Halo 3, BioShock, Timesplitters, Area 51, etc. and Resistance 2, Killzone 2, and Gears 2 are on their way, there isn't a lot of excitement left over for Haze. The genre is flooded and there is nothing that separates Haze from the pack. On top of that, it's launching in the wake of GTA IV with MGS4 and Ninja Gaiden on their way in the next month. Simply put, Free Radical missed their window of opportunity.

BMaker11 said: rocketpig said: Well then I guess Uncharted was "generic" too, because all it was was a mix of Tomb Raider and Indiana Jones, right? Now that you bring it up, yeah, that was my biggest complaint about Uncharted (other than the stupid zombie nazis). It was a mix of many other games and cinema. On the other hand, it was pretty well executed and a fun game. ... But I don't see how that applies to Haze. You act as if everyone was thrilled at the idea of it six months ago when that just isn't the case. There were plenty of "mehs" going around after the initial screenshots released. I was one of those people going "meh". I might rent the game but unless people whose opinion I respect rave about the game, I won't be buying it. It applies to Haze if what twesterm says is true, and it's just taking what other games have done, and adds nothing new. Now, why can't this game be "well executed and fun"

your problem is that you're taking things way to literally and being overly defensive.

A game can do what other games have done and still be good. The problem with Haze is that it in no way makes me think that any of the things it takes that has been done 100 times before is any good.

Well...sequals to games aren't usually revolutionary... this goes back to the old school days

Space Queset/Kings Quest/Police Quest/Leisure Suit Larry
Halo 1/2/3
Unreal Tournament 99/2003/2004/UT3
Half-Life 1/2
etc

But I dont think a sequel NEEDS to be revolutionary to be good...as long as the graphics are better, and theres a bit more features/ideas, sweet

I think when you change things too much to TRY to revolutionize, thats when things go wrong

The only games I can think of that had revolutionary 'sequals' would be Duke Nukem II -> Duke Nukem 3D

Doom II -> Doom 3

GTA II -> GTA3

but thats mostly because there was a big gap inbetween the sequel which gave time for technology to catch up

k how do i spell sequel? is it sequal or sequel?

rocketpig said: Well, the genre Uncharted is in hasn't been overdone the past five years. That goes a long way. After we've received Halo 3, BioShock, Timesplitters, Area 51, etc. and Resistance 2, Killzone 2, and Gears 2 are on their way, there isn't a lot of excitement left over for Haze. The genre is flooded and there is nothing that separates Haze from the pack. On top of that, it's launching in the wake of GTA IV with MGS4 and Ninja Gaiden on their way in the next month. Simply put, Free Radical missed their window of opportunity.

I support free radical dearly and I think Haze is going to be a FANTASTIC game, BUT I will agree with this point in it's fullest. I do think because the current market is completely saturated with AMAZING shooters, it really is hard to find the amazing hype balance, if this game wasn't delayed I think it would have been a huge success. I have no doubts in my mind that the game will be great, but I do think the hype for it is dead :/ I wish it wasn't because come on, this IS Free Radical :D but I can wish in one hand and shit in the other and I know which one is filling first xD