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Pyro as Bill said:
Ryuu96 said:

Simply lowering trade barriers, if they exist, won't be enough, because they don't factor into the random calculation of these so-called tariff rates. Israel, for instance, eliminated all of its tariffs on U.S. imports on Tuesday. Trump still imposed new tariffs on Israel on Wednesday. That's because Trump's real goal is not really to eliminate trade barriers; it's for the U.S. not to have a trade deficit with any country in the world.

Wall Street Blew It - The Atlantic

Trump has been a proponent of tariffs for decades but he's not stupid. He understands why countries usetariffs but he also accepts that America can win at the free trade game too if they dont have to compete with blocs that devalue their currency.

Yes, he is.

Pyro as Bill said:

Ive already agreed the formula makes no sense.

Lol.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 06 April 2025

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Pyro as Bill said:

Reminder - it was Trump who fastracked the vaccine that got us all out of lockdown months before China.

Trying to rewrite history?

How Trump’s ‘America First’ edict delayed the global Covid fight
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/12/01/trump-america-first-covid-523604

AP FACT CHECK: Trump distorts on vaccine, state distribution
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55721437

TRUMP: “As a result of Operation Warp Speed, Pfizer announced on Monday that its China virus vaccine was more than 90% effective. ...Pfizer said it wasn’t part of Warp Speed, but that turned out to be an unfortunate misrepresentation.”

THE FACTS: Not so much. Pfizer notably did not accept government money to develop, test or expand manufacturing capacity under Trump’s Operation Warp Speed initiative to quickly find a vaccine and treatments for the disease sweeping the country.

In fact, Pfizer partnered with the vaccine’s original developer, Germany’s BioNTech, in March and the following month announced the first human study in Germany. The White House announced Operation Warp Speed in May.

Trump administration refused offer to buy millions more Pfizer vaccine doses
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/07/trump-administration-coronavirus-vaccine-pfizer

Covid-19: Was US vaccine rollout a 'dismal failure' under Trump?
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55721437


Trump completely fucked up the Covid response, first by denying it, brushing it off as the flu, then by ridiculous/dangerous miracle cure suggestions and not being serious about lock downs letting the virus spread causing over a million deaths in the US.



Pyro as Bill said:
sundin13 said:

Well, the tariffs aren't retaliatory, so thats the first problem with that. They aren't based on tariffs imposed on US, they are based on the trade deficit between the USA and X Country. As such, unless Trump wavers on his formula, there isn't really anything that can be done about them in the short term. Now, Trump might waver, it wouldn't be the first time, but buying into the idea that these are all "retaliatory" is just accepting a lie at face value...

Ive already agreed the formula makes no sense. The point is that if you offer Trump free trade he's open to reciprocating therefore he cant be an ideological tariffer.

Lol he even slapped 17% on Israel after Smotrich dropped the last remaining tarrifs on the USA.

https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-848977

Tariff-ic timing: Trump imposing tariffs on Israeli goods is shameful betrayal - editorial

What makes this decision particularly galling is the timing. On Tuesday, Israel officially removed all tariffs on American products.



sc94597 said:
Pyro as Bill said:

Yeah the infinite immigrant ponzi scheme is the only alternative to Europe actually being productive and being able to defend itself properly. Let's see how that argument holds up against Russian propaganda.

How do you solve the aging demographic problem? The only two culturally viable solutions (the third, far-right, "solution" is to re-enslave women) we know of are automation and immigration. Subsidizing family making doesn't work. Many European countries have tried. 

Also having a system where young productive people subsidize the lives of older less productive people isn't a ponzi scheme. It is social insurance based on the natural reality that at least until we achieve LEV, people age and become less productive. 

No, the system worked when a 50-60 year old would work until his undiagnosed cancer or heart condition didnt have modern medical treatment at it's disposal and drop dead. Today we have 50 yr olds with a bad knee retiring and living comfortably til theyre 70 and then needing hundreds of thousands per yr in healthcare costs without selling the 6 bedroom house they live in alone while house prices go wild and people in their 20s are living 10 per house.

You're not moral if you ignore reality and think stealing from the productive is the answer to all issues.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Pyro as Bill said:

Europe loves to moralise about how they offer better social protections even though the poorest man in America gets healthcare treatment Europeans could only dream of. When Europe is forced to pay for the real costs of defence and health without the US subsidising, maybe theyll be a bit more appreciative.

Damn bro, when I see a fellow Brit (European) deepthroating America this much, I just think "have some self respect man" Lmao.

"The poorest man in America gets healthcare treatment Europeans could only dream of."

Hyperbolic bullshit.

"When Europe is forced to pay for the real costs of defence and health without the US subsidising"

And how is America subsidising Europe's military and health?

Pyro as Bill said:

Reminder - it was Trump who fastracked the vaccine that got us all out of lockdown months before China.

While at the same time completely downplaying it by sticking his head in the sand and pretending everything was fine, entertaining conspiracy theories, parroting bullshit medical advice, enabling his fanbase to refuse basic safety procedures which furthered the spread, his entire response to COVID is a widely regarded disaster and partly what caused him to lose re-election then Americans had fucking amnesia and voted him back in because inflation, Lol.

If it weren't for him, thousands more Americans could have survived the pandemic.



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Tariffs/protectionism has been the only thing Trump's been consistently in support of in the last 40 years. He was talking about them in interviews during the 80's. Hell, his consistency on this topic is probably why the rural/post-urban working class supports him so much. 

We can be honest here. Autarkic ideas are probably the only ideology Trump has ever really had other than whatever supports him. 

He has shifted and wobbled on almost every other topic, besides this.



Pyro as Bill said:
sc94597 said:

How do you solve the aging demographic problem? The only two culturally viable solutions (the third, far-right, "solution" is to re-enslave women) we know of are automation and immigration. Subsidizing family making doesn't work. Many European countries have tried. 

Also having a system where young productive people subsidize the lives of older less productive people isn't a ponzi scheme. It is social insurance based on the natural reality that at least until we achieve LEV, people age and become less productive. 

No, the system worked when a 50-60 year old would work until his undiagnosed cancer or heart condition didnt have modern medical treatment at it's disposal and drop dead. Today we have 50 yr olds with a bad knee retiring and living comfortably til theyre 70 and then needing hundreds of thousands per yr in healthcare costs without selling the 6 bedroom house they live in alone while house prices go wild and people in their 20s are living 10 per house.

You're not moral if you ignore reality and think stealing from the productive is the answer to all issues.

Are you arguing that it is solely due to an increasing life expectancy that the age-demographics have shifted and birth rates have nothing to do with this shift? I want to hear you saying this before we actually quantify the effects. 

How many "50 year olds with a bad knee are retiring?" What proportion of Gen Xers are currently retired? What do you think the average income and wealth of the 7% of 50 year olds who are retired is? Is the average age of retirement decreasing or increasing? Actually I'll answer that last one. 



Ryuu96 said:
Pyro as Bill said:

Europe loves to moralise about how they offer better social protections even though the poorest man in America gets healthcare treatment Europeans could only dream of. When Europe is forced to pay for the real costs of defence and health without the US subsidising, maybe theyll be a bit more appreciative.

Damn bro, when I see a fellow Brit (European) deepthroating America this much, I just think "have some self respect man" Lmao.

"The poorest man in America gets healthcare treatment Europeans could only dream of."

Hyperbolic bullshit.

"When Europe is forced to pay for the real costs of defence and health without the US subsidising"

And how is America subsidising Europe's military and health?

Pyro as Bill said:

Reminder - it was Trump who fastracked the vaccine that got us all out of lockdown months before China.

While at the same time completely downplaying it by sticking his head in the sand and pretending everything was fine, entertaining conspiracy theories, parroting bullshit medical advice, enabling his fanbase to refuse basic safety procedures which furthered the spread, his entire response to COVID is a widely regarded disaster and partly what caused him to lose re-election then Americans had fucking amnesia and voted him back in because inflation, Lol.

If it weren't for him, thousands more Americans could have survived the pandemic.

Healthcare is free in the US if you cant afford it. Yeah you'll have to sell everything you own and your kids wont have an inheritance but you'll be seen same day and be operated on within days. The RoW should be greatful at how much the US invests in healthcare cos we all benefit from the subsidy.

I'm not gonna dignify military subsidies with a response because its self evident.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Also this fear about China, on the one hand, China making a move on Taiwan right now would make sense from the perspective of, Trump is a complete moron and a coward, who has already alluded to America not defending Taiwan in the event that China invades them and is being weak as shit when it comes to Russia, I'm about 70% sure that if China invaded Taiwan, Trump wouldn't do a thing (militarily).

But on the other hand, since taking office, Trump has handed China multiple wins from an international standpoint, Trump has attacked basically every single American ally, Trump is slowly changing the global order and not in a good way for America, China isn't ran by morons like Russia, China loves capitalism because they're such an integral part to it, while Russia never really offered us much other than energy supplies and never left that "might is right" military mindset.

China will see that they have a chance to worm their way into the good graces of Europe, Africa, South America, North America, etc. They will attempt to fill the holes left by America. We can already see them playing that game very carefully and measured, whilst fighting back against America, the last time this happened, Trump had to bail out American farmers and it was widely regarded as an American loss.

In all honestly, the smart move for China would be to stay away from Taiwan, let America shoot themselves in the foot, let America piss off all their allies, and slowly overtime China will benefit. This isn't me saying I trust China though, China is obviously led by equally evil bastards but I don't believe China is led by militaristic morons like Russia and have always played the long game, are less interested in ruling by physical might and more with economic might and influence.

Even if some countries kiss the ring of America in the short term to avoid Trump's stupidity, the long term damage on America will be bad, countries will slowly form relationships away from America, slowly divest themselves away from America and America will suffer as a result, MAGA is too stupid to think further ahead than 4 years though.

America was the world leader basically since WW2 after Europe was battered, America filled a vacuum and have benefited from that since, all the billions that Europe spends buying American equipment, all the immense influence that comes with that, Europe was basically locked in line with America on every decision and yes that does benefit America, Trump has pissed all that up the wall.

These are facts that every Republican leader before Trump understood, MAGA has changed all this. America will be seen as an unreliable ally, an unstable ally, an economic liability, a military liability, slowly but surely, countries will start divesting themselves off America in more ways than one. We can't be dealing with this schizophrenic shit that America pulls every 4 years.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 06 April 2025

Ryuu96 said:

Also this fear about China, on the one hand, China making a move on Taiwan right now would make sense from the perspective of, Trump is a complete moron and a coward, who has already alluded to America not defending Taiwan in the event that China invades them and is being weak as shit when it comes to Russia, I'm about 70% sure that if China invaded Taiwan, Trump wouldn't do a thing (militarily).

But on the other hand, since taking office, Trump has handed China multiple wins from an international standpoint, Trump has attacked basically every single American ally, Trump is slowly changing the global order and not in a good way for America, China isn't ran by morons like Russia, China loves capitalism because they're such an integral part to it, while Russia never really offered us much other than energy supplies and never left that "might is right" military mindset.

China will see that they have a chance to worm their way into the good graces of Europe, Africa, South America, North America, etc. They will attempt to fill the holes left by America. We can already see them playing that game very carefully and measured, whilst fighting back against America, the last time this happened, Trump had to bail out American farmers and it was widely regarded as an American loss.

In all honestly, the smart move for China would be to stay away from Taiwan, let America shoot themselves in the foot, let America piss off all their allies, and slowly overtime China will benefit. This isn't me saying I trust China though, China is obviously led by equally evil bastards but I don't believe China is led by militaristic morons like Russia and have always played the long game, are less interested in ruling by physical might and more with economic might and influence.

Even if some countries kiss the ring of America in the short term to avoid Trump's stupidity, the long term damage on America will be bad, countries will slowly form relationships away from America, slowly divest themselves away from America and America will suffer as a result, MAGA is too stupid to think further ahead than 4 years though.

America was the world leader basically since WW2 after Europe was battered, America filled a vacuum and have benefited from that since, all the billions that Europe spends buying American equipment, all the immense influence that comes with that, Europe was basically locked in line with America on every decision and yes that does benefit America, Trump has pissed all that up the wall.

These are facts that every Republican leader before Trump understood, MAGA has changed all this.

Trump isnt willing to have a hot war against China over Taiwan so he's mitigating while also giving the world an insight into how it may play out.

Europe is only just waking up to the military reality even though both Republican and Democrat have been warning us for decades.The US doesn't need the Middle East's oil anymore, Europe does.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!