starcraft said: PooperScooper said: Um rapist and murderers dont have the right to face their accusers like in one of these settings. I'm assuming you mean "alleged" rapists and murderers.   If someone pleads guilty to one of these crimes then of course there is no reason for them to face their accusers.  However, everyone is entitled to a fair trial and to be presumed innocent.  It is an absolutely fundamental right of any accused to have charges properly tested before judgement is passed. Accountability is key.

yeah but when they get accused of rape the police arent going to go to them and be like "Barbra Streisand accused you of rape now go face your accuser"

This isnt in the confines of the court room.

Hell they so not have the right to face their accuser that the police go so far as to put people in witness protection if the accused knows who their accuser is,

HELL and if the accuser pointed the police in the right direction and the police gathered enough evidence to press charges the accuser doesnt have to testify if they dont want to. while the accused would have no clue where the tip came from (anonymous tips)

This just proves the church has no right to know who these people are and these people are well within their legal and moral rights wearing masks.

What the hell, people?

You are saying that random people that wear masks to protest against a organization that kills people that don't support them as standard procedure are cowards? I call this being smart.

Damn it, if there is something i call being coward is an entire freakin organization trying to kill/sue/ground a little journalist.

And do we need any more proof to say that scientology is allegedly bad?

No problem with their beliefs, of course. But these things they do are ridiculous...

Flow said: What the hell, people? You are saying that random people that wear masks to protest against a organization that kills people that don't support them as standard procedure are cowards? I call this being smart. Damn it, if there is something i call being coward is an entire freakin organization trying to kill/sue/ground a little journalist. And do we need any more proof to say that scientology is allegedly bad? No problem with their beliefs, of course. But these things they do are ridiculous...

There you see.  Organisations like Anonymous that have absolutely no respect for due process facilitate unjustified hate.  There is absolutely NO casual link between the incidents and the CoS.  Just because we don't like their beliefs doesn't give us the right to circumvent due process.

Lets just cut the crap right now.  Anonymous don't wear masks to protect their lives, and anonymous don't wear masks to protect themselves from harrassment.  Anonymous wear masks because they know full well that what they are doing counts as defamation, and they don't want to have to stand up in court and actually be forced to back up what they are saying.

starcraft said: ssj12 said: StarCraft - Look up Scientology's disconnection policy, Lisa McPherson, Heribert Pfaff, Josephus Havenith, Scientology's Boiler Room. http://www.whyaretheydead.net/ The only reason your defending this inhuman behavior by the Co$ is if you have personally commited crimes equivilent to or worse then them, or you are a Scientology member yourself and look at the crimes as just or you just dont have any human emotions. And StarCraft, I only wear a mask if the losers of Scientology try to take pictures. I could be wrong.  I mean I REALLY HOPE I'M WRONG.  But did ssj12 just tell me that if I don't agree with his opinion I am without doubt a murderer?

Apparently misinterpreted what your purpose on what you said in some of your posts, sorry, but even if some of us wear masks that does not mean we are cowards, we just would like to live our lives without the fear of being lynched. We are still willing to physically stand there and protest their crimes which is which takes more guts then most people who disagree with anything is willing to do.

And no I was no calling you a murderer. I was to state that you are not showing any real emotion towards what is being discussed. Since these are real world matters a bit more emotion behind your posts is needed to make a post sound a bit more established to ones beliefs. I used the "have done similar" part as a way to display that something along those lines could, be reasonable reason for why you arent displaying any sort of emotion to the C0$ crimes. I'm not saying murder, morealong the lines of beating the crap out of someone or something that falls under voilent terms.

 

starcraft said: Flow said: What the hell, people? You are saying that random people that wear masks to protest against a organization that kills people that don't support them as standard procedure are cowards? I call this being smart. Damn it, if there is something i call being coward is an entire freakin organization trying to kill/sue/ground a little journalist. And do we need any more proof to say that scientology is allegedly bad? No problem with their beliefs, of course. But these things they do are ridiculous... There you see.  Organisations like Anonymous that have absolutely no respect for due process facilitate unjustified hate.  There is absolutely NO casual link between the incidents and the CoS.  Just because we don't like their beliefs doesn't give us the right to circumvent due process. Lets just cut the crap right now.  Anonymous don't wear masks to protect their lives, and anonymous don't wear masks to protect themselves from harrassment.  Anonymous wear masks because they know full well that what they are doing counts as defamation, and they don't want to have to stand up in court and actually be forced to back up what they are saying.

man I always labeled you as a biased fanboy but now i can see that you are just an ignorant person that doesn't know an ass from a face.

Like many said before its church policy all the people need to do is bring that up and there is no deformation. They had a policy that even said take any means necessary against anyone who talks against the church at one point.

starcraft said: Flow said: What the hell, people? You are saying that random people that wear masks to protest against a organization that kills people that don't support them as standard procedure are cowards? I call this being smart. Damn it, if there is something i call being coward is an entire freakin organization trying to kill/sue/ground a little journalist. And do we need any more proof to say that scientology is allegedly bad? No problem with their beliefs, of course. But these things they do are ridiculous... There you see. Organisations like Anonymous that have absolutely no respect for due process facilitate unjustified hate. There is absolutely NO casual link between the incidents and the CoS. Just because we don't like their beliefs doesn't give us the right to circumvent due process. Lets just cut the crap right now. Anonymous don't wear masks to protect their lives, and anonymous don't wear masks to protect themselves from harrassment. Anonymous wear masks because they know full well that what they are doing counts as defamation, and they don't want to have to stand up in court and actually be forced to back up what they are saying.

 Unjustified hate? I don't like them because of these sh*t they do, and with all this proof it is justified. Anonymous is just bringing the truth to us.

ssj12 said: starcraft said: ssj12 said: StarCraft - Look up Scientology's disconnection policy, Lisa McPherson, Heribert Pfaff, Josephus Havenith, Scientology's Boiler Room. http://www.whyaretheydead.net/ The only reason your defending this inhuman behavior by the Co$ is if you have personally commited crimes equivilent to or worse then them, or you are a Scientology member yourself and look at the crimes as just or you just dont have any human emotions. And StarCraft, I only wear a mask if the losers of Scientology try to take pictures. I could be wrong. I mean I REALLY HOPE I'M WRONG. But did ssj12 just tell me that if I don't agree with his opinion I am without doubt a murderer? Apparently misinterpreted what your purpose on what you said in some of your posts, sorry, but even if some of us wear masks that does not mean we are cowards, we just would like to live our lives without the fear of being lynched. We are still willing to physically stand there and protest their crimes which is which takes more guts then most people who disagree with anything is willing to do. And no I was no calling you a murderer. I was to state that you are not showing any real emotion towards what is being discussed. Since these are real world matters a bit more emotion behind your posts is needed to make a post sound a bit more established to ones beliefs. I used the "have done similar" part as a way to display that something along those lines could, be reasonable reason for why you arent displaying any sort of emotion to the C0$ crimes. I'm not saying murder, morealong the lines of beating the crap out of someone or something that falls under voilent terms.

Oh I feel better now.  Your not accusing me of murder, just aggravated assault.  I didn't use the word coward.  What I am saying is that the motives for anonymous' use of masks are clearly very different to the ones that are stated.  The link you gave lists four or five people who were supposedely killed by the CoS over the course of three decades.  Given that some anonymous rallies attract hundreds of people, what do you think the CoS could do? 

As it stands, if the CoS found out who one of you was, and murdered you, they would probably get away with it, as noone would know why you were killed.  If you showed your face at the rallies, how are they supposed to kill you without every media outlet in the Western world picking up the story?

I'll say again.  Anonymous' reasons for wearing masks may have started out due to concerns for physical safety when it was a tiny number of people, but now there is no remotely credible physical risk to member's safety (even if everything you say about CoS is true) it is abundently clear that it's all about protecting yourselves from litigation. 

 

Also, do you really believe this people wear masks just because they "know full well that what they are doing counts as defamation"? They wear them to be sure they will not have the same fate as these people that opposed scientology.

Also, it's not defamation, it's fact, scientology is evil.

I think starcraft worships xulu.

Flow said: starcraft said: Flow said: What the hell, people? You are saying that random people that wear masks to protest against a organization that kills people that don't support them as standard procedure are cowards? I call this being smart. Damn it, if there is something i call being coward is an entire freakin organization trying to kill/sue/ground a little journalist. And do we need any more proof to say that scientology is allegedly bad? No problem with their beliefs, of course. But these things they do are ridiculous... There you see. Organisations like Anonymous that have absolutely no respect for due process facilitate unjustified hate. There is absolutely NO casual link between the incidents and the CoS. Just because we don't like their beliefs doesn't give us the right to circumvent due process. Lets just cut the crap right now. Anonymous don't wear masks to protect their lives, and anonymous don't wear masks to protect themselves from harrassment. Anonymous wear masks because they know full well that what they are doing counts as defamation, and they don't want to have to stand up in court and actually be forced to back up what they are saying. Unjustified hate? I don't like them because of these sh*t they do, and with all this proof it is justified. Anonymous is just bringing the truth to us.

Again, what proof?  All that exists is vastly circumstantial evidence that is trumpeted around by a bunch of litigation-fearing dress-wearing men in masks.  All the while blatantly ignoring due process.  I'll say AGAIN.  Even if every single thing you are saying about the CoS is true, it doesn't alter the fact that groups like Anonymous are a defamatory slap in the face to the justice system that relies on the "innocent until proven guilty" premise.