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Forums - General Discussion - Do you believe in God? Why/Why not?

 

Do you believe in any god?

Yes 63 36.21%
 
No 111 63.79%
 
Total:174
HollyGamer said:
JWeinCom said:

Of course, I can't answer that. And neither can you.  You can claim to have an answer, but a claim requires justification, which I'm sure you won't be able to provide.

Then by  " LOGIC " you refuse to accept that something cannot exist without a "Cause ". Because everything in "reality " that is exist are because of something happen. If your self by your own believe dont believe with and entity that is Creator or the one who ignite or created or made it , then your self refuse. 

It not a matter of who can answer or who cannot answer is just a "Logic " of something that is exist need to be by a cause. 

I think you need to look into a few things because you're making some bold proclamations that the more sophisticated apologists go against. For instance, atemporal causality is something Dr. William Lane Craig (Ph.D philosopher, Christian apologist) puts forth as a path for God to create the Universe. Now I don't agree with him, I think the concept of atemporal causality is nonsense. However...if you're a Christian, or some other believer in a God-manifested Universe, then you essentially need to embrace his position.

So I mentioned that you need to research a couple things - firstly, the A & B series of time. Understand the fundamental distinctions of these perspectives. Secondly, without reading your other comments, you seem to be oblivious to big bang cosmology which is certainly not anything to do with a "something from nothing" scenario. Creatio ex nihilo is nonsense to put it mildly.



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SpokenTruth said:
Snoopy said:

Yes, but how many of those planets have resources that can sustain life? Not many and not to mention there has to be life itself as well. I never said there isn't alien life, but it didn't just appear by chance which is the point you are missing. Also, each solar system is like one lotto ticket for a separate game since each one is completely different and has it own rules so to speak in some regards. 

The bottom line:  You can't actually believe the universe without a consciousness can create everything we have today by chance. Most of the things we enjoy today (technology, buildings/infastructue,most of our food/resource, etc) were made by someone with consciousness. Earth itself is much more complex and advanced than all of the items I mentioned. There is no way it could be created by chance.

I already gave you the numbers.  Trillions exist with the characteristics needed to create and sustain life.  Trillions.  I don't think you understand the scope of the universe.  Nor are you understanding how long 13.8 billion years is.  That means that trillions of planets have already come and gone.  Not just the trillions that currently exist.

How do you know a lot of those planets have resources to maintain life? According to sources (I'll link one at the bottom) so far we MIGHT have found 40 billion planets that can maintain life. The keyword is MIGHT. The number will significantly go down if we can observe the planets better. Just like how not too long ago scientists declare Pluto, not a planet once we were able to observe it better. Now, let's factor in all the other scenarios that have to come to play for humans to make it this far and we can see it's quite silly to think that we were created by luck.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_potentially_habitable_exoplanets#Potential_habitable_zone_status



Snoopy said:

Now, let's factor in all the other scenarios that have to come to play for humans to make it this far and we can see it's quite silly to think that we were created by luck.

Science is not claiming anything is created by luck. - There are natural processes that are well understood that got us to this point, from the explosive formation of the universe and it's constant inflation to the formation of the solar system, to the birth of life on this planet, to the constant evolution of life via natural selection.

If you have evidence to the contrary, then by all means... Provide them, you will be the first person in history and will win a nobel prize and thus be world-renowned.




--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
Snoopy said:

Now, let's factor in all the other scenarios that have to come to play for humans to make it this far and we can see it's quite silly to think that we were created by luck.

Science is not claiming anything is created by luck. - There are natural processes that are well understood that got us to this point, from the explosive formation of the universe and it's constant inflation to the formation of the solar system, to the birth of life on this planet, to the constant evolution of life via natural selection.

If you have evidence to the contrary, then by all means... Provide them, you will be the first person in history and will win a nobel prize and thus be world-renowned.


In order for all those events to occur luck has to happen...so what's your point? Too many things could go wrong to stop all those events from occurring and you know it.



Snoopy said:
Pemalite said:

Science is not claiming anything is created by luck. - There are natural processes that are well understood that got us to this point, from the explosive formation of the universe and it's constant inflation to the formation of the solar system, to the birth of life on this planet, to the constant evolution of life via natural selection.

If you have evidence to the contrary, then by all means... Provide them, you will be the first person in history and will win a nobel prize and thus be world-renowned.


In order for all those events to occur luck has to happen...so what's your point? Too many things could go wrong to stop all those events from occurring and you know it.

No, it doesn't. It just doesn't. Stop saying that it does; making false assertions repeatedly doesn't suddenly make them right. 

This is why debating with theists is pretty much a waste of time. So resilient to reason. 



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Snoopy said:

Yet, in order for all those things to occur luck has to happen... Too many things could go wrong to stop all those processes and you know it.

False. Luck has nothing to do with it.
Biologically we evolved to suit our environment... Think about it.

The majority of the Earths surface is uninhabitable...
71% of it is oceans.
Leaving 29% of land area that we can occupy... But of that 29% land area... Only 71% is deemed habitable.
It would be even less without inventions such as Air Conditioning/Heating/Fire/Clothing/Vehicles/Modern Agriculture.

If the Earth formed slightly differently, then we would have evolved slightly differently to suit our environment.

Again, if you think we were created... All you need to do is provide this little thing called "evidence". - Because we have evidence the Big Bang Occurred, that Organic materials came from inorganic materials via Abiogenesis, that life Adapted and changed via Evolution/Natural Selection... And even have functional models of how the Solar System formed.

Just ignoring all of that and saying "God did it" is a disservice to human achievement via the scientific method, science has allowed us to travel to the moon and explore the solar system, what has religion done?



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Snoopy said:
Pemalite said:

Science is not claiming anything is created by luck. - There are natural processes that are well understood that got us to this point, from the explosive formation of the universe and it's constant inflation to the formation of the solar system, to the birth of life on this planet, to the constant evolution of life via natural selection.

If you have evidence to the contrary, then by all means... Provide them, you will be the first person in history and will win a nobel prize and thus be world-renowned.


In order for all those events to occur luck has to happen...so what's your point? Too many things could go wrong to stop all those events from occurring and you know it.

Luck is a matter of perspective.

Think about it this way.  I was born as a result of my father ejaculating.  A human male ejaculates, on average, around 50 million sperm cells.  The odds were overwhelmingly against me being born.  So was that lucky?  For me yes, for the 49,999,999 other sperm cells, this was an incredibly unlucky event.

You only call it luck because you like the result.  But it's unlucky for all of the species who die as a result of human expansion, for all of the other variations of humans who might have existed in our place, or the countless numbers of beings that may have existed in other potential universes.  



Pemalite said:
Snoopy said:

Yet, in order for all those things to occur luck has to happen... Too many things could go wrong to stop all those processes and you know it.

False. Luck has nothing to do with it.
Biologically we evolved to suit our environment... Think about it.

The majority of the Earths surface is uninhabitable...
71% of it is oceans.
Leaving 29% of land area that we can occupy... But of that 29% land area... Only 71% is deemed habitable.
It would be even less without inventions such as Air Conditioning/Heating/Fire/Clothing/Vehicles/Modern Agriculture.

If the Earth formed slightly differently, then we would have evolved slightly differently to suit our environment.

Again, if you think we were created... All you need to do is provide this little thing called "evidence". - Because we have evidence the Big Bang Occurred, that Organic materials came from inorganic materials via Abiogenesis, that life Adapted and changed via Evolution/Natural Selection... And even have functional models of how the Solar System formed.

Just ignoring all of that and saying "God did it" is a disservice to human achievement via the scientific method, science has allowed us to travel to the moon and explore the solar system, what has religion done?

First of all, I never said I was part of a religion because I'm agnostic. Second of all, I am a believer of natural selection, but a circumstance where species can still be here and thrive over the years is extremely lucky. Yes, I will continue to use the word luck because the littlest shit that goes wrong can cause us to not exist. Ever heard of the butterfly effect. And no, if the earth was pulled close to the sun or if there wasn't any fresh water, we would be fucked.  One small change can drastically change the future. Finally, saying there is a creator doesn't mean we ignore science. The United States arguably contributed to science more than any country and we are mostly a Christian nation. Don't let a few clowns make you feel otherwise.

Here is an interesting video I suggest you watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FvYwpyFbIQ. This will discuss the Aristotelian proof of God among other evidence. 



JWeinCom said:
Snoopy said:

In order for all those events to occur luck has to happen...so what's your point? Too many things could go wrong to stop all those events from occurring and you know it.

Luck is a matter of perspective.

Think about it this way.  I was born as a result of my father ejaculating.  A human male ejaculates, on average, around 50 million sperm cells.  The odds were overwhelmingly against me being born.  So was that lucky?  For me yes, for the 49,999,999 other sperm cells, this was an incredibly unlucky event.

You only call it luck because you like the result.  But it's unlucky for all of the species who die as a result of human expansion, for all of the other variations of humans who might have existed in our place, or the countless numbers of beings that may have existed in other potential universes.  

Your father has a consciousness just like God and purposely stuck his ding dong in your mom's woohoo to create a baby (whether or not he wanted to have the baby he knew the risk). So that isn't luck because someone deliberately did something. So you were created by someone because sperm has the potential to be something when acted upon. Look up Aristotelian proof of God. Nothing potential can actualize itself.



Snoopy said:
JWeinCom said:

Luck is a matter of perspective.

Think about it this way.  I was born as a result of my father ejaculating.  A human male ejaculates, on average, around 50 million sperm cells.  The odds were overwhelmingly against me being born.  So was that lucky?  For me yes, for the 49,999,999 other sperm cells, this was an incredibly unlucky event.

You only call it luck because you like the result.  But it's unlucky for all of the species who die as a result of human expansion, for all of the other variations of humans who might have existed in our place, or the countless numbers of beings that may have existed in other potential universes.  

Your father has a consciousness just like God and purposely stuck his ding dong in your mom's woohoo to create a baby (whether or not he wanted to have the baby he knew the risk). So that isn't luck because someone deliberately did something. So you were created by someone because sperm has the potential to be something when acted upon. Look up Aristotelian proof of God. Nothing potential can actualize itself.

That's just the cosmological argument. 

https://uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/an-aristotelian-proof-of-the-existence-of-god/

We've been through that already. I will take a more deeper dive into it if I got the time. 



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