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Forums - Gaming - Your false assumptions will get you nowhere

160rmf said:

Full of wrong assumptions that Nintendo failed with wii u 

When you accuse people of making wrong assumptions by starting off with making a wrong assumption. (Please tell me I'm understanding your sentence incorrectly and you do actually know the Wii U was a failure.)



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zorg1000 said:
Neodegenerate said:

You have yet to disprove the original statement, so calling it wrong is rather rash.  Yes Switch has two big games (Zelda and Splatoon 2), one unknown (Arms), an updated port (Mario Kart 8) and a bunch of games that may not make it out of Japan, and indies that I have already mentioned don't move systems within the first six months.  Keep in mind that people thought that PS4 had "no gamez" or whatever the meme was in its first year and it looked much better than the Switch has shown thusfar for the same timeframe.

When you have two systems (3DS and Wii U) that have issues with software at launch (3DS) and throughout the life cycle (Wii U) you begin to alienate your fanbase.  Thus, your home console doesn't even get to 15 million sold.  Switch will do fine in Japan.  It is everywhere else that becomes an issue.

You have the home console people who are looking at it like a handheld and thus aren't interested.

You have the handheld console people who are looking at the battery life and price and thus aren't interested.

You have the people who play mainly for third party that already have the console they are going to use for that and thus aren't interested.

Then you have the Nintendo fans, and those who like the idea of having it on the go and at home, that they are targeting.  Is that number enough?  Based on what they have done in the past, and the necessary changes to their most recent handheld to get it off the ground, I don't think so.  Can it surprise us the way the Wii U did?  Sure.  Is it LIKELY to?  No.

They are relying on motion controls again.  The motion control crowd hasn't cared for over 5 years now, they have moved on.  7 games at launch for anyone not in Japan is a weak library that is relying solely on one game in Zelda.  Everything else on launch date is very much a gamble.

My statement that they might not do so well outside Japan is not wrong, it is an opinion based on the facts we look at since Nintendo lost a ton of third party support generations ago, and the message they attempted to convey at their Switch presentation.  Do you really think there are people foaming at the mouth to "milk cows" with 1-2 Switch at parties?  Or that they are super excited to double dip on a game like I am Setsuna?  I don't.

Yes I did disprove your original statement, if you forgot what it was than that's on you. Everything you have said since then is irrelevant to the original point.

Oh you mean the part where you are crying out "handheld handheld!" when Nintendo is marketing it as a home console on the go?  You're right, you completely dismantled my point.  Whatever could I have been thinking!

And in case you didn't notice, that was sarcasm.  You haven't provided anything of substance to prove your point at all.  Japan is the go-to for handhelds.  That is fact not opinion.  Japan is a video game market in decline.  That is fact not opinion.  For Nintendo to be so Japan heavy (12 launch titles vs 7 for not Japan, again fact not opinion) is a mistake (the mistake word is an informed opinion).  You want to refute any of that with anything better than "3DS outsells Wii U", im listening.



Neodegenerate said:
zorg1000 said:

Yes I did disprove your original statement, if you forgot what it was than that's on you. Everything you have said since then is irrelevant to the original point.

Oh you mean the part where you are crying out "handheld handheld!" when Nintendo is marketing it as a home console on the go?  You're right, you completely dismantled my point.  Whatever could I have been thinking!

And in case you didn't notice, that was sarcasm.  You haven't provided anything of substance to prove your point at all.  Japan is the go-to for handhelds.  That is fact not opinion.  Japan is a video game market in decline.  That is fact not opinion.  For Nintendo to be so Japan heavy (12 launch titles vs 7 for not Japan, again fact not opinion) is a mistake (the mistake word is an informed opinion).  You want to refute any of that with anything better than "3DS outsells Wii U", im listening.

Your original statement was that handhelds arent a selling point outside of Japan and that we can use that to predict it will sell like Wii U. And yes 3DS selling 4x as much as Wii U outside of Japan directly disproves your point. Switch could sell like Wii U but it won't be because handhelds hold no value outside of Japan.

Also 7 launch titles is outdated info.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

NintendoPie said:
160rmf said:

Full of wrong assumptions that Nintendo failed with wii u 

When you accuse people of making wrong assumptions by starting off with making a wrong assumption. (Please tell me I'm understanding your sentence incorrectly and you do actually know the Wii U was a failure.)

yes you are understanding incorrectly considering you only quoted half the sentance.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:

yes you are understanding incorrectly considering you only quoted half the sentance.

The full sentence still doesn't convince me. Saying "... and will fail with Switch because "shitty graphics"" doesn't necessarily imply him meaning the Wii U failed because of "shitty graphics." However, you also aren't OP so hopefully he'll tell me I'm wrong as well.



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NintendoPie said:
zorg1000 said:

yes you are understanding incorrectly considering you only quoted half the sentance.

The full sentence still doesn't convince me. Saying "... and will fail with Switch because "shitty graphics"" doesn't necessarily imply him meaning the Wii U failed because of "shitty graphics." However, you also aren't OP so hopefully he'll tell me I'm wrong as well.

im 100% certain that's exactly what he meant



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 said:

im 100% certain that's exactly what he meant

Great to hear. Thank you for that.



zorg1000 said:
Neodegenerate said:

Oh you mean the part where you are crying out "handheld handheld!" when Nintendo is marketing it as a home console on the go?  You're right, you completely dismantled my point.  Whatever could I have been thinking!

And in case you didn't notice, that was sarcasm.  You haven't provided anything of substance to prove your point at all.  Japan is the go-to for handhelds.  That is fact not opinion.  Japan is a video game market in decline.  That is fact not opinion.  For Nintendo to be so Japan heavy (12 launch titles vs 7 for not Japan, again fact not opinion) is a mistake (the mistake word is an informed opinion).  You want to refute any of that with anything better than "3DS outsells Wii U", im listening.

Your original statement was that handhelds arent a selling point outside of Japan and that we can use that to predict it will sell like Wii U. And yes 3DS selling 4x as much as Wii U outside of Japan directly disproves your point. Switch could sell like Wii U but it won't be because handhelds hold no value outside of Japan.

Also 7 launch titles is outdated info.

I said they arent a major selling point which is completely different than saying they arent a selling point.  Dont twist it to fit your narrative.  Though, i dont think a 2 or 3 hour battery life is going to lend much to the handheld side argument.

 

3ds outselling wii u doesnt disprove my point at all. You are still screaming handheld handheld and ignoring the console first marketing from Nintendo themselves.  Furthermore, if you want to keep screaming handheld handheld i refer back to the huge price cut the 3ds needed early in its life to get to the point it is now and remind you that the switch is more expensive.

 

Edit: also on your launch number, ok 9 now?  And yet still only one major franchise  



Neodegenerate said:
zorg1000 said:

Your original statement was that handhelds arent a selling point outside of Japan and that we can use that to predict it will sell like Wii U. And yes 3DS selling 4x as much as Wii U outside of Japan directly disproves your point. Switch could sell like Wii U but it won't be because handhelds hold no value outside of Japan.

Also 7 launch titles is outdated info.

I said they arent a major selling point which is completely different than saying they arent a selling point.  Dont twist it to fit your narrative.  Though, i dont think a 2 or 3 hour battery life is going to lend much to the handheld side argument.

 

3ds outselling wii u doesnt disprove my point at all. You are still screaming handheld handheld and ignoring the console first marketing from Nintendo themselves.  Furthermore, if you want to keep screaming handheld handheld i refer back to the huge price cut the 3ds needed early in its life to get to the point it is now and remind you that the switch is more expensive.

 

Edit: also on your launch number, ok 9 now?  And yet still only one major franchise  

it seems like we've simply been misunderstanding each other, so on my part Im sorry about that.

All i was trying to say is that we cant assume Switch will sell Wii U numbers in America/Europe since 3DS shows there is still a sizeable market for Nintendo products in those regions, obviously it comes down to execution but it proves the potential is there.

I think the main reason that Switch is currently being labeled as a home console by Nintendo is because of some of the things you said like price, size, battery life and because 3DS is still selling decently and still has decent software support.

I think this will all change by Fall 2018, by then 3DS sales and support will have dried up and a Switch revision will be available that is cheaper, smaller, has longer battery life and will be considered the 3DS successor.

As for launch lineup, I will agree that it is pretty underwhelming outside of Zelda but i believe it is far better to have a modest launch lineup with a consistent post-launch release shedule (Switch) instead of a big launch lineup followed by a large drought (3DS/Wii U).



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

CGI-Quality said:
Pavolink said:

It's not my thread, and I don't know who are that people assuming Wii U failed because shitty graphics, but the definitive rebuttal is there in my post. As I mentioned, there are other factors, but I want to believe that OP is tired to see the old "shitty graphics" is the only reason to fail.

 

Lack of power is something more sophisticated to say, and it holds true. But it was only one of the hundreds problems that Nintendo had last gen (and some looks like to be still on the Switch).

What ever the TC is tired of isn't the issue. His lack of a rebuttal is.

Can't we make a rule against hit and run threads? If we take away thread making rights  from certain repeat offenders this could be a much nicer place. There are many people in this forum who don't understand the difference between a thread and a post. Only by cracking down on those people we can prevent this forum sinking into a 4chan mess.



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