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Forums - Politics - Unfriending due to Political Differences

 

Would you unfriend someone due to political differences?

Yes 53 21.54%
 
No 152 61.79%
 
Unsure 41 16.67%
 
Total:246
StarDoor said:
Ka-pi96 said:

You realise that Persians, Greeks, Egyptians and Jews are all technically whites (or more specifically caucasians because the Japanese/Chinese also have white skin so white isn`t really an accurate description of race...), right?

Besides, not a single one of those (including Japanese hating Chinese, which for the record I`m not sure was ever even a thing) is racism. They`re all hating each other based on cultural identity/nationalism rather than due to race.

Oh but other than the examples, I do mostly agree with you.

That's just an issue of semantics. Most people, when referring to the "white race," mean people of European descent. It's why I chose to say "white" in the first place, since "Caucasian," as you said, can refer to Middle Easterners and North Africans as well.

And again, semantics. Nations are just large groups of people with a common genetic heritage. It's still racism, even if the groups I mentioned are more similar to each other than, say, Africans and East Asians. (Also, the Japanese were very ethnocentric before they were defeated in WWII. They were brutal toward China: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_Massacre)

WolfpackN64 said:

Conquering and subjegation aren't anything new, but subjegation on the scale of modern day imperialism was only possible under capitalism, the rise of liberalism has replaced direct imperialism with economic imperialism in which elites dominate other classes and peoples based on their economic strength.

Large-scale imperialism may have only been possible under capitalism, but that's only by virtue of capitalism spurring technological advancement and creating such a large amount of material wealth. And it's not like Western powers were uniquely horrible to their colonies, especially considering how Western medicine and agriculture allowed the third world to explode in population under their watch.

The western powers were all, at some point in time at multiple levels terrible to their colonies. They also took the right of these people to self-determination. Most western powers continue to economically dominate the third world countries and the relegation of the third world countries to the economic periphery of the worldsystem has kept these countries from developing, it has not aided them to do so.



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WolfpackN64 said:

The western powers were all, at some point in time at multiple levels terrible to their colonies. They also took the right of these people to self-determination. Most western powers continue to economically dominate the third world countries and the relegation of the third world countries to the economic periphery of the worldsystem has kept these countries from developing, it has not aided them to do so.

Just wondering, since you believe in self-determination, would it be okay if white people set up explicitly white countries? And since Western powers are still economically dominating the Third World, should we just end international trade with the Third World to end the domination?



StarDoor said:
WolfpackN64 said:

The western powers were all, at some point in time at multiple levels terrible to their colonies. They also took the right of these people to self-determination. Most western powers continue to economically dominate the third world countries and the relegation of the third world countries to the economic periphery of the worldsystem has kept these countries from developing, it has not aided them to do so.

Just wondering, since you believe in self-determination, would it be okay if white people set up explicitly white countries? And since Western powers are still economically dominating the Third World, should we just end international trade with the Third World to end the domination?

A nation does not need to be made up of only one color, nor do a certain people have to have one color, that's a very odd concept of self-determination you have. These people could not in any way, shape or form represent themselves or chose representatives as it was denied them.

Of course we do not need to end international trade, but many free trade practices ensure our economic domination over these countries. Can a small scale african farmer compete with industrial rice growers in California? No, the american import rice is much cheaper. Result? These farmers can hardly sell their surplus to the market. No surplus = no investment = no growth.

That and water based agriculture in many parts of California is just stupid, but it makes money, so hey.



StarDoor said:
WolfpackN64 said:

The western powers were all, at some point in time at multiple levels terrible to their colonies. They also took the right of these people to self-determination. Most western powers continue to economically dominate the third world countries and the relegation of the third world countries to the economic periphery of the worldsystem has kept these countries from developing, it has not aided them to do so.

1.  Just wondering, since you believe in self-determination, would it be okay if white people set up explicitly white countries?

2.  And since Western powers are still economically dominating the Third World, should we just end international trade with the Third World to end the domination?

 

1. No, it would not be okay, for doing so would violate the basic human rights of the existing inhabitants or those seeking to immigrate (also a basic human right).  Human rights violations are violations against basic self-determination.

2.  No, ending trade would not be ideal.  Implimenting fair trade in its stead would be ideal and factories (belonging to a First World corporation), etc, should be held to the highest safety and environmental standards among the nations of the UN.  If anything should be ended, it is meddling with the sovereignty of these countries.  Political intervention should be limited to humanitarian efforts unless their government requests assistance in other areas---in these cases, neutral third parties should act as mediators/observers to ensure abuses don't occur on either side.



SuaveSocialist said:

1. No, it would not be okay, for doing so would violate the basic human rights of the existing inhabitants or those seeking to immigrate (also a basic human right).  Human rights violations are violations against basic self-determination.

2.  No, ending trade would not be ideal.  Implimenting fair trade in its stead would be ideal and factories (belonging to a First World corporation), etc, should be held to the highest safety and environmental standards among the nations of the UN.  If anything should be ended, it is meddling with the sovereignty of these countries.  Political intervention should be limited to humanitarian efforts unless their government requests assistance in other areas---in these cases, neutral third parties should act as mediators/observers to ensure abuses don't occur on either side.

When did immigration become a human right? Logically, that means everyone on the planet should be allowed to immigrate to the best country... which would then quickly cease to be the best country, or even a good country. You have a pretty bizzare definition of self-determination if people aren't even allowed to determine the kind of people that their country consists of. In fact, by your definition, Western, white countries are the only countries in the entire world that don't violate the human right of immigration.



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StarDoor said:
SuaveSocialist said:

1. No, it would not be okay, for doing so would violate the basic human rights of the existing inhabitants or those seeking to immigrate (also a basic human right).  Human rights violations are violations against basic self-determination.

2.  No, ending trade would not be ideal.  Implimenting fair trade in its stead would be ideal and factories (belonging to a First World corporation), etc, should be held to the highest safety and environmental standards among the nations of the UN.  If anything should be ended, it is meddling with the sovereignty of these countries.  Political intervention should be limited to humanitarian efforts unless their government requests assistance in other areas---in these cases, neutral third parties should act as mediators/observers to ensure abuses don't occur on either side.

1. When did immigration become a human right?
2. Logically, that means everyone on the planet should be allowed to immigrate to the best country... which would then quickly cease to be the best country, or even a good country.
3. You have a pretty bizzare definition of self-determination if people aren't even allowed to determine the kind of people that their country consists of.
4. In fact, by your definition, Western, white countries are the only countries in the entire world that don't violate the human right of immigration.

1. Over 60 years ago.
2. Logic has little to do with your statement, unless it is of the ill variety.
3. It's a pretty straightforward definition. 
4. That's unsurprising, considering that most countries violate various human rights fairly regularly.



SuaveSocialist said:
StarDoor said:

1. When did immigration become a human right?
2. Logically, that means everyone on the planet should be allowed to immigrate to the best country... which would then quickly cease to be the best country, or even a good country.
3. You have a pretty bizzare definition of self-determination if people aren't even allowed to determine the kind of people that their country consists of.
4. In fact, by your definition, Western, white countries are the only countries in the entire world that don't violate the human right of immigration.

1. Over 60 years ago.
2. Logic has little to do with your statement, unless it is of the ill variety.
3. It's a pretty straightforward definition. 
4. That's unsurprising, considering that most countries violate various human rights fairly regularly.

1.) You'll have to provide a source for that.

2.) I guess you've never heard of the "logical conclusion"? Your premise is that immigration is a human right, which means states should not be able to restrict it. If everyone wants to live in the best country possible, and there is no restriction on migration, then everyone will simply move to the perceived "best country." This isn't complicated.

3.) The UN's definition is that "nations, based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity, have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status with no interference."

In case you need to know what sovereignty is: "The authority of a state to govern itself."

Border security and immigration law are components of sovereignty. Through self-determination, nations can freely choose their sovereignty. Therefore, immigration can be restricted under self-determination.



StarDoor said:
SuaveSocialist said:

1. Over 60 years ago.
2. Logic has little to do with your statement, unless it is of the ill variety.
3. It's a pretty straightforward definition. 
4. That's unsurprising, considering that most countries violate various human rights fairly regularly.

1.) You'll have to provide a source for that.

2.) I guess you've never heard of the "logical conclusion"? Your premise is that immigration is a human right, which means states should not be able to restrict it. If everyone wants to live in the best country possible, and there is no restriction on migration, then everyone will simply move to the perceived "best country." This isn't complicated.

3.) The UN's definition is that "nations, based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity, have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status with no interference."

In case you need to know what sovereignty is: "The authority of a state to govern itself."

Border security and immigration law are components of sovereignty. Through self-determination, nations can freely choose their sovereignty. Therefore, immigration can be restricted under self-determination.

1) The UN.
2) Like I said, "logic" has little to do with your statement.
3) Thanks for providing that definition.  Looks like you glossed over "based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity".  Your 'whites-only country' is clearly incompatible to the definition you provided.  So, you can refer to 2) and then to 1). 

Case closed.



SuaveSocialist said:
StarDoor said:

1.) You'll have to provide a source for that.

2.) I guess you've never heard of the "logical conclusion"? Your premise is that immigration is a human right, which means states should not be able to restrict it. If everyone wants to live in the best country possible, and there is no restriction on migration, then everyone will simply move to the perceived "best country." This isn't complicated.

3.) The UN's definition is that "nations, based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity, have the right to freely choose their sovereignty and international political status with no interference."

In case you need to know what sovereignty is: "The authority of a state to govern itself."

Border security and immigration law are components of sovereignty. Through self-determination, nations can freely choose their sovereignty. Therefore, immigration can be restricted under self-determination.

1) The UN.
2) Like I said, "logic" has little to do with your statement.
3) Thanks for providing that definition.  Looks like you glossed over "based on respect for the principle of equal rights and fair equality of opportunity".  Your 'whites-only country' is clearly anathemic to the definition you provided.  So, you can refer to 2) and then to 1). 

Case closed.

1.) Do you have a link or not?

2.) Do you have an argument or not?

3.) OK, imagine 50 million white people moving into Uganda, a country of 37 million. They would be the new majority of the country and have a stranglehold on politics, and the former Ugandan population would no longer have its sovereignty. But that would be fine with you, right? Because immigration is a human right.

"Equal rights and fair equality of opportunity" is not the same thing as "right to invade a country that belongs to a different people."



StarDoor said:
Final-Fan said:

That's a good point about inherited IQ, despite that I hear the tests are often pretty culturally biased. 

As for the other part:  and what schools did all those kids go to? 

Reports of cultural bias are greatly exaggerated. If standardized tests are biased, how can East Asians perform better than Europeans on them?

Schools are as good as the students who attend them. If you want a full picture, I recommend Bad Students, Not Bad Schools: https://www.amazon.com/Bad-Students-Not-Schools/dp/141281345X

Moreover, better schools tend to be in wealthier areas, so that still doesn't explain why rich black kids do so poorly.

The relationship between good schools and good paychecks isn't absolute.  This article shows that white schools tend to get more money than black schools at equivalent economic levels, at least in Pennsylvania.  Of course, funding isn't everything.  But on the other hand, the author of the book you mentioned was fired from the National Review for racism. 



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