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Forums - Politics - Bernie Sanders confuses me

the-pi-guy said:

5th amendment:  "nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

Fixed ...



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fatslob-:O said:

MoscowPuzzles said:

5th amendment is commonly known as the right to remain silent. Are you thinking of the 4th amendment against unlawful search and seizure? In the case of tax evasion it would be a lawful seizure in lieu of debt owed to the US government.

 

Both are important but the 5th amendment also includes the "nor shall private property be taken for public use" clause ...

Weren't you addressing taxes though? I mean, I agree it's frightening that the government can simply buy your house and tell you to get lost so they can build a school/highway/airport but that's not relevant to taxation.



fatslob-:O said:

Siphoning profits to a tax haven is also not illegal. Them not paying taxes is screwing over the government. It's a decision of either screwing over the business or screwing over public services and choosing the former isn't a good idea when they pay for our salaries ... 

These companies I'm defending are passing what they owe to us, our salaries. They do not have to stop avoiding taxation. You make up lost money by cutting costs, it's not that hard but Greece just couldn't do that before getting another bailout ...

It's not legal either as it's a means to not pay taxes which is illegal, it's a loophole and one that many Countries are closing, that salary the company is paying you means little when it's going to be used to pay up for what they owe which increases by the month. As an example you're making them $20 and from that you get $2, they keep $15 and pay $3 tax when they're meant to pay $5, over time what they owe will outweigh what you and anyone else is paid and when the country has to make up the cost that salary you're getting will amount to little just look at Greece.

They have to stop companies avoiding Tax for your sake, do you know what cuts mean to make up costs? It impacts your daily life and often cuts never make up what's owed because cuts may stop an expense going out but when money is being leaked out the system it doesn't remedy the problem which means you yourself will have to pay higher taxes and charges in the end while even after the cuts have been made regardless.



MoscowPuzzles said:

Weren't you addressing taxes though? I mean, I agree it's frightening that the government can simply buy your house and tell you to get lost so they can build a school/highway/airport but that's not relevant to taxation.

Yes we were but in relation to that I responded that the government is not justified in taking away property because of tax avoidance and that's where the fifth amendment comes in ... 

Just because businesses found a loophole doesn't mean it's the government's right to seize their assets ...



Just thought i would share this: http://money.cnn.com/2016/02/08/news/economy/sanders-income-jobs/index.html

Looks like Sander's plans aren't that crazy at all.



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Teeqoz said:
Read up:
https://berniesanders.com/issues/how-bernie-pays-for-his-proposals/

So why is Bernie Sanders raising taxes on the middle class?  



Geralt said:
Bernie Sanders is a wack job. The only reason hes saying these things is because a majority of the people in the country are poor and hes trying to buy votes rather than solve the real problems

You know what, he's the only candidate trying to solve the real problems. You should look beyond your personal interests and see what he tries to do, USA is in a dire need of a reconstruction.



Wyrdness said:

It's not legal either as it's a means to not pay taxes which is illegal, it's a loophole and one that many Countries are closing, that salary the company is paying you means little when it's going to be used to pay up for what they owe which increases by the month. As an example you're making them $20 and from that you get $2, they keep $15 and pay $3 tax when they're meant to pay $5, over time what they owe will outweigh what you and anyone else is paid and when the country has to make up the cost that salary you're getting will amount to little just look at Greece.

They have to stop companies avoiding Tax for your sake, do you know what cuts mean to make up costs? It impacts your daily life and often cuts never make up what's owed because cuts may stop an expense going out but when money is being leaked out the system it doesn't remedy the problem which means you yourself will have to pay higher taxes and charges in the end while even after the cuts have been made regardless.

Well since most financial executives aren't getting arrested or businesses getting fined for such it's mostly legal ... loopholes =/= illegal

Salaries mean everything to us when we use it in a lot of our transactions. The owner's will see it fit to pay us for what we're really worth and your example is insane for the most part ... 

Greece's problem has to do with it's borrowing issue, not taxation system. 30% of the countries GDP is purely for tax revenue! 



Jimbo1337 said:
Teeqoz said:
Read up:
https://berniesanders.com/issues/how-bernie-pays-for-his-proposals/

So why is Bernie Sanders raising taxes on the middle class?  

Yup, I'd go so far to say the problem doesn't even lie with high income earners earning 250,000 to 10 million a year.The problem is with the .1 of the top 1%.The billionaires.Rich enough for the best lawyers and accountants.

 

How much tax does Google pay in the USA? Ditto Apple.Mega corporations based in Ireland or other low company tax regions for the sole purpose of avoiding tax.Go after these guys before slugging low and middle earners more.



fatslob-:O said:

Well since most financial executives aren't getting arrested or businesses getting fined for such it's mostly legal ... loopholes =/= illegal

Salaries mean everything to us when we use it in a lot of our transactions. The owner's will see it fit to pay us for what we're really worth and your example is insane for the most part ... 

Greece's problem has to do with it's borrowing issue, not taxation system. 30% of the countries GDP is purely for tax revenue! 

Poor argument as financial executives have been getting away with illegal activities for decades looks at the situation with the banks, no one has gone to jail, finance holds a lot of power over politics and law because they have influence over the flow of money, HSBC the biggest bank in the world were confirmed to be laundering money for criminals, you're naive if you think it's all straight forward. Loopholes aren't legal either hence why they're often closed and you find many businesses do face fines as well for this, the are people who have been convicted for this in the US as well.

You don't seem to get what's said here, that salary you're getting is nothing the only reason you're paid what you are now is because of the law otherwise companies would never pay you no matter how good you are I think you're dreaming here if you think companies will look after you. What is being given to you by one hand is being taken by the other hand, my example highlights this perfectly as what you're being paid is what will go on to pay back the system while they keep a large chunk of the pie scot free, you try to dismiss the example yet have presented nothing that concretely challenges it.

The part about Greece tells me you don't fully know the situation, do you know why Greece borrows so much? It's because of taxes, no one was really paying taxes for decades even to the point of over a century they were lax on taxes so the country's finances had to be made up by borrowing, taxes are what fund developed countries. Heres some knowledge from working inside finance myself in the last century Greece has defaulted 10 times because the has never been strict effort to collect money and evasion of tax was common so any money around was not going into the system. If it weren't for them being in the Euro the other countries in the EU may have even been more harsh in the bailout money terms on what they owe and this is money they have to pay back.

Guess what Greece also did, they imposed a block on all Greek accounts restricting how much anyone and businesses can withdraw to stop what you said businesses would do earlier in trying to leave as they realize they have to start regaining this money, you vastly underestimate how powerful something like taxes can be and what actions will be taken to reclaim it.