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Forums - Gaming - For the love of god Nintendo do not go fancy ass

kooltrex on 16 January 2016

There is a difference between gimmicks and innovation.



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pokoko on 16 January 2016
Darwinianevolution said:

The only difference between gimmicks and innovations is that innovations are kept on the product and become a fundamental part of it. Gimmicks can go and few people will really miss them. Only time will tell what becomes innovation and what is labeled as a fad.

That's sometimes true but not always.  Clear improvements to functionality, for example, such as the jump to 16-bit graphics, are regarded as innovations from the start.

Sometimes gimmicks are planned purely as gimmicks, with the developers well aware they are going down an evolutionary dead end.  More common, as you said, are the occasions when the designers hope a gimmick becomes an innovation.  However, the longer an industry exists, the harder true innovation becomes.

I don't think the D-pad was a gimmick, though, in that it was a move based on functionality rather than marketing strategy.  A gimmick is a marketing focal point used to attract consumers.  I could be wrong but I don't remember Nintendo advertising it in that way.





Low78wagon on 16 January 2016

Stream? Hell no! If anything they should bring carts back. Would be a dream. Carts/cards are in hand helds to this day with great success. I like the GameCube controller but it's not as good as a regular dual analog controller like ps4 or Xbox. Nintendo has great IPs so why can't they sell on that instead of trash nunchucks or goofy game pad/ tablet stuff. nintedos next console........ SUPER NiNTENDO 2..... Uses carts that are pretty much a sd card inside so game patches and updates can be flashed to cartridge.... It also should be grey. One can dream right?



zorg1000 on 16 January 2016
AEGRO said:
zorg1000 said:

 

Nintendo's 2 least successful consoles are ones that utilize a standard dual-analog setup.

 

Nintendo consoles have been selling less than the previous one, obviously except the Wii.

I dont think that regular controllers are the reason tho.

I don't think it's a coincidence that every time Nintendo tries establish new audiences by offering new ways to play in terms of controls & genres that they find success and whenever they try to compete directly for established audiences they fail.





When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

zorg1000 on 16 January 2016
pokoko said:
zorg1000 said:
U do realize NES was a gimmick controller, right? Look up the Coleco Vision, Intellivision, Atari 5200 controller, that's what a standard controller looked like pre-NES.

NES also had the Zapper & R.O.B., gimmick controllers are part of Nintendo's roots.

The D-pad wasn't a gimmick, it was an innovation.  They didn't even want to use it at first, they wanted a traditional joystick, but found the D-pad to be a superior option.  

R.O.B. was a gimmick but it was barely a factor (thought I do remember wondering "WHERE THE HELL IS MY ROBOT" when I got my NES).  The light-gun was also a gimmick, and more of a factor, but it became less of a factor as time went on.  

The big difference is that the NES did not depend on a gimmick the way the Wii U and Wii depended on gimmicks.

NES was absolutely dependant on gimmicks, the only reason most retailers accepted it in the US was because it was marketed as a toy and was bundled with R.O.B.





When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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freebs2 on 16 January 2016
pokoko said:
Darwinianevolution said:

The only difference between gimmicks and innovations is that innovations are kept on the product and become a fundamental part of it. Gimmicks can go and few people will really miss them. Only time will tell what becomes innovation and what is labeled as a fad.

That's sometimes true but not always.  Clear improvements to functionality, for example, such as the jump to 16-bit graphics, are regarded as innovations from the start.

Sometimes gimmicks are planned purely as gimmicks, with the developers well aware they are going down an evolutionary dead end.  More common, as you said, are the occasions when the designers hope a gimmick becomes an innovation.  However, the longer an industry exists, the harder true innovation becomes.

I don't think the D-pad was a gimmick, though, in that it was a move based on functionality rather than marketing strategy.  A gimmick is a marketing focal point used to attract consumers.  I could be wrong but I don't remember Nintendo advertising it in that way.

You are making up definitions. The NES was marketed with the slogan "Now you're playing with power", later Sega used the term "Blast processing" so according to your definition processing power is a gimmick.

What about VR? Was the Virtual Boy a gimmick or an innovation? What about Oculus Rift and Playstation VR? If gimmick and innovation are two seperate concepts then either the Virtual Boy is innovative or Oculus Rift and Playstation VR are gimmicks by definition.





pokoko on 16 January 2016
freebs2 said:
pokoko said:

That's sometimes true but not always.  Clear improvements to functionality, for example, such as the jump to 16-bit graphics, are regarded as innovations from the start.

Sometimes gimmicks are planned purely as gimmicks, with the developers well aware they are going down an evolutionary dead end.  More common, as you said, are the occasions when the designers hope a gimmick becomes an innovation.  However, the longer an industry exists, the harder true innovation becomes.

I don't think the D-pad was a gimmick, though, in that it was a move based on functionality rather than marketing strategy.  A gimmick is a marketing focal point used to attract consumers.  I could be wrong but I don't remember Nintendo advertising it in that way.

You are making up definitions. The NES was marketed with the slogan "Now you're playing with power", later Sega used the term "Blast processing" so according to your definition processing power is a gimmick.

What about VR? Was the Virtual Boy a gimmick or an innovation? What about Oculus Rift and Playstation VR? If gimmick and innovation are two seperate concepts then either the Virtual Boy is innovative or Oculus Rift and Playstation VR are gimmicks by definition.

You do know that an innovation can be marketed as a gimmick, right?  I never said they were mutually exclusive so your point is kind of meaningless.





pokoko on 16 January 2016
zorg1000 said:
pokoko said:

The D-pad wasn't a gimmick, it was an innovation.  They didn't even want to use it at first, they wanted a traditional joystick, but found the D-pad to be a superior option.  

R.O.B. was a gimmick but it was barely a factor (thought I do remember wondering "WHERE THE HELL IS MY ROBOT" when I got my NES).  The light-gun was also a gimmick, and more of a factor, but it became less of a factor as time went on.  

The big difference is that the NES did not depend on a gimmick the way the Wii U and Wii depended on gimmicks.

NES was absolutely dependant on gimmicks, the only reason most retailers accepted it in the US was because it was marketed as a toy and was bundled with R.O.B.

You and I played with different NES systems, then, because I don't remember many of my games not working because I didn't have a ROB.  It's pretty clear that it wasn't a Wii U situation where they cannot remove the game-pad because many of the games are dependent on the gimmick.





zorg1000 on 16 January 2016
pokoko said:
zorg1000 said:

NES was absolutely dependant on gimmicks, the only reason most retailers accepted it in the US was because it was marketed as a toy and was bundled with R.O.B.

You and I played with different NES systems, then, because I don't remember many of my games not working because I didn't have a ROB.  It's pretty clear that it wasn't a Wii U situation where they cannot remove the game-pad because many of the games are dependent on the gimmick.

 


Without R.O.B. many retailers would not have stocked NES, that means that the success of NES was directly dependant on a gimmick.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

pokoko on 16 January 2016
zorg1000 said:
pokoko said:

You and I played with different NES systems, then, because I don't remember many of my games not working because I didn't have a ROB.  It's pretty clear that it wasn't a Wii U situation where they cannot remove the game-pad because many of the games are dependent on the gimmick.

 


Without R.O.B. many retailers would not have stocked NES, that means that the success of NES was directly dependant on a gimmick.

You and I seem to be talking about two different things.