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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - So, 13 seconds footage for Zelda HD during 2015...

 

Is that enough footage?

Yes 96 26.52%
 
No 266 73.48%
 
Total:362
Miyamotoo on 22 December 2015
curl-6 said:
Miyamotoo said:

-Zelda OoT is first 3D Zelda and one of the best games ever and that certainly affected sales. Fact.

-Zelda MM also had more "serious graphics" like OoT and was released on same console, sold much worse than OoT and ended up like one of worst selling home console Zelda. Fact.

-TP was launch title on best selling Nintendo console ever and that certainly affected sales. Fact.

-WW wasn't launch title, and sold 4.5m on instal base of 22m. Fact.

All this are facts.

 

Of Course that "serious" graphics are today way more popular, but that doesn't mean that game that looks different and unique and dont have same graphics like every other game will sell worse, on contrary, I think it will sell better. Zelda is same like other Nintendo games but on even more higher level, very unique, different and you dont have nothing similar on market.

And you again totaly ignored what I wrote, today almost all games have "serious graphics" on much stronger hardwares than Nintendos (I am including PC too), it would be impossible for Nintendo to top those "serious graphics" and make something that looks very good and attractive for today standards, but Zelda U art style basically top all non "serious" graphics, looks beautiful, very unique and attractive, and that's what exactly Nintendo wants to achieve with every main 3D Zelda game.

Ocarina being "one of the best games ever" is by definition just an opinion, since "best" is subjective matter.

So you admit that cartoon graphics are less popular. It is therefore bad business and frankly straight-up idiocy to handicap Zelda's appeal with a non-mainstream art style. Gamers don't want "unique". Gamers don't want cartoons.

No, that is also a fact.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_considered_the_best

http://www.metacritic.com/browse/games/score/metascore/all/all/filtered

 

 

I wrote what I meant, and no, gamers don't want only "serious graphics" and same graphic all the time, they also want something unique and different.

And you again completely ignored fact that Zelda with "serious graphics" (espacily on Wii U) wouldnt look good at all for today standards, while Zelda U looks great for today standards. Those mainstreams you referred to, would look at Zelda U with "serious graphics" and said this dont look good at all because they have so many game that looks so much better, while those same mainstream said for Zelda U "cartoon" art style, this looks different and interesting.



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zorg1000 on 22 December 2015
AZWification said:

It's silly to think that TP's sales weren't affected at all by being a launch title on what was an extremely popular console in 2006-2009. I guess Super Paper Mario sold much better than the other games because hardcore fans really loved the type of game SPM was ( they didn't, lol), and it had nothing to do with it coming out a few months later after the Wii's launch.

 

Certainly it was a factor but with a series like Zelda that has a very strong dedicated following, install base doesn't matter nearly as much as a more kid/family/casual focused game would, like Super Paper Mario was. U can see that LttP & WW sold pretty identical despite being on platforms with over 2x difference same goes for OoT/MM & TP/SS, the N64 & Wii Zelda titles sold similar numbers despite Wii having 3x the install base.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

curl-6 on 22 December 2015
Miyamotoo said:

Ocarina being "one of the best games ever" is by definition just an opinion, since "best" is subjective matter.

So you admit that cartoon graphics are less popular. It is therefore bad business and frankly straight-up idiocy to handicap Zelda's appeal with a non-mainstream art style. Gamers don't want "unique". Gamers don't want cartoons.

No, that is also fact.

http://www.metacritic.com/browse/games/score/metascore/all/all/filtered

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_considered_the_best

I wrote what I meant, and no, gamers don't want only "serious graphics" and same graphic all the time, they also want something unique and different.

And you again completely ignored fact that Zelda with "serious graphics" (espacily on Wii U) wouldnt look good at all for today standards, while Zelda U looks great for today standards. Those mainstreams you referred to, would look at Zelda U with "serious graphics" and said this dont look good at all because they have so many game that looks so much better, while those same mainstream said for Zelda U "cartoon" art style, this looks different and interesting.

Reviews are not facts. They are opinions.

And that's the thing, mainstream gamers don't want "unique" or "different" or "interesting".  

Having a more mainstream art style doesn't mean photorealism. Darker aesthetics can still be stylized. It just can't look like a childen's cartoon if you want anyone outside of the Nintendo fanbase to take it seriously.



zorg1000 on 22 December 2015
curl-6 said:
Miyamotoo said:
curl-6 said:

That's not saying much as WW was widely ridiculed after its reveal due to its art style.

Zelda U is a hyped game among the Nintendo hardcore like you and me, but in terms of the industry as a whole, its hype level is relatively low. Most gamers are far more excited about the likes of Uncharted 4, Final Fantasy 15, FF7 Remake, etc, and don't give a hoot about a cartoon game on a platform they don't care about, especially one that has bugger all shown of it.

True, but later after people actually played game become one of the most loved Zelda game and ended up with sale of 4.5m on small GC instal base, and today people think that WW art style and game itself are great.

No, game isnt hype only among Nintendo hardcore fans, its hyped among regular Nintendo fans too. And like I wrote those who are not very hyped (Nintendo and Zelda fans are very hyped), are very aware of Zelda U game.

 Nintendo fans aren't that big a group any more, as evidenced by Wii U's sales. Why restrict Zelda's appeal to a limited audience when you could reach a broader audience by taking the series back to the style of its most popular entries? It's just bad business to handicap one of your key franchises that way.

 

I don't really buy the argument that the number of people who are interested in Nintendo IP has gone down significantly, I don't think Wii U is proof that people no longer like Nintendo, more like when Nintendo doesn't adapt to certain changes in the market and makes a plethora of mistakes than their platform will suffer which means Nintendo IP won't reach their potential sales.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

curl-6 on 22 December 2015
zorg1000 said:

I don't really buy the argument that the number of people who are interested in Nintendo IP has gone down significantly, I don't think Wii U is proof that people no longer like Nintendo, more like when Nintendo doesn't adapt to certain changes in the market and makes a plethora of mistakes than their platform will suffer which means Nintendo IP won't reach their potential sales.

That's the thing though, it isn't just their hardware that has failed to adapt to the market, but their software as well.

People still want Mario Kart and Smash Bros, but they no longer want an almost entirely E-rated lineup. They want more diversity than that, yet Nintendo's output remains extremely homogenous.



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Miyamotoo on 22 December 2015
curl-6 said:
Miyamotoo said:

Ocarina being "one of the best games ever" is by definition just an opinion, since "best" is subjective matter.

So you admit that cartoon graphics are less popular. It is therefore bad business and frankly straight-up idiocy to handicap Zelda's appeal with a non-mainstream art style. Gamers don't want "unique". Gamers don't want cartoons.

No, that is also fact.

http://www.metacritic.com/browse/games/score/metascore/all/all/filtered

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_games_considered_the_best

I wrote what I meant, and no, gamers don't want only "serious graphics" and same graphic all the time, they also want something unique and different.

And you again completely ignored fact that Zelda with "serious graphics" (espacily on Wii U) wouldnt look good at all for today standards, while Zelda U looks great for today standards. Those mainstreams you referred to, would look at Zelda U with "serious graphics" and said this dont look good at all because they have so many game that looks so much better, while those same mainstream said for Zelda U "cartoon" art style, this looks different and interesting.

Reviews are not facts. They are opinions.

And that's the thing, mainstream gamers don't want "unique" or "different" or "interesting".  

Having a more mainstream art style doesn't mean photorealism. Darker aesthetics can still be stylized. It just can't look like a childen's cartoon if you want anyone outside of the Nintendo fanbase to take it seriously.

Fact is that OoT is game with highest revives in history of gaming and that is widely considered by players too like one of the best games ever. But you can still denied that fact.

"Darker aesthetics that can still be styled" again wouldnt be "serious graphics" like we having today. Like I wrote, gamers don't want only "serious graphics" and same graphic all the time, they also want something unique and different. I saw so many comments and opinions of non Nintendo or Zelda fans about Zelda U art style, almost all were saying that looks beautiful. And Zelda U art style is not exactly children's cartoon, Wind Waker is children's cartoon, Zelda U art style is far more advanced and more appeling.





Miyamotoo on 22 December 2015
curl-6 said:
zorg1000 said:

I don't really buy the argument that the number of people who are interested in Nintendo IP has gone down significantly, I don't think Wii U is proof that people no longer like Nintendo, more like when Nintendo doesn't adapt to certain changes in the market and makes a plethora of mistakes than their platform will suffer which means Nintendo IP won't reach their potential sales.

That's the thing though, it isn't just their hardware that has failed to adapt to the market, but their software as well.

People still want Mario Kart and Smash Bros, but they no longer want an almost entirely E-rated lineup. They want more diversity than that, yet Nintendo's output remains extremely homogenous.

You mean that same software that very critically acclaimed, that won prizes and that is selling like hot cake!? That's not true at all, point is that nobody wants Wii U because its totaly failed platform, not because Mario Kart and Smash Bros. are still E rated.





curl-6 on 22 December 2015
Miyamotoo said:

Fact is that OoT is game with highest revives in history of gaming and that is widely considered by players too like one of the best games ever. But you can still denied that fact.

"Darker aesthetics that can still be styled" again wouldnt be "serious graphics" like we having today. Like I wrote, gamers don't want only "serious graphics" and same graphic all the time, they also want something unique and different. I saw so many comments and opinions of non Nintendo or Zelda fans about Zelda U art style, almost all were saying that looks beautiful. And Zelda U art style is not exactly children's cartoon, Wind Waker is children's cartoon, Zelda U art style is far more advanced and more appeling.

 The opinions of players and reviewers are still opinions though. "Best" is a matter of opinion, not fact. I think Ocarina is one of the best games ever made myself, but I know that's still just my opinion.

Zelda U's art style definitely has more appeal to the mainstream than Wind Waker's, I agree, but something along the lines of this would have a lot more:



curl-6 on 22 December 2015
Miyamotoo said:
curl-6 said:
zorg1000 said:

I don't really buy the argument that the number of people who are interested in Nintendo IP has gone down significantly, I don't think Wii U is proof that people no longer like Nintendo, more like when Nintendo doesn't adapt to certain changes in the market and makes a plethora of mistakes than their platform will suffer which means Nintendo IP won't reach their potential sales.

That's the thing though, it isn't just their hardware that has failed to adapt to the market, but their software as well.

People still want Mario Kart and Smash Bros, but they no longer want an almost entirely E-rated lineup. They want more diversity than that, yet Nintendo's output remains extremely homogenous.

You mean that same software that very critically acclaimed, that won prizes and that is selling like hot cake!? That's not true at all, point is that nobody wants Wii U because its totaly failed platform, not because Mario Kart and Smash Bros. are still E rated.

Nintendo's software output is extremely lacking in variety. It's fine to make some E-rated games like Kart and Smash, but you need to balance it out with games like Uncharted, Halo, Gears of War, or The Last of Us.



Miyamotoo on 22 December 2015
zorg1000 said:
AZWification said:

It's silly to think that TP's sales weren't affected at all by being a launch title on what was an extremely popular console in 2006-2009. I guess Super Paper Mario sold much better than the other games because hardcore fans really loved the type of game SPM was ( they didn't, lol), and it had nothing to do with it coming out a few months later after the Wii's launch.

 

Certainly it was a factor but with a series like Zelda that has a very strong dedicated following, install base doesn't matter nearly as much as a more kid/family/casual focused game would, like Super Paper Mario was. U can see that LttP & WW sold pretty identical despite being on platforms with over 2x difference same goes for OoT/MM & TP/SS, the N64 & Wii Zelda titles sold similar numbers despite Wii having 3x the install base.

Whole this talk about sales started because some people dont think Zelda U cant have similar sales numbers to OoT and TP totally ignoring that game will probably be launch on two platforms, that is first HD, true open Zelda with biggest world ever and like it seems one of the best Zelda ever, because don't have "realistic art style". And also main point for that same people why OoT and TP saled so well is beacuse of that same "realistic art style" again complelty ignoring facts that OoT sold so much because was first 3D Zelda and probably best game ever (MM with similar art style is worst selling Zelda), while TP sold because was launch title on best selling Nintendo console ever.