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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Phil Spencer hopes VR isn't the future of gaming.

Breaking news from Sony - PSVR has been renamed to PS notVR. Shuhei said to nobody "We decided that due to PSVR not being a souped up version of the Holodecks from Star Trek, calling it this would be false advertising." Phil Spencer also confirmed that notVR might well be the future, so he is now a little bit worried, and will be bringing out his own notVR devices sometime in 2016.



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Nem said:
Normchacho said:


That's correct, VR has been around at least as a concept since the 1950's. The first VR HMD actually game out in 1961 and was called Headsight. The VR we see today is an evolution of that same principle, which predates the Holodeck by more than a decade. So what we are getting today is most certainly VR.


Your "That's correct" is illogical. You article is a contest of "who thought up first". There is no way to verify that. I am assuming these people have wrote books in wich they envisioned these things, wich i'm not even sure. At wich point, its what i said in the first place. Even the concept itself you linked on the article, i already disputed as its not correspondant to what we have in these "new" devices. So, its not VR.

And ofc the first VR set that came out was what could be made. I wouldnt expect "the real thing" to have come out and us not knowing about it. This VR headset thing has been tried time and time again. Its sort of like 3D. The fad that comes and goes.

But you know... i feel like i am hurting sensibilities by beeing so blunt and honest about what i think this truly is (perhaps cause i already experienced this cycle come and go before). I don't mean to destroy dreams. If this is the VR you envisioned, then i am happy for you and for all of you that are happy with it. Props to you guys and hope you enjoy it.


Then i guess 3D isn't really 3D. Because it isn't really three dimensional, but only a illusion of three dimensional space. And the real 3D is real life, which comes and goes... so to say.



Hunting Season is done...

walsufnir said:
TheObserver said:
All of Microsoft wishes a lot of things these days, mostly cause every product they make is getting stomped by someone or another.


But that doesn't mean the products are worse. That said, Windows is still by far market leader, doesn't make it the best os out there.


Windows is the Market leader because of the corporate sector, where the boss doesn't want to spend the money to getsomething else and then train the employees to use that different OS. As far the consumers go who can make their own choices none of MS products are popular.



LSD, the closest we will ever get to holodecks.



Normchacho said:
Nem said:


Your "That's correct" is illogical. You article is a contest of "who thought up first". There is no way to verify that. I am assuming these people have wrote books in wich they envisioned these things, wich i'm not even sure. At wich point, its what i said in the first place. Even the concept itself you linked on the article, i already disputed as its not correspondant to what we have in these "new" devices. So, its not VR.

And ofc the first VR set that came out was what could be made. I wouldnt expect "the real thing" to have come out and us not knowing about it. This VR headset thing has been tried time and time again. Its sort of like 3D. The fad that comes and goes.

But you know... i feel like i am hurting sensibilities by beeing so blunt and honest about what i think this truly is (perhaps cause i already experienced this cycle come and go before). I don't mean to destroy dreams. If this is the VR you envisioned, then i am happy for you and for all of you that are happy with it. Props to you guys and hope you enjoy it.

Haha peoples issue with your point of view has nothing to do with you being blunt or honest. It's because you are being amazingly obtuse and the very premise of your assertion is just incorrect.

You seem to be under the notion that simply because modern VR isn't the ultimate expression of what VR can be, that it isn't VR at all. That's like saying that the International Space Station isn't a space station at all because it isn't the Death Star.

The current form of VR meets the definitons of what VR is. That's it, that's really the whole argument that needs to be had. Does what he have now meet the definition of VR? Currently, yes.


It is obtuse to say that aswell then. You obviously have the same stance.

Is handball, football? Because its played with a ball aswell? Its 20% football right? That is just ridiculous. No, its not football at all.

And i obviously totally disagree. But if its VR as you see it, then enjoy. Stop trying to tell me its true VR though, because i will not agree with that. 20% VR isnt VR to me, just like 20% football isnt football. Its handball.

Zoombael said:
 


Then i guess 3D isn't really 3D. Because it isn't really three dimensional, but only a illusion of three dimensional space. And the real 3D is real life, which comes and goes... so to say.


3D is simply the perception of depth. The 3D on say the 3DS for example is an illusion, but it accomplishes its purpose as its advertised.

Virtual reality as the name implies is an Illusion of reality. Something alot more difficult to accomplish. It can't be accomplished without a full illusion. You have to be able to touch, fool the sense of touch, you have to be able to smell, to taste. We currently only have sound and image with the perception of depth. The new devices simply isolate your sight so you can more easily focus on it. Its not adding anything we didnt have already. They are simply strapping it to our faces, just like have done in the past. They grab the current techbnology and strap it to your head and call it VR.

If its good for some, as i say, props to them. For me, its not, and thats that.



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Stereoscopic 3D is much superior to VR, it solves all the shutting-out problems Phil is talking about. Yet where is 3D today, for all it's awesomeness? VR is a fad, it will go away as soon as it comes. There will be (are) people who are nutso crazy about about, there will be people who will use it all their lives (similarly with me and 3D, it seems), but for the vast majority, it's a fad. A fad's fad. A fad's fad fad.



LemonSlice said:
Stereoscopic 3D is much superior to VR, it solves all the shutting-out problems Phil is talking about. Yet where is 3D today, for all it's awesomeness? VR is a fad, it will go away as soon as it comes. There will be (are) people who are nutso crazy about about, there will be people who will use it all their lives (similarly with me and 3D, it seems), but for the vast majority, it's a fad. A fad's fad. A fad's fad fad.


3D tv really only provides a minor improvement to a normal experience. You get a increase in depth, but it's not huge and your FOV doesn't change at all. The general response of pretty much everyone I've ever seen try 3D tv is "oh...cool". Simply put, 3D tv just isn't a very impressive experience.

VR on the other hand, is an immensely impressive experience. I'm not saying VR will see huge mainstream success overnight, but it is a good enough experience and a good enough product on it's own to be worthwhile. It also already has a significantley more robust web of support as far as content goes than 3D ever had.

It will take time for VR to catch on, and I think mobile VR will be the type that brings the most people on board, but comparions to 3D tv are very shortsighted.



Bet with Adamblaziken:

I bet that on launch the Nintendo Switch will have no built in in-game voice chat. He bets that it will. The winner gets six months of avatar control over the other user.

Nem said:
Normchacho said:



It is obtuse to say that aswell then. You obviously have the same stance.

Is handball, football? Because its played with a ball aswell? Its 20% football right? That is just ridiculous. No, its not football at all.

And i obviously totally disagree. But if its VR as you see it, then enjoy. Stop trying to tell me its true VR though, because i will not agree with that. 20% VR isnt VR to me, just like 20% football isnt football. Its handball.


That's a bad analogy. Handball doesn't meet the definition of Football. The HMDs coming later this year and next year fit the definition of VR.

It's not just VR to me, it's VR. It is by definition VR. It would be one thing if you had simply said that it's not what you envision when you think of VR, but you didn't just do that. You insisted that because it didn't fit your personal vision of VR that it wasn't VR at all. Even going as far as saying that the people and companies who are working on VR know that it isn't really VR and that they are knowingly lieing to us. "They are trying to sell a lie and they know it"



Bet with Adamblaziken:

I bet that on launch the Nintendo Switch will have no built in in-game voice chat. He bets that it will. The winner gets six months of avatar control over the other user.

Normchacho said:
Nem said:

 

It is obtuse to say that aswell then. You obviously have the same stance.

Is handball, football? Because its played with a ball aswell? Its 20% football right? That is just ridiculous. No, its not football at all.

And i obviously totally disagree. But if its VR as you see it, then enjoy. Stop trying to tell me its true VR though, because i will not agree with that. 20% VR isnt VR to me, just like 20% football isnt football. Its handball.


That's a bad analogy. Handball doesn't meet the definition of Football. The HMDs coming later this year and next year fit the definition of VR.

It's not just VR to me, it's VR. It is by definition VR. It would be one thing if you had simply said that it's not what you envision when you think of VR, but you didn't just do that. You insisted that because it didn't fit your personal vision of VR that it wasn't VR at all. Even going as far as saying that the people and companies who are working on VR know that it isn't really VR and that they are knowingly lieing to us. "They are trying to sell a lie and they know it"


Whatever you want to call it. 20% VR, 40% VR, still isnt VR. Its exactly 20% or 40% VR. If that is good enough for you and you are good with calling it VR like its 100% VR, its your opinion.

the-pi-guy said:
Nem said:


3D is simply the perception of depth. The 3D on say the 3DS for example is an illusion, but it accomplishes its purpose as its advertised.

Virtual reality as the name implies is an Illusion of reality. Something alot more difficult to accomplish. It can't be accomplished without a full illusion. You have to be able to touch, fool the sense of touch, you have to be able to smell, to taste. We currently only have sound and image with the perception of depth. The new devices simply isolate your sight so you can more easily focus on it. Its not adding anything we didnt have already. They are simply strapping it to our faces, just like have done in the past. They grab the current techbnology and strap it to your head and call it VR.

If its good for some, as i say, props to them. For me, its not, and thats that.

You've used it?  

I've read articles that certain gameplay elements had to be removed because they were too realistic.  If that isn't giving the illusion of reality, then I don't know what would.  We certainly need to add smell and taste, but like I said touch is there in some aspect.  

Besides that, visual is what makes up most of the senses.  

It most certainly is adding something that we haven't seen.  

I'm going to take the word of what people who have actually used it and said, over yours.  

 

I don't know what you mean Pi. Touch certainly isnt there. Unless you consider it the controller. But you aren't feeling anything but the buttons.

As for people overeacting, theres always someone. I imagine it will be even worse when it releases.



Nem said: 

Whatever you want to call it. 20% VR, 40% VR, still isnt VR. Its exactly 20% or 40% VR. If that is good enough for you and you are good with calling it VR like its 100% VR, its your opinion.

No no, you have that backwards. It is by definition 100% VR, you are just allowed to keep thinking it's not. Just be aware that you are making the conscious choice to remain ignorant.



Bet with Adamblaziken:

I bet that on launch the Nintendo Switch will have no built in in-game voice chat. He bets that it will. The winner gets six months of avatar control over the other user.