Struck a nerve did I?

I'm a layman in terms of hardware too, no need to get upset about it. It's okay to be a layman. Just don't pretend to understand things you don't. 

No, my argument in that thread was they don't understand the audience, they are targetting the wrong people...a rather small subsection of the actual audience. Well I can't exactly debate MS can I? Nothing hypocritical about it.

This is real life mate. The medium isn't face to face, but I can assure you I'd be saying the same things in that regard.

I agree.

Matter of oppinion :)

I think you misunderstand the situation.  I don't think it is a belief that this will happen.

It's that every fucking thread about the Xbox One gets inundated with people who have no intentions of buying the console, don't want to buy one, or would never buy one that come in and just kill any kind of conversation.

So instead of getting thoughtful discussions of how this may or may not be plausible, we get "Impossible", "Wrong", "It won't happen.", "They don't know what they're talking about.", "They're lying.", etc.  With no credible basis for the contrary argument. 

Everyone has an opinion.  No one cares if someone has the opinion that it will or won't happen.  Opinions are worthless without something more credible or substantial.  The point of these threads, about rumors, isn't that as uninformed people we get to "call" whether a rumor is true or not.  The point of a rumor thread is to speculate on how something is or isn't possible.  If you let a thread like this just live, it'll eventually come to a conclusion.  Most often the reality.  Attempt to shut down any discussion, and it causes people to retreat to their camps, dig in, and fight.

The fight in this thread and others isn't about whether this is true or not.  The fight in this thread is about allowing a community of people on this forum to have conversations without having to listen to a bunch of people tell us their opinions and how important their opinions are.

Bottom line, if people come into an Xbox thread, they better be prepared to defend their opinion if it attempts to shut down conversation.

To quote Gold Leader:  "Stay on target.  Stay on target."

Hope is a powerful thing. If the SDF can squash any sense of pride or hope for the X1 than they feel they won. This is probably a new way to market for Sony. Since a lot of people will be missing out on commercials with regular TV dieing off forum guerilla warfare tactics will suffice. Plant the seed of doubt and suspicion and watch hope and reasonable conversation die. Soon most of these forums will be a lot quieter when the new machines come out and everyone will be too busy playing. The SDF won't have an audience then.

If we look / read what Albert Penello say about the consoles specs....he is pretty much accepting that in paper or in individual hardware specs PS4 has the lead (Maybe MS has some secret sauce IDK) ....And he is pretty much confident about how a balanced, optimized and good Devs can make the system outperform another with better specs (I agree with him 100000%). But them you read some comments in Gaf about how MS has the Best Programmers and Dev in the entire Universe and Beyond and all DirectX BS..... And make me ask...Ok but where are they?....because this gen SONY studios and first party make them look pretty bad...from Killzone 2 to the Last Of Us SONY exclusive software has been killing any MS game in the Technical department....Panello is wrong about how games on X360 look the same or better than PS3....


He is right about how the weaker system well balanced with good developers can at the end be the most powerful...MS work to eliminate the bottlenecks and provide Dev tools to take advantage of Xone Hard, But SONY is doing the same....

XOne is a great machine nobody can deny it and like Panello say at the end is all about the game...but the HW specs did matter....

To me the difference on Xone and PS4 will be pretty much like we have right now between 360 and ps3 is not a Big gap but is noticeable.

Is pretty  obvius tha MS is Doing his PR work  talking about the 30% of power and stuff like SONY do.

Sorry if my english isn't good enough :P

I think the point they should theoretically have more wiggle room to upclock through firmware after launch is actually a very good one, and I think it's a very likely possibility if it turns out there is no additional discreet GPU after all.

The problem though, is that even a GPU clock up to 1000mhz would only bring it up to  1.53 Tflops, they would have to bring it all the way up to 1200mhz to match the PS4 before any upclocking. Considering the PS4 is supposedly running cooler than the PS3 Slim itself with better ventelation, just being able to upclock one quarter as much as the One assuming it could even reach 1200mhz would bring the PS4 GPU up to 2.07 Tflops at 900mhz (where as the One would need to be at 1350mhz to match that).

Honestly though, probably the even bigger problem for Microsoft, assuming they don't have a 2nd GPU, is the PS4's massive GPGPU advantage architecture wise, and is why the One having a stronger CPU is so needed. PS4 has 8 ACEs/64 queues. AMD's HD8000 series GPUs have a maximum of 4 ACEs/ 32 queues (that is, even the HD8990 can only be half as good as the otherwise meh PS4 GPU in this regard). Xbox One has 2 ACEs with something between 2 or 16 queues. I can't tell for sure since Microsoft doesn't go into detail on this topic.

Nice explanation

So the Xbox One casing is very hollow?  Usually when there is a hardware redesign, the components get smaller and more efficient.  Not the other way around.